Kunstler, Heinberg Talk Peak Oil, Suburbia, End of Growth on Podcast

KUNSTLER, HEINBERG TALK PEAK OIL, SUBURBIA, THE END OF GROWTH

Noted Author/Commentators Exchange Ideas on Podcast – Transcript Available

TROY, NY (08/29/2011) — James Howard Kunstler and Richard Heinberg are two of the most popular authors on peak oil and the coming age of resource scarcity.

On the latest “KunstlerCast” podcast, the two author/commentators engaged in a compelling conversation that moved from America’s disastrous reliance on limitless economic growth, to the failures of globalism, to the fate of suburban sprawl.

“Anything that would question growth is like questioning gasoline at a NASCAR rally,” Heinberg said on the podcast of the flailing American economy. “So that leaves us with only one option. That is denial. That’s where our system is stuck.”

Heinberg is senior fellow-in-residence at the Post Carbon Institute, a think tank “dedicated to getting society off fossil fuel fast.” He is the author of 10 books, including “The Party’s Over” and “Peak Everything.” In his most recent book, “The End of Growth” (New Society Publishers, 2011), he argues that the trajectory of industrial civilization is colliding with non-negotiable natural limits.

Kunstler is the author of “The Long Emergency,” a stark warning about the converging catastrophes of the twentieth century, and “The Geography of Nowhere,” a landmark book about suburban sprawl. His “World Made By Hand” novels imagine a post-petroleum America in the not-distant future.

“It’s one thing to envision a future in which we are using alternative energy systems,” said Kunstler. “It’s another thing to envision a future where we are running Wal-Mart and Walt Disney World and suburbia on alternative energy systems. People, who ought to know better, don’t seem to be able to overcome that.”

“If we had factories out there making solar panels and wind turbines that were powered by solar panels and wind turbines, that might be cause for more optimism,” Heinberg added, noting that most efforts to create “green” energy alternatives still require large amounts of fossil fuel.

“Is President Obama lying when he says that we can become energy independent, or that we have 100 years of natural gas that will get us through this bottleneck?” Kunstler asked.

“He’s telling people what they want to hear, and that includes environmentalists,” Heinberg responded. “Many of the big environmental organizations have bought into natural gas, for example, as a replacement for coal. He’s trying to satisfy everyone. Does that constitute lying? Well, yeah, I think so, frankly.”

Both authors concur that global warming, fossil fuel depletion and financial collapse present some of the greatest challenges that humanity has ever faced. And in spite of American’s tendency to believe that technology will be our savior (an attitude which Kunstler has dubbed “techno-grandiosity”), both authors also agree that reality will compel us to re-localize our economy, living arrangements and systems for agriculture. In order to approach that task successfully, we must engage in what they call “managed contraction.”

“Rather than aiming for GDP growth, we need new measures and indicators of social welfare and environmental welfare that don’t require increase in consumption,” said Heinberg. “That would involve reconfiguring our infrastructure for agriculture, transportation — our built environment. That’s a huge job. It would put a lot of people to work. But it would require some real strength of leadership and effort on the scale of the New Deal in the 1930s.”

Part 1 of this conversation between Kunstler and Heinberg is available for free listening at http://kunstlercast.com. Part 2 will be released on Thursday, Sept. 1. A paid version of the entire recorded conversation, as well as a transcript in PDF and Kindle versions, are also available now for $1 a piece.

Support for this podcast interview comes from the Post Carbon Institute.

ABOUT THE KUNSTLERCAST

The KunstlerCast is a weekly audio podcast about “the tragic comedy of suburban sprawl,” featuring James Howard Kunstler and host Duncan Crary. Now in its fourth year, the podcast averages 10,000 unique listeners per week. This fall, New Society Publishers is releasing a book based on transcripts of The KunstlerCast, compiled by Crary.

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