Page added on March 8, 2018
Can Europe, including the Eastern part, continue to profit from cheap Russian gas without succumbing to Russian energy dominance? According to a new paper from the Oxford Institute for Energy Studies (OIES), the EU should not shy away from “countervailing measures”. But these should preferably take the form of a “grand bargain” with Russia rather than a confrontation.
As Gazprom’s gas exports to Europe keep rising – its market share, now at 33%, could rise to over 40% by 2035 – and relations with Russia seem to keep getting worse, the question of how the EU should deal with its energy dependence on Russia is becoming ever more urgent.
Confrontation is one option. Is it wise – or even effective?
The Atlantic Council – a bipartisan U.S. organisation that promotes U.S.-European relations, and has no love for Russia – has just analysed the effect of the U.S. and E.U. sanctions on Russia’s energy sector. It concludes that they have had a negligible effect.
Here are the takeaways from the Atlantic Council’s report (written incidentally by senior fellow Bud Coote, who “previously spent 43 years with the Central Intelligence Agency where he helped establish and build the CIA’s energy program beginning in the 1970s”):
The conclusions of the report are neatly summarized in these infographics:


So what then should be done?
According to the Atlantic Council, the implication is that the sanctions should be intensified. “Changing Russian behavior requires ratcheting up the pressure”, writes Bud Coote. “This would include tightening restrictions on participation in Russian energy projects, including by service companies, addressing foreign investment in current as well as future oil and gas development projects, and imposing stronger antitrust restrictions on Russian gas exports.”
Clearly this course would make relations with Russia even worse and inaugurate a full-scale Cold Energy War.
Opponents of Nord Stream 2, the planned new pipeline from Russia directly to Germany, argue that it undermines the EU’s “Energy Union” and increases dependence on Russian gas
One of the targets of the Atlantic Council – and others in Washington D.C. as well as in Brussels – is Gazprom’s Nord Stream 2 project. Opponents of Nord Stream 2, the planned new pipeline from Russia directly to Germany, argue that it undermines the EU’s “Energy Union” and increases dependence on Russian gas.
In particular, the position of Ukraine, Poland and Eastern Europe is said to be undermined by the project. One specific criticism of Nord Stream 2 is that, according to critics, it will allow Russia to cut off flows to Eastern Europe altogether – not merely the East-West flows, but also the West-East flows that are likely to increase when the pipeline becomes operational.
As long-time Nord Stream 2 opponent Alan Riley, also a Senior Fellow at the Atlantic Council, points out in a recent opinion piece on The Globalist: “The point often overlooked by German commentators is that Nord Stream 2 will not actually bring much more gas into the German market itself. Instead, the gas will flow onward eastward via NS2’s connecting pipeline EUGAL to the Czech Republic and Poland.”
“What Gazprom seeks to do is lock the CEE states into a gas market dominated by Gazprom with no obvious way out. Western Europe, for its part, will still have a diversified supplied market”
According to Riley, this new route will allow Gazprom to block competing sources of gas that could be delivered from Western Europe to East Europe: “The aim of this eastern flow of Nord Stream gas is to flood the west to east interconnectors with Gazprom gas, effectively blocking access to the Central and Eastern European (CEE) gas market to its competitors”, Riley writes. “In addition, the surge of gas flows from Nord Stream 2 will also undermine commercial incentives to develop alternative pipelines and new sources of supply across the CEE region.”
“In essence, what Gazprom seeks to do is lock the CEE states into a gas market dominated by Gazprom with no obvious way out”, Riley concludes. “Western Europe, for its part, will still have a diversified supplied market. The CEE states will have a gas market largely dominated by Gazprom.”
Is Riley right?
As it happens, the German economic research institute EWI has just published an analysis of exactly this claim.
As one of the authors, Harald Hecking, describes the issue: “Various analyses have been published on the impact of the planned Nord Stream 2 pipeline on European gas prices. Some of these claim that the planned pipeline contributes to a division of European markets and could be abused by the owner to play different market strategies in the East and West. The hypothesis of some of these reports is that Europe could be divided by causing congestion of pipeline capacities between East and West Europe by sending Nord Stream 2 gas at low prices to Western Europe, while Eastern Europe, for lack of alternatives, could only source gas from the East, which could then be priced higher.”
In their report, Hecking and his co-authors Martin Hintermayer and Florian Weiser analysed “whether this hypothesis has any merit, using current market data and pipeline capacities”.
Their study, “Central European Gas Market Congestion Analysis“, concludes that there is no reason to fear such an outcome.
“The Nord Stream 2 pipeline cannot be used for market separation, under conditions of existing pipeline capacity and local gas consumption”, they note. “This is due to the fact that in the European internal market, according to the EU’s own market rules, the importers and thus also the consumers are protected against such behaviour. Pipelines in Central Europe cannot be blocked from the use by other market participants and the gas exporter from Russia would risk violating its own contractual obligations in this case.”
“The current design of the European internal market appears robust enough to preclude a market separation strategy”
They add that “even if one ignores the reality of the gas business under laboratory conditions … and additionally assumes increased gas demand, such a hypothetical strategy for splitting the market would be neither successful nor effective. The possible returns from the higher prices in Eastern Europe would be eaten up by the loss from the additional costs of the discounted sale in the West, and in addition, Eastern European gas importers would turn to other sources of supply as soon as possible.”
The main point of the EWI researchers is that “the current design of the European internal market appears robust enough to preclude a market separation strategy. There is and will be plenty of spare capacity that could enable Eastern Europe to import gas from other sources ensuring that Eastern Europe cannot be ‘split off’ from the West.”
In other words, they find that the idea that Gazprom could block West-East flows to Eastern Europe is far-fetched. In the past, when there were still long-term contracts with destination clauses and unbundled pipelines, this could indeed have happened. But these features have been abolished by the EU’s new gas market design.
As they put it: “It is not possible for specific gas suppliers to create congestion along specific pipelines, since gas suppliers can only book entry / exit capacities into specific market areas while physical flows are determined by the unbundled and regulated transmission system operators based on capacity bookings and flow nominations at entry and exit points. This holds especially when taking into account virtual flows. This means that a line separating West and East … is not a viable concept when applied to the EU gas market, which is based on entry exit market zones.”
It should be noted that the EWI study was commissioned by Nord Stream 2, but then again, Alan Riley is a paid advisor to the Ukranian and Polish gas companies Naftogaz and PGNIG.
Nevertheless, this does not necessarily mean that there is no reason for Europe to be concerned about Russian dominance in the gas sector. So what should the EU do?
“Gazprom has demonstrated a level of flexibility in its pricing strategy that has kept its gas very competitive, with the result that its market share in Europe has grown to 35%”
Analysts James Henderson and Jack Sharples of the Oxford Institute for Energy Studies have also just made a contribution to this debate. In an extensive new paper, they in effect accept that Nord Stream 2 will become a reality and that Gazprom’s dominance in the European gas market will grow. They don’t consider this a disaster, but they do argue that the EU would be unwise to simply let this happen without countervailing measures.
Let’s follow their analysis in a bit more detail.
First of all they note that Gazprom has lately certainly been on a winning streak: “Gazprom has confounded many expectations by enjoying two record years of gas sales in Europe in 2016 and 2017”, they write. “External factors have certainly played a role in its success, with overall European demand rebounding, indigenous production continuing to fall and alternative sources of imports failing to deliver at the expected levels (especially LNG). In addition, Gazprom has demonstrated a level of flexibility in its pricing strategy that has kept its gas very competitive, with the result that its market share in Europe has grown to 35%.”
“The region’s import requirement is likely to rise, with Russian gas and the global LNG market as the only significant sources of potential extra supply”
The authors observe that “the anticipation that this figure could rise towards 40% and above has led EU politicians and policy-makers to become concerned about over-dependence on Russian gas, and many now wish to ensure that Gazprom’s future options are limited by obstructing potential new pipelines. In addition the politics surrounding Ukraine, the imposition of stricter US sanctions, questions surrounding the DG COMP investigation into Gazprom’s activities and the Stockholm arbitration ruling over contracts with Ukraine add further layers of complexity.”
So what is their proposed solution?
They first set out to explore “whether Gazprom’s two anni mirabiles in 2016 and 2017 can be repeated or whether Russian gas faces a more challenging environment in the rest of the decade.”
They conclude that some of the positive trends for Gazprom “are set to continue. The outlook for European gas demand is reasonably positive, as although renewables will continue to be the main beneficiary of coal plant closures in the power sector, gas should also benefit, if only via the higher utilisation of existing generating capacity. Meanwhile industrial and residential gas demand should remain stable, while indigenous gas production will inevitably fall further as fields in the North Sea continue to decline and the curbs on Groningen output potentially become even stricter. As a result, the region’s import requirement is likely to rise, with Russian gas and the global LNG market as the only significant sources of potential extra supply.”
“Gazprom’s huge resource base and its relatively low development and production costs mean that it is very well placed to increase its share of the European market”
There is some change on the horizon, with a “surge” in new LNG likely to arrive on the markets in 2019. Still, in the longer term, “Gazprom’s huge resource base and its relatively low development and production costs mean that it is very well placed to increase its share of the European market”, the authors note.
So market dominance by Gazprom is a genuine possibility – and something of a threat: “… the company’s stated view that it could have a market share in Europe of 40 per cent or more by the 2030s could be achieved on a more rapid timescale. Irrespective of any political issues, this outcome presents a security of supply question for European policy-makers in pure commercial terms, as having any supplier take such a significant share, especially while indigenous production is in decline, is a risky proposition.”
According to Henderson and Sharples, there are things that the EU can do in response.
First, “the obvious answer is to create as much optionality as possible, and the European Commission is doing this by incentivising the interconnection of markets and the construction of as much LNG receiving capacity as possible, especially in more remote locations. However, although this provides the potential for diversification, if Russian gas is the cheapest option then its share will rise as customers, with the possible exceptions of Poland and Lithuania, take the opportunity to minimise their energy costs, as seen in 2016 and 2017.”
Nevertheless, “on top of this, the politics clearly cannot be ignored”, the authors point out, “and both the EU and the US have made restraint of Russian gas supply to Europe a geo-political priority.”
“European politicians must decide whether they wish to limit the supply of one of the continent’s cheapest sources of gas or whether they are prepared to compromise by ensuring that as many routes as possible are kept open”
The EU’s strategy is focused in particular on Gazprom’s “export pipeline capacity, where Gazprom is already close to the limit in a number of directions. The majority of current spare capacity is via Ukraine, where the realities of Russia-EU relations collide, with the EU wanting to protect the Ukrainian transit route for political and commercial reasons while Russia insists on trying to maximise its bargaining power by creating alternative routes such as Nord Stream 2 and TurkStream. Meanwhile the US continues to use sanctions to support Ukraine and to promote the virtues of its own gas exports, albeit at a higher price than Russian gas.”
As a result, the authors note, “difficult decisions” are coming up for European politicians, “concerning the use of the OPAL onshore pipeline by Gazprom, the rules governing Nord Stream 2, the pipelines that will sell Russian gas sent via TurkStream into Europe, and the use of Ukrainian transit all need to be made in the next two years, as various construction milestones approach. It is possible, of course, Nord Stream 2 and TurkStream could be physically built before regulation issues are finalised, if Gazprom wishes to take the risk that they cannot be fully utilised.”
Ultimately, the OIES analysts note, EU leaders face a clear choice: “European politicians must decide whether they wish to limit the supply of one of the continent’s cheapest sources of gas or whether they are prepared to compromise by ensuring that as many routes as possible are kept open, including new pipelines through the Baltic and Black Seas. In addition, they need to decide what role, if any, the ongoing DG COMP investigation into Gazprom could play in facilitating or hindering an ultimate deal as, although a resolution appears to be close, political obstacles still remain.”
“Overall, it would appear that a grand bargain is possible”
Henderson and Sharples believe that, in the face of this choice, the best course may be to aim for a “grand bargain” with Russia.
“Overall, it would appear that a grand bargain is possible”, they write, “which could see a compromise involving guaranteed use of the Ukraine transit system while new pipelines are built, and with Gazprom agreeing to effectively switch to market-based pricing for all its European customers, while also abiding by Third Energy Package rules.”
Next year could be the right time for the EU to aim for such a “grand bargain”: “The confluence of all the parts of the jigsaw appears to be approaching in 2019, when Nord Stream 2 and TurkStream are due to be completed, the European Court of Justice is due to give a final ruling on OPAL and the Ukrainian transit contract needs to be renegotiated, with a further complication being that elections to the European parliament and elections in Ukraine are also due in 2019. In the same year, it would seem that competition between gas suppliers to Europe may also be reaching a peak, meaning that although Gazprom has enjoyed two anni mirabiles in 2016 and 2017, the remainder of the decade may prove more challenging for its business in Europe.”
88 Comments on "A Grand Bargain With Gazprom?"
Laci on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 2:46 pm
I am sorry, but what are some people smoking? Regardless whether it flows East-West, or West-East, countries like Poland, Slovakia only have two options, Russian gas or more Expensive LNG. Norway, Netherlands exports are all going to Western Europe and Netherlands production is in freefall. So what competing gas can flow West-East?
Cloggie on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 3:17 pm
With the new right-wing (closet anti-American) Italian government…
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jt9MLdg3JQ
…chances have increased that sanctions will be lifted.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/europe/matteo-salvini-could-be-western-europes-first-far-right-leader-since-1945/2018/03/06/2d3dea36-2097-11e8-946c-9420060cb7bd_story.html
Both Salvini and Berlusconi are big friends of Putin:
http://www.ilgiornale.it/sites/default/files/foto/2016/11/15/1479227780-1449685713-1416931070-salvini-putin-2.jpg
Bad news is that Putin-friendly German FM Gabriel has been replaced today by the greatest asshole and Washington lover Maas.
Here he is forced by an angry Eastern German public to run for his life and flee from the town of Zwickau:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z6WS-CJINh0
Probably reason why Gabriel was sacked was his insubordination against Merkel when he pleaded for easing anti-Russian sanctions during the recent high-profile Munich security conference:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JaJ0nwYHSk8
Davy on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 4:52 pm
Neder, my wife says you are full of shit. Stick to little dutchy politics you are looking foolish. Leave the more complex and subtle Italian politics to more intelligent people.
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 5:41 pm
“Neder, my wife says you are full of shit.”
Hmmm, that’s odd. Didn’t you say that your girlfriend lived with ‘the offspring’ in another part of the state Davy?
“The Northern League re-emerged with new leader Salvini in 2013”
“In October, members of Northern League formed the group ‘Friends of Putin’ in the Italian parliament, which seeks greater ties between Italy and Russia.”
http://www.newsweek.com/putin-meet-italian-opposition-come-january-289178
Berlusconi and Putin: an enduring love
https://www.thelocal.it/20150611/berlusconi-and-putin-an-enduring-love
Anonymouse1 on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:23 pm
By definition, the more subtle and intelligent people, would include just everyone BUT you exceptionalist, right? Ok maybe that is not entirely fair. Everyone except you *and* boatretard. That’s better.
MASTERMIND on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:29 pm
With all these far right clowns winning just means the economy in Europe is going to shit…
https://imgur.com/a/MbYWl
MASTERMIND on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:30 pm
Clogg
The far right has no alternative to anything. They will simply fail once they get in charge. Just like Trump is and people will see the alternative is better.
Davy on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:31 pm
Poor low life Canadians are showing their scabs. Sorry guys if it hurts so badly when I neuter you. It’s not hard to do with two losers. I can’t remember the last time either of you said anything. This probably is because even when you two try to say something it is pretty lame. Just the usual pricking from the jealousy of being from an inferior nation. BTW, greggie, you didn’t answer my question: Was Hitler a victim? You stupid Nazi apologist. lol
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:41 pm
” BTW, greggie, you didn’t answer my question: Was Hitler a victim?”
You tell me Davy. More than anyone could ever hope to know about the lead up to WW2 can be found here:
http://www.jrbooksonline.com/PDF_Books/David%20Hoggan-The%20Forced%20War.pdf
It’s a bit more complicated than what they taught us in grade school, and as a matter of fact, most of what they taught us were lies, propaganda, and outright BS.
Davy on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:47 pm
greggie, just spit it out, was Hitler a victim or not? Man up and say it and own it. The Allies did bad things too greggie we don’t have to be steeped in conspiracy dopamine like you and the nedernazi to know this. Just answer the question you closet Nazi apologist.
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:52 pm
“was Hitler a victim or not?”
What’s your take buddy?
MASTERMIND on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:54 pm
Here Greg goes with his tin foil hat nonsense! Everything they taught us in school was a government lie! LOL You are so dumb and uneducated
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:56 pm
How’s about we both read the above historical account, and then we can discuss the matter like grown adults.
Davy on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:57 pm
greggie, I am a normal rational person and very certain Hitler was a monster. Now go play with your Nazi friends and apologize all over each other.
Davy on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 7:58 pm
“How’s about we both read the above historical account”
greggie, you don’t get to establish what is history and what is not. You are not qualified. You are a morally corrupt extremist.
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 8:03 pm
“Everything they taught us in school was a government lie!”
Governments and politicians in general, don’t exactly have a stellar historical record of telling people the truth MM.
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 8:04 pm
Davy, you don’t get to establish what is history and what is not. You are not qualified. You are a morally corrupt American flag waving extremist.
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 8:09 pm
“I am a normal rational person”
You are most certainly not normal Davy, and rational? HaHaHa!
You are without a doubt one of the most irrational, messed up individuals, that I have ever corresponded with.
You’re a complete nutcase Davy.
Davy on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 8:14 pm
Oh greggie, just spit it out you coward, was Hitler a victim?
Anonymouse1 on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 8:20 pm
The exceptionalist has gone full Godwin. Taken by itself, it may not indicate anything more than the individual has nothing to say or offer. Considering dumbass precarious mental state…. Perhaps the exceptionlist feels PO.com needs *another* nonsense spewing WWII expert topic delrailer. Clearly, one scientifically illiterate, creationist sharing every random, irrelevant thought that wanders through his cranium isn’t enough…..
Do make sure Hitler isn’t hiding under your cot before you go to sleep tonight exceptionalist. IF you even sleep anymore that is.
Davy on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 8:30 pm
Weasel how about you? It is a very easy question that should not overload your meager faculties. Was
Hitler a victim?
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 8:42 pm
Was Hitler a victim Davy?
Please provide historical references.
Boat on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 9:13 pm
Hitler is dead thanks to Germany declaring war on the the US. Germany, Italy and Japan now host US troops knowing they will keep the right under control. They know their own emotional lack of control leads to world chaos.
GregT on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 9:23 pm
Have you been drinking again Boat?
Boat on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 9:31 pm
I don’t drink greggiet, had a good work out though.
Anonymouse1 on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 10:58 pm
If boatietard does not drink, it would be because he has trouble opening bottles, cans and whatnot, on his own. As for the his comments, well, he IS a retard, so no, drinking is not going to make any difference one way or the other.
Cloggie on Thu, 8th Mar 2018 11:56 pm
greggie, I am a normal rational person and very certain Hitler was a monster.
Explain why Hitler was a monster, Great Thinker of the Ozarks?
Cloggie on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 12:16 am
Neder, my wife says you are full of shit.
Does she read over your shoulder, Meathead?
Ciao, Chiara!
Any particular reason why I would be FOS? Or are you just exercising your usual habit of throwing shit without any accompanying intellectual content whatsoever, a method you apply to history, renewable energy, geopolitics, anything.
Geez boy, are you a goat farmer alright. Take a shower every now and then rather than unloading your goat excrement here on this board.
Hmmm, that’s odd. Didn’t you say that your girlfriend lived with ‘the offspring’ in another part of the state Davy?
That’s what you would a normal person expect to do if he/she had landed him/herself in a relationship with a hardcore marxist a la meathead. Usually btw multi-national relations break-up in times of war.
Perhaps meathead and millimind can be nice to each other in these difficult times.
MASTERMIND on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 12:37 am
Boat said
Germany, Italy and Japan now host US troops knowing they will keep the right under control. They know their own emotional lack of control leads to world chaos.
LOL that is so true. people on the right believe you solve problems with violence. That is why they beat their already stupid kids. (Which lowers their IQ’s)..even more than the imbreading! In Jebus name!
Boat on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 1:08 am
Back to the post. The sanctions against Russia were a gloved slap on the wrist made more to make a statement than to do any real harm or Russian disruption like say, cutting them out of the world’s banking system.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 4:45 am
On This Day…
Mar 09, 2013: Khost, Afghanistan
Eight children are shredded by a Fedayeen suicide bomber: 9 Killed
https://www.thereligionofpeace.com/
CAIR activists, Linda Sarsour arrested at US Capitol
Police haul away Islamic supremacist activists.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 4:48 am
^mm^ you said people who are contard to beat their kids. i’m a constantinean catholics and yes catholicsm is not an indication of anything or wheter one can tell a catholic is ISIS.
But in general the teaching is love, love from supremetard who died on the cross. love your neigbors, love supremetard who is slow to anger.
yes my old man beat me for fun but that’s toxic male syndrome. we need women to kill to get their economic power
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 4:51 am
^mm^ why u make these statement which are so dumb it’s brain damaging. jsut cuz i said you obtain terminal tard degree and never reached supertard status, you never be worshipped. doesn’t mean u go full tard.
listen i’m a libtard and i felt the bern, supported hillary and only converted to republican to vote president paul i’m a blue republican …i can’t believe chemists are that dumb. if you keep this up we program schoedinger equatio and put you out of work
Davy on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 5:11 am
“Explain why Hitler was a monster”
Neder, wants me to play his game so he can vomit his regurgitated history. This WordPress that is a carefully crafted copy and paste nonsense we see here daily. Neder, the amount of knowledge of what Hitler has done is huge. Go back to the books and quit your lies. At least you are honest because greggie and the weasel are not. Have you noticed how they won’t come out and say it but they feel it. They are closet Nazis. You are a card carrying one and a disgusting person but an honest one. You are so far into a fantasy world of make-believe past, present and future there is little hope for you. In fact that was what Hitler was and in some ways you resemble him.
Davy on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 5:15 am
“Does she read over your shoulder, Meathead?”
I asked her if the Italian right is, your words, closet anti-Americans, she said no.
MASTERMIND on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 5:49 am
Hey look its clogg
https://i.redd.it/nj2e2jwdgkk01.jpg
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 5:59 am
I’m not interested in theedrich master race because HE said HE is.
This is because I learned about Islam where Allah said Muslims are the best of creatures and non muslims are the worse of creataures.
I’m a libtard and we set the bar very low for jihadists. we say oh that’s just some cave creatures acting out their instincts. But ISIS recruited western educated supertards, not cave dwellers.
They pronounced their doctrines very clearly for those who take the time to read that their faith is the true Islamic faith.
quran 98.7
I’m a libtard so I ignore islamic violence.
But from their point of view, they’re supremacists and they had the right to slaughter inferior beings at will.
For this reason I would like to buy all captured jihadists for $10 if amputated, or $1 if i have to do it myself.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 6:05 am
master race the edrich has a feminized brain and due to self promotion the brain tells him he’s superior.
how many are into self deception, not many?
^mm^ will bumpski a handufl of them and get the problem taken care of.
it sucks that bumpsking them would give libtard a reason to call for grabbing Luke 22:36.
Somewhere a libtard is licking chops and enjoying the sad concern of anotehr libtard, which is me.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 6:08 am
^mm^ i find the southern people gentle and very intelligent. sure the p*ssy grabber never did anything for apalachia because he’s a blowhard.
watch?v=sHQ_aTjXObs
GregT on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 9:08 am
” At least you are honest because greggie and the weasel are not. Have you noticed how they won’t come out and say it but they feel it. They are closet Nazis.”
More delusional accusations. You are one nasty piece of work Davy.
Davy on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 9:28 am
greggie, answer the question then you slimy lying closet Nazi.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 9:34 am
Greg u’re a nazi
Please go to north pole.
I saw movie nazi in North pole it’s good
Only a few steps and you’re there. Beautiful Nordic blondes there for you
GregT on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 10:49 am
You are attempting to oversimplify an extremely complex subject Davy. There have been literally tens of thousands of books written on WW2.
Cloggie would be correct however, in that Hitler did not want war, and that Germany was backed into a corner, and yes Davy, everyone who dies in a war, is a victim of war.
There are no winners in war, only losers. No matter how hard you try to justify the mass murders of millions of innocent people, murder is wrong. On all sides.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 10:53 am
They don’t shake hands because non Muslims are animals. Supertard professor nz got fired
https://youtu.be/6U2rEyyfudA
Davy on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 10:56 am
You are attempting to oversimplify and rewrite history to fit your agenda. You are as bad or worse than mainstream revisions. Hitler was consumed by war and greatness and you are apologizing for his genocide and that of the Nazies. You are a pathetic slimy closet Nazi. Quit trying to hide behind history and claim conspiracies as your shield of respectability.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 11:09 am
greg you’re a very ignorant nazi. please dont’ attack my supertard anymore ok
ww2 was the first economic war, whoever have more industrial output that person wins. we’re on this web site then we’re talking about resources ok
after marching all over europe and having no raw material he turned east and opened a two front war.
at the gate of moscow fuhrer personally flew there and told tank tactician general guderian that he’s ignorant of “the economic aspecdts of war”.
but he doesn’t start war you say. well it seems he want war for economic reasons
he did exaclty waht supertard frederic bastiat said that men want to plunder
bastiat was more concerned about issues of liberty but the truth apply to warfare too
he sent his tanks 700 miles south to stalingrad. This is never good for tanks.
your adherence to eurotard’s revisionist history is no good
GregT on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 11:16 am
The two main causes of the breakdown in diplomacy that led to WW2, were the Treaty of Versailles, and the Great Depression. The big three most responsible for the Treaty of Versailles were; David Lloyd George of Britain, Clemenceau of France, and Woodrow Wilson of America. The Great Depression originated in the USA, and was a direct result of the monetary policies of the privately controlled Federal Reserve Bank.
I’ll try one more time to clarify my position Davy.
There are no winners in war, only losers. I do not make apologizies for the murders of innocent people Davy.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 11:23 am
well the breakdown of diplomacy is fuhrer holding a grudge. he insisted on teh conspirarcy that germans were tricked to give up in WW1. humiliation was big for him and he wanted to sign surrender in teh same boxcar.
plus germans didn’t know about modern democratic governments. it was succeptible to trickery and a form of blessing from the kaiser gave him dictatorship
GregT on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 11:27 am
The breakdown in diplomacy originated in Great Britain paultard.
fmr-paultard on Fri, 9th Mar 2018 11:33 am
yes after he was givine sudatenland..i agree. should’d mobilized on germany border right at that moment