Everyone has failed: the EU representatives, the US State Department with its Victoria “Fuck the EU” Nuland, the Yanukovych government, its political opponents, and the Kremin. And now they are all in shock and nobody knows what to do. Except for the protesters, who do know what to do: continue to protest. Most of them don’t even know what it is they are protesting, but, in essence, they are protesting the very existence of their country, which is made up of two parts: Eastern Poland, which is Ukrainian-speaking and predominantly Catholic, and Western Russia, which is Russian-speaking and predominantly Orthodox. The “Russians” outnumber the “Ukrainians” two to one. The ultimate resolution to the crisis lies in partitioning the country. Nobody has the stomach to even talk about it—yet. But until that happens we will continue being subjected to this strange spectacle, where every single actor in Ukraine does everything possible to undermine the country’s political system. Deep down, the Ukrainians don’t want there to be a different government in Kiev—they don’t want there to be a government in Kiev at all.

I now turn it over to Andrey Tymofeiuk, a Kiev resident who posted the following on his Facebook page, in obscenity-riddled Russian. (The Russian language is remarkably rich in obscenities, which pack tremendous expressive power but don’t translate into English with its paltry collection of four-letter words.) I think he provided a good, information-rich summary of the situation from all the angles, his graduate-level potty-mouth notwithstanding, so please give him props. Translation and clean-up are mine.

I think that the current situation is such that everyone is in terrible shock over what’s happening.

The EU representatives are shocked most of all. They were playing at being skillful diplomats, who stooped to work with the barbarous dictator of a third-world country. He was supposed to quiver with anticipation over his handout, in the form of an EU-Ukraine Association Agreement, which would have allowed him to don the mantle of the great Euro-integrator and win the 2015 elections.

Gazing down from their lofty diplomatic perch, these experts were blindsided when the barbarous dictator suddenly decided to do a bit of arithmetic, spotted a flaw in the deal (Ukrainian national bankruptcy) and swiftly decided to take his 46 million slaves away from the EU and give them to Moscow instead. And then, due to their ridiculous bureaucracy and complete lack of understanding of Ukrainian reality, they allowed an initially peaceful protest to develop into something like civil war.

The EU representatives really don’t need a bloody quagmire with a humanitarian crisis, hundreds of thousands of refugees, terrorist attacks, tanks on the streets and other such joys, and they will try to do all they can to prevent it, even if this means that the thick-headed barbarous dictator has to stay in power. But the problem is that the barbarous dictator seems to have lost his mind.

Now the EU representatives will have to answer some very difficult questions from television viewers back home. Such as: “Why are the people waving EU flags wearing Nazi emblems? Are we supporting Nazis?” or “If they are peaceful, then why are they throwing Molotov cocktails at policemen and taking them hostage?” That’s just for starters. Here is a more serious question: “Do we really want 46 million of these violent barbarians to join the EU?” And how about this one: “What makes you think that the five Ukrainian nuclear power plants will remain safe if the country falls into chaos?” Just one more, but it’s a doosie: “If Ukraine becomes ungovernable, how are we going to get our fix of Russian natural gas next winter? Are we going to freeze to death?” But the EU representatives may not have to field such questions much longer because their diplomatic careers may be at an end. After all, they haven’t been too effective, have they? To transform a perfectly peaceful protest into a bloody mess is not exactly the pinnacle of European diplomacy. A few mid-level al Qaeda operatives could have managed the job just as well.

Ukrainian opposition leaders are in shock as well. They were all ready to use the energy of the demonstrators to advance their own political ambitions—but now these ambitions seem rather beside the point. They are politicians, not field commanders, and now they don’t know what to do. Their task is an immensely intricate one: on the one hand, they must act like ardent revolutionaries, or the crowd will turn against them, haul them off the podium and string them up; on the other hand, they have to placate the Europeans and somehow make them believe that they still have influence, that this is still a peaceful protest, and that they are not leading illegal combatants to overthrow lawful authority, but legitimate, peaceful protesters. They still hope that the Europeans will give them jobs in the new puppet government once this is all over. So far, this is not working, and they themselves no longer believe that they are in control of anything. They sign agreements to end hostilities, and hostilities continue.

The barbarous dictator, Yanukovych, is in shock too. His luck has been quite good until now, but has suddenly run out. He rose from low ranks, became one of the kingpins of the Donbass region, survived the collapse of 2004 and then got rich and built himself a palatial estate complete with a Solid Gold Toilet. Up until now he had several different ways of winning the elections in 2015. After that, he could have borrowed a page from Lukashenko’s playbook and fashioned himself into Ukraine’s president-for-life. But now that dream is gone.

He had a couple of chances to resolve the situation, but he made missteps, constantly listening to the hard-liners in his administration, and now the situation is serious and his options quite limited. After the events of February 18 there is no way for him to even claim to be a caretaker president, in power until the 2015 elections. His special forces can’t disperse the protesters. He was counting on Putin’s help, but Putin is less than pleased with his avarice and stupidity, and is noncommittal even about granting him asylum should he need to escape from Kiev. Plus, he’d be leaving behind the Solid Gold Toilet. But if he sticks around the people might hang him. He has gone from trying to survive the next election to trying to survive until the next election.

The administration’s hard-liners are in shock too. They sincerely believed that all they have to do is wave some night-sticks and the crowds will disperse. They trucked in special forces, traffic cops, criminals under their control, assorted zombie idiots, and ordered them all to attack the protesters. They tried it once—nothing; tried it again—still nothing. Protesters aren’t dispersing. Just the opposite: the more they beat on the protesters, the more their numbers grow and the more violent their tactics become. Once they saw an armored personnel carrier —a symbol of their invincibility—engulfed in flames, their hands started to shake. They don’t think that Yanukovych will abandon them, but what can he do? Order in the army? But the army people haven’t been placated with special privileges like the special forces and the police, don’t have much to lose, and could easily cross over to the other side.

The special forces are in even greater shock. A lot of them also worked as policemen, happily beating up football hooligans and collecting bribes from businessmen. And now they are confronted with a most unwelcome situation: the hooligans and the businessmen are united against them. In the beginning it was fun for them—beat on defenseless people in the center of Kiev, receive medals and money, and go home. But things have dragged on and on. The the stupider ones (the majority) are now furious, can’t understand why they haven’t been ordered to just shoot everyone, and think that Yanukovych is a sissy. The smarter ones (the minority) understand full well how dangerous that would be. First of all, success is not guaranteed and losses are likely to be high on both sides—but they have no desire to lay down their lives in defence of the Solid Gold Toilet. Second, even if they manage to suppress and disperse the protesters, the day after that they would start getting killed off one by one, because there exists a database with their names and addresses. Unlike the higher-ups in the administration, they won’t have the chance to flee abroad, and will stay to experience popular anger firsthand. They really want Yanukovych to magically return the situation to the way it was before, but the probability of this happening is dropping every day.

The Kremlin is in a bit of shock as well. They were carefully masterminding the situation, supporting the Donbass thugs, gradually ramping up their influence in Ukraine and buying up key stocks. They were methodically planning to annex half of Ukraine as a “voluntary incorporation.” But then this idiot Yanukovych started giving them a hard time trying to extort money in return for joining the Customs Union, and then he made a series of mistakes leading to the current disaster—in the middle of the Winter Olympics in Sochi, no less! The right thing to do would be to send tank columns into Donbass and Crimea, but that would put a damper on the Olympics. Plus, nothing is ready—Ukraine is not tiny Georgia, and a beautiful textbook military operation would not be possible without preparation. And a less-than-stylish military operation could lead to visa problems and international banking difficulties for the Russian leadership at a minimum, and World War III at a maximum.

The Kremlin’s propaganda people are observing the formation of the contemporary Ukrainian nation right on the streets of Kiev, and they are crying bloody tears. How are they going to be able to explain to these people that their country is not Ukraine but “Little Russia,” that their national language is made up, and that they should come home to Mother Russia and start sending their taxes to Moscow? More importantly, what about the average Russian, who is used to thinking that “nothing can be done” but is now seeing right on his television screen how for three months now special forces, armed to the teeth, haven’t been able to do much of anything to put down a ragtag mob of provincials? Thoughts are starting to course through his brain—dangerous thoughts. And the average Belarussian is even further ahead in his thinking. He has stopped looking at the television screen, has walked over to the window, and is looking at the door of the nearest government office, where local officials recently beat a bribe out of him.

The Americans and the Brits are also in shock. They couldn’t possibly care any less about the sufferings of the Ukrainian aborigines. All they care about is that Russia doesn’t grow stronger. Until recently Yanukovych seemed like a pleasant sort of dictator—not too accommodating toward the Russians, and willing to talk business with the West, about shale gas and other natural resources in particular. But now there’s a bloody mess, with Molotov cocktails, troop carriers on fire, catapults, snipers… They could dismiss Yanukovych, but then who would honor all the agreements and contracts he has signed? And who will they talk business with? The guerilla warrior nationalists from The Right Sector? The club-wielding Cossacks? And what if the Russians achieve some kind of breakthrough, absorb Russian-speaking Eastern Ukraine into the Russian Federation, and grow even stronger?

Even China has something to think about. China has its own interests in Crimea, and is not so much shocked as perplexed: why can’t the local barbarian put down his opponents? There was a similar problem in China in 1989 on Tiananmen square, but there they mowed down hundreds of unarmed students without any undue excess of emotion and it was all over quickly. The West grumbled for a bit, but then resumed economic cooperation as if nothing happened. The Chinese can’t grasp why this dictator can’t do the totally obvious thing, but in general they don’t care. Ukraine is far away, and they have no desire to play a part in Eastern European conflicts. They have more important things to think about, like winning every single medal at the Olympic games in 2016 and putting a red flag on Mars.

The active population of Kiev has been in shock for a few months now, continuously, more and more every day. But at some point shock was replaced with active enthusiasm: it is better to go carry medicine to the wounded and to hurl shingles at police on Independence Square than to watch horrors unfold on television.

The passive population of Kiev is still quietly drinking beer and poking around with social networking apps. They don’t understand what’s happening yet. But if the unofficial state of emergency (including limitations on access to the city) last a few more days—and food and drink running out—then they will end up in a state of shock more serious than anything they have ever experienced.

So, who isn’t in shock? I saw him today on Independence Square: a Cossack dressed in national garb, who, with a smile on his face, was marching off to skirmish with the special forces. In one hand he held a shield with “Glory to Ukraine” written on it, and in the other a frighteningly big club. He was singing a patriotic song. It occurred to me that this man isn’t bothered by questions such as “How will I get home tonight?” or “What if something happens to me?” or “What is going to happen to us all?”

He isn’t in shock. He no longer gives a damn, bless him.

36 Comments on "Orlov: Shock over Ukraine"

Nony on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 2:22 pm 



power to the people. EU is a much better fate than being a Putin puppet. Hope we can get all or part of that country out of the Russian sphere and into the EU.

ghung on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 2:30 pm 



“Hope we can get all or part of that country out of the Russian sphere and into the EU.”

Who’s ‘we’?

Davy, Hermann, MO on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 3:21 pm 



Everyone has failed: the EU representatives, the US State Department with its Victoria “Fuck the EU” Nuland, the Yanukovych government, its political opponents, and the Kremin. And now they are all in shock and nobody knows what to do. Except for the protesters, who do know what to do:

Well, done Mr. Orlov. This is a balanced and deeply felt article from someone who has been in that region. What I most noted was the systematic risk to finance, energy, and dangerous industrial issues (NUk pwr). If this is not handled properly the contagion will pop the global economic bubble. I can assure you of this. N/R I will buy a plane ticket and fly up with my tobasco sauce and eat your hat if it is not eaten already. I hope I am overreacting. Yet, the system is brittle and can break with enough force “Then” who knows what will shake out. I am sure it will not be good. It is well winter is about over in Europe. Not sure how NatGas will transition chaos?

hillco on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 3:21 pm 



I think the EU would have to put up money to get anything out of this. I somehow doubt Germany is up for it. Bring on the wind and solar, Europe is going to need it.

eugene on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 3:39 pm 



Ghung

I agree what’s this “we” stuff? I assume Nony won’t be one going off to do the “we” thing. As an old vet, I find the lingering anti-Russia attitude sickening. The poor are doing the dying in the trenches while the “we” people are at home drinking coffee.

You can bet the CIA and Russia’s/EU equivalents are in there. In fact, I find the timing of the whole thing has a US smell to it. I can guarantee one thing and that’s the EU just wants to keep their butts warm in the winter.

rollin on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 3:58 pm 



Sometimes things work our better if there is no real governmental control, Italy comes to mind.
What did the irritating peasant say to King Arthur? Something like ” we are an anarchist commune”. Everybody runs the show and everybody has their say, then everybody has to ratify last weeks show and say. I love it. A strange form of democracy and no one lives in the tower.

Northwest Resident on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 4:36 pm 



Thank you Mr. Orlov for finally providing a comprehensive explanation of what is going on in Ukraine. It is far more complex than other explanations I have read, and far more dangerous — not just to Ukrainians, but to all of us. We can be certain that Russia will not sit still for any part of their prized possession — Ukraine — attempting to go their own way and merge with the West. And either will the pro-Russian part of Eastern Ukraine. The only way I can see this ending without major conflict is if the Western Ukrainians somehow decide en-masse to suck it up and return to their quiet lives of poverty and desperation that they’ve been living all along. But now that the smell of blood is in the water and the passions are super-heated, talking Western Ukraine into going home to resume their prior misery in silence might not be so easy to do. Let’s not forget that at the very base of this conflict is a large population in Ukraine that has been suppressed and abused under the thumb of almighty Russia since before the beginning of WWII — it has always been a pressure cooker of raw anger and aspiration for a better life. Now here we are, at the seeming end of times, and I think that everybody just wishes those Western Ukrainians would go home and suffer in silence — take the hit, for the good of the world. But if you ask one of those Western Ukrainians, who now see the first glimpse of light that oil-generated prosperity shines (thanks to America’s offer to provide funding for fracking operations on their side of the country), they probably aren’t going to consider what is best for the world, and if given a choice of returning home to suffer in silence or playing a part in starting a fight that brings down the global economy that has never benefited them, they might not make the choice that we wish they would.

Davy — That hat is all mine, saved for New Year’s party feast on Dec 31 2015 in the event that BAU is still humming along, sucking up what remains of planet earth on that date. But I appreciate the offer, and I catch your drift. Ongoing and/or escalating conflict in Ukraine can only result in ever more serious threats to the already fragile world economy. Maybe by the end of this year we’ll have a full-blown civil war raging in Ukraine, along with ever-worsening conflicts in Syria, parts of Africa, Egypt and a lot of new conflicts starting up in numerous other places. If so, that would tend to indicate to me that things are unraveling right on schedule for a full meltdown of BAU sometime in 2015.

ghung on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 5:09 pm 



What we have here is an ongoing case of Limits To Growth merging with (promoting, actually) Collapse of Complex Societies; peripheral dominoes falling into chaos. The pattern is hard to see amongst the complexity, but the trend is clear. It comes down to resources in the end; little else. We paint it over with stories of ethnic divisions, historical tensions, and bitter roots from the past, but it’s about stuff. Always has been.

Bernd1964 on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 5:38 pm 



For most people here in Germany, the European Union (EU) is a criminal globalist operation to bring on the tyrannic New World Order (NWO) of high finance. We have unelected commissioners running the EU agenda and national sovereignty is being destroyed all over Europe by EU technocrats. And there is exorbitant corruption on all levels of EU bureaucracy, resulting in a shadow household is at least as big as the official EU household.

I am absolutely convinced that the protests in Kiev were financed and organized by Western globalist organizations just like those in Egypt and many other countries. The globalist agenda is perfidious. The evil globalist empire knows well how to overthrow free peoples and to make them slaves to Western high finance.

If the Ukraine joins the EU, World War III will be a very possible scenario in the near future because NATO (the Rothschild army) will become a dangerous neighbour and imminent threat to Russia.

That’s why I simply can’t understand why the Ukrainian people wants to join the EU. The EU is centralized bureaucratic nightmare and a people’s prison, a new USSR run by unelected elitist scumbags selected only by high finance and aristocrats.

DC on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 5:42 pm 



I am sure, that somewhere inside the ‘beltway’ there are people that can barely contain their joy over the recent turn of events. They have managed to create (another) Yugoslavia, except this time right on Russia’s doorstep. Success beyond their wildest dreams. While plan ‘A’ to turn Ukraine into a cheap reserve labor pool of low cost domestics and prostitutes for central Europe and a forward launch pad for US offensive nuclear weapons is on ‘hold'(maybe forever), plan B is almost as good. A chance to wreck havoc on Russia itself. Dont be too suprised if ‘terrorist’ attacks start breaking out all over Ukraine and inside Russia itself as Ukraines comes apart. Well have to wait and see, but I think the temptation for the uS to directly attack Russia(not like this entire episode was anything else), may prove too tempting to pass up.

While I no doubt expect that criminal puppet Obomber to make his usual sad but stern ‘Let me be clear face’, privately, they will accelerate their plans to sow more chaos all over the region. For one, be on the lookout for the rogue US regime to ramp up their efforts to dismantle Syria, knowing full well President Putin and his gov’t will have to focus all their attention now on the uS instigated created chaos next door.And all for what? A measly five billion worth of toilet paper dollars that they created out of thin air in an office in Washington? Talk about ROI….

As usual, the real criminals who caused all this will remain at large. The CIA, US state dept, George Soros, the puppet Us President, the leaders of the far-right neo-nazis groups, EU plutocrats, will all seek to exploit and inflame the situation to further their own byzantine agendas, while ‘ordinary’ Ukrainians beat each other in the streets with clubs.

Northwest Resident on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 5:48 pm 



ghung — I couldn’t agree more. The “ethnic divisions, historical tensions, and bitter roots from the past” have always been there, but the people just lived with their lot in life because there wasn’t really any choice. Now, suddenly, Western Ukrainians are being tantalized with the opportunity for a better life — one with a lot more “stuff” — provided of course by the prospects of joining the EU and getting those American oil companies with all their money and advanced technology to come over and start fracking. Those poor Ukrainians see an opportunity to escape from their history of poverty — little do they realize that even if they pulled it off and got everything they dreamed of, the dream would end with a nightmare and piles of useless “stuff” that they thought would make them happy, but in fact would only make the nightmare that much harder to endure.

J-Gav on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 5:57 pm 



Partitioning is about the only reasonable thing to do, with the western part and its one third of the population moving toward the EU and the east toward Russia, as I mentioned here a week or two ago … But where do you draw the line? Very hard to imagine Russia accepting such an outcome and unimaginable to include Kiev in it. As for ALL of Ukraine being torn out of the Russian sphere – forget about it. Russia would never allow that. Attempting it would lead straight to conflict. Remember the U.S. promise to Gorbachev that if he would allow German re-unification, NATO would make no efforts to extend further east? Pure BS!

So what’ll it be? Partitioning, civil war, international conflict? A huge mess in any case … thus far mismanaged at every level.

peakyeast on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 6:05 pm 



As a danish citizen and part of EU I can say that a large part of the population in Denmark sees EU as a completely corrupt regime.

The danish politicians that get sacked for lying to the people or criminal behaviour gets promoted to EU positions. Our previous prime minister got a high position in NATO as thanks for lying to the people, ignoring the danish constitution and involve our country in a illegal wars against Irak and Afghanistan. All the arguments has proved to be lies. But the uber-corrupt USA can obviously pay our politicians well enough with protection against the law and highly paid international positions to make them commit treason against their own country and actively work for killing 1000s and 1000s of children, women.

The rotten “bad apple” US is easily able to spread their rot to the whole world..

ghung on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 6:12 pm 



Most folks in the west don’t consider that this can have some very real economic impacts on what they pay for commodities, etc. Ukraine is the world’s third largest exporter of corn, the largest exporter of sunflower seed/oil seed, and exports a lot of other grains. Western agribusinesses such as Cargill and ADM are deep into Ukrainian agribusiness, as are, I’m sure, their western political lackeys.

If this escalates to the point where agricultural commodity exports stop or slow significantly, folks in Hoboken will be paying more for their cornflakes, and just about everything else.

It may be prudent to note that Egypt’s ongoing mess began essentially as food riots as the costs for staples rose and subsidies declined. Drought in Brazil, the world’s second largest exporter of corn, along with a political unwinding in Ukraine, could mean things get interesting in the next year or two.

Northwest Resident on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 7:21 pm 



ghung — Add to that the drought being suffered right now in another major food producing area — California — and the implications for food production/price in the near future really get interesting. Anybody who isn’t taking big steps to “grow their own” and provide for themselves right now is likely to regret it at some point in the foreseeable future.

RICHARD RALPH ROEHL on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 9:28 pm 



As Russians often repeated during the $talinist regime: “The worse, the better!”

Arthur on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 10:00 pm 



power to the people. EU is a much better fate than being a Putin puppet. Hope we can get all or part of that country out of the Russian sphere and into the EU.

How about getting the EU out of the sphere of US influence?

Our Jewish friend Orlov is smart enough to understand the potential consequences of the developing situation. Here is a map that shows what could happen to the Ukraine if the situation is miss-managed:

http://tinyurl.com/kdwr7fq

Flash point will be Dnepropetrovsk if things go terribly wrong, could be the the next Sarajewo. Hopefully can be prevented by clever maneuvering by a cooperating Merkel and Putin. A hopeful sign is that Merkel does not support Timoshenko, in other words, she deviates from the US optimum scenario. The best thing that can happen is that both cough up the financial means to keep that Ukrainian basket-case afloat, under German guarantees that NATO will stay out of the Ukraine. With 700 million Europeans, the geopolitical map soon is going to look a lot different. It remains to be seen if that fact has dawned into certain kosher brains, whose actions since 2003 has proven that they are not as smart as they like to think that they are.

Arthur on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 10:26 pm 



Meanwhile, somewhere in Russia…

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nNSLaKP-fQo

ghung on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 10:49 pm 



Really, really getting tired of your antisemitic remarks Arthur. I could easily keep repeating that the most corrupt employer I’ve ever had, and perhaps the most horrible, sociopathic human I’ve ever met was a self-avowed Aryan-supremacist from Stuttgart, but you would likely think it’s a good thing. At least he’s bound to spend the rest of his life in prison.

It’s one thing I miss about TOD. Both of our comments would have been quickly deleted, as would have been your account.

Corruption knows no ethnic boundaries, nor does bigotry.

Meld on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 11:12 pm 



What’s your beef with the Jews Arthur?

Arthur on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 11:32 pm 



ghung, you are sure that it is not you, who completely doesn’t understand what is going on in the world? Why don’t you counter my arguments, rather than firing cheap political correct shots, merely underlining your complete lack of understanding? Calling for bans? Land of the Home and the Free or the next USSR?

What’s your beef with the Jews Arthur?

Who runs your country, meld?

kiwichick on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 11:39 pm 



warm winter = lower gas sales for russia and ukraine?

James on Sun, 23rd Feb 2014 11:54 pm 



Two ways this could go. One, the Russians could send in military and reclaim Ukraine as a puppet it once was. Second, the U.S. influenced E.U. will insist on Russia staying out of the Ukraine and letting it join the E.U. While Russia views this as a further intrusion into its comfort zone and WW III will result.

ghung on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 12:01 am 



@Arthur – Your comments generally aren’t worthy of a rebuttal; polluted and toxic, but you’re free to cite any of my comments that demonstrate “a complete lack of understanding”.

I’ve travelled and studied in 42 countries, including Russia and Ukraine. You? But at least one of us doesn’t pretend to have a “complete understanding” of any of this. One of us also has the character to discuss these things with the goal of developing a better understanding without feeling the need to hurl insults and non-constructive dispersions upon this forum and other ethnic/religious groups. One of us also managed to grow up a white protestant in the US deep south without acquiring the bigotry, racism and hate-speech that his contemporaries often proudly exhibit. Seemed like a senseless way to waste a life. But like you said, above, some of us are not as smart as they like to think that they are.”

Arthur on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 12:25 am 



including Russia and Ukraine. You?

I happen to know the Ukraine intimately, was there many times. Travelled through it for two months a few years ago: Lvov, Uman, Odessa, Crimea, Sevastopel, Kherson, Dnepropetrovsk, Poltava, Kiev and spent 6 weeks in an apartment AT Maidan square, directly above the McDonalds, next to the entrance to the underground shopping mall and underground. Was in Russia, speak a little Russian, was in all European countries, except Romania and Bulgaria and quit a few countries outside Europe. 10 days Manhattan, Caraibean, and a lot of tropical resorts. Worked in six (European countries).

Your comments generally aren’t worthy of a rebuttal; polluted and toxic, but you’re free to cite any of my comments that demonstrate “a complete lack of understanding”.

Where to begin… do you know what a neocon is? AIPAC? Do you know who runs the FED? Do you know who owns your media and as a consequence you brain (and boy it shows)? Do you know how ‘Israeli occupied territory looks like’ (ask Pat Buchanan)? Do you know who according to Wlad the Great for more than 80% occupied Soviet government, as you will remember, the most murderous regime in world history and your ally in WW2? Who instigated WW2 anyway? Who crashed these planes in WTC on 911? Who was behind the lies that were used to crash into Iraq? Who instigated the assault against Libya? I help you, he is ‘French’. What is the ethnic identity of the olicharch looters during the ninetees of Russia? Likewise Soros, Nuland, Timoshenko, Klitschko? What is a PNAC? What is the NWO? What is a Clean Break? Who killed JFK? Who organized the Nuremberg tribunal? Who is responsible for organizing mass immigration to the US, destroying the fabric of your society?

Well?

ghung on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 12:38 am 



Well what? Again, one of us isn’t going to pretend that he knows everything. This isn’t a contest.

Arthur on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 12:50 am 



I’ll make it easy for you… Every question in the list has the same answer.

Look, how many additional years of owning an internet connection do you need for you to come up with basic answers to fundamental questions concerning your own society? Or major historic events?

Makati1 on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 1:19 am 



All I can add is … Russia has nukes.

ghung on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 1:20 am 



I’m asking different questions, Arthur, and try to avoid confirmation bias. If more folks don’t start doing these things, the Jews’ biblical role in Armageddon will look like a self-fulfilling prophecy and none of this will matter. We’re all sinners.

See you in hell.

Nony on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 1:26 am 



I’m mad at the Canadians for beating us in hockey.

OK, I’m over it.

Northwest Resident on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 1:37 am 



Arthur — The prefixing of “Jewish” to Orlov’s name was a cheap shot and in very poor taste. But that does seems to fit your overall style, so no surprise.

Davy, Hermann, MO on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 1:50 am 



Authur, you need to get with the times. You and a few others here are stuck in your ruts and can’t get out. You are horses with blinder walking a narrow path of 20th century political thinking. How can you think this complex global system from Asia all the way around to North America is run by any kind of a conspiracy? This is a self-organizing system of a global community that has become increasingly dependent on one another. No country can go it alone anymore. You and some of your friends here are bad mouthing people and nations in a quest to create divisions and animosity. It is the blame and complain crowd that will ensure we all crash and burn. We will never see through the fog with hate and discontent spread around. Our only hope as a people is to step up a level for all of our self-preservation. The blame and complain is useless waste of precious resources. I appreciate hearing your point of view but not when it is unbalanced and spiteful. There are crimes and sins everywhere in every country. I see no way blame will solve any of our global problems. In any case I would like to know who are your Saints? Who do you think should rule the world?

GregT on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 2:17 am 



Guys,

Arthur has posted a few questions above that are worthy of further consideration. I have no interest in discrimination, but through my own ‘research’ have come to many of the same conclusions.

Also, conspiracies are as old as man himself. To believe that conspiracies do not abound wherever there are vast amounts of money and power to be acquired, is to have blinders on.

This is not about countries, or the people living in those countries, it is a global chess game being played out by networks of intertwined global elite. In many cases, it is families that have been around for many, many generations. Countries and their inhabitants are merely assets, or cannon fodder.

It is the quest by these people for power and greed, that will ensure that we will crash and/or burn.

Follow the money.

ghung on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 2:56 am 



@GregT: “…through my own ‘research’ have come to many of the same conclusions.”

So I’ll ask; So what?

I’ll ask a few Darwinian questions:

Do you take your conclusions to an ultimate conclusion? What are you advocating? What are your motivations for pointing out that a tiny global ethnic group is more successful (in your estimation) than are others? I submit that your motivations and theirs are the same.

It really shouldn’t matter since the Planet will shrug us all off in due time, and none of us would be here if it wasn’t for the sins of our ancestors. Demonizing some other group of our own species hasn’t worked for thousands of years, but most of us keep repeating that same mistake. I’m not doing it, and shun those who would. I, for one, won’t enjoy a life of anger, fear and blame. None of us is that important.

GregT on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 4:43 am 



ghung,

I have absolutely no reason to demonize any group of people. My only motivation is to seek knowledge and the truth. I do not believe that success is measured through monetary gain or power, but through living as good a life as possible and acknowledging my own shortcomings and transgressions, and learning from my mistakes and moving forward.

All of us here discuss the future implications of an energy reduced world, not because ‘the planet will shrug us all off in due time’ anyways, but because we want to know why, or when, or how, or who, or what. We have questions that we feel a need to find answers to. Does this mean that we can change anything. No. So what is the point of talking about any of this? I mean really, what is the point of questioning anything at all? After all, we are all ultimately going to the same place in the end.

The reality of the matter is, our lives are really not that important. So why even bother?

Arthur on Mon, 24th Feb 2014 6:49 pm 



I’ll ask a few Darwinian questions:
Do you take your conclusions to an ultimate conclusion? What are you advocating?

– Nationalization of the Fed and media, that’s the most important
– Reopening 9/11 investigation by independent/neutral organization
– Abolishing AIPAC
– Cutting all ties between lobby groups like the ADL, SPLC, Jinsa, and a host of others
– Paying US politicians from tax revenues, not private parties

What are your motivations for pointing out that a tiny global ethnic group is more successful (in your estimation) than are others? I submit that your motivations and theirs are the same.

The disastrous consequences for the rest of the world. In short: nobody is interested in becoming part of a US global empire, apart from Western politicians. And many people are not too keen in seeing formerly white lands turning into third world countries. Furthermore, a lot of people would like to have a public discussion about what exactly happened in the first half of the 20th century.

For starters.