One expects to hear such talk in Israel, and one does. The 19-year-old son of Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu recently posted a message on his Facebook page suggesting that Muslims “celebrate hate and death.” Like father like son, I suppose. The Israeli prime minister is no fan of Islam. He was in New York only a couple of week ago, speaking at the United Nations, where he denounced “militant Islam.” Yet he made it sound very like every Muslim in the world was somehow tainted by their extremist elements. He singled out Iran, which he says is pursuing a “global mission” meant to export its violent revolution “to the entire world.” That sounds very like “godless Communism,” which in the ’50s was regarded by many in the U.S. as wishing to export its “global mission … to the entire world.”
To be fair, Netanyahu is not entirely wrong. There are extremist groups within the Islamic community, including movements such as Al Qaeda, ISIS, Boko Haram in Nigera, and An-Nusrah in Syria—just to name some of the ones that appear in the news almost every day. These fanatical groups wish to create fundamentalist enclaves in which some version of Sharia law will prevail. To Western eyes and ears, Sharia law seems devoid of respect for differences of opinion or complex moral thinking. Certainly the American idea of separation between church and state is lost in Sharia-style governance.
That being said, it seems worth recalling that vast majority of Muslims lead peaceful lives, and—does anyone doubt this?—hope for peace in the world. It’s probably incorrect to say that Islam is “a religion of peace,” as some politicians like to say. Overstatements like that don’t clarify anything. But the Koran does suggest that Islam is a religion of peace, as in Chapter 25, verse 63: “The worshippers of the All-Merciful are they who tread gently upon the earth, and when the ignorant address them, they reply, ‘Peace!’” This is one of many similar passages, although those who wish to support violent Islam will find passages about slaying the enemies of Islam.
The same can be said for the Christian scriptures, which offer contradictory messages about the use of violence.
The idea that Muslims somehow ‘like’ violence seems to pervade American thinking.
It might be noted, as Ruhat Husain has done, that American Islamic leaders have repeatedly condemned terrorist acts. They did so after 9/11, and they continue to do so. Only last year, after the Boston marathon bombings, major statements condemning this horrific behavior were issued by the leading Muslim organizations in the U.S., including UMAA, ISNA, and MPAC. The sad fact is that few important media outlets in the world made much of this universal condemnation, and the idea that Muslims somehow “like” violence seems to pervade American thinking.
Recently in Cairo I sat at a dinner party next to an elderly Islamic businessman. He spoke so eloquently about his faith that, were I not myself a Christian, I would have been tempted to join him in the mosque for prayer! He spoke movingly about how Muslims are called five times a day to prayer. As he put it, Muslims never go for long without coming into the presence of God. Their lives are filled with the spirit, and they submit to the will of God when they bow in prayer. The word “Islam” itself means “submission,” but this isn’t a slavish submission to some horrible force. It simply means that one comes regularly into contact with the universal spirit, the creator God, the source of being—one can describe this term in any number of ways.
As a Christian, I try to meditate or pray at least once a day, however briefly. It’s a personal thing, a spiritual practice, and I find myself wonderfully buoyed by the experience of making contact with a deep source within myself or outside myself or wherever it lives. I envy Muslims their practice of regular and genuine prayer. It’s a beautiful practice that enriches their daily lives. (I know what you’re thinking: I should pray more often if I like it so much!)
My experience of talking to everyday Muslims over the years in North Africa, Jordan, Egypt, on the West Bank, and elsewhere has been uniformly uplifting. In my experience, they are humble, spiritually informed people, more often than not frustrated by the bad press that Islam gets in the West.
Extremists exist in every religion, and violent people will be found among all of them. The barbarism of ISIS and their ilk gets big headlines; but it’s worth reminding ourselves repeatedly that most Muslims aren’t like this. They, too, recoil at the beheading of innocents, and wish that extremism—wherever it arises—can be diminished, as it does nobody any good.
ghung on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 8:36 am
It’s a religion. Nuff said. The non-religious among us are tired of being invalidated and marginalized because we don’t believe in others’ myths.
herrmeier on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 8:43 am
Violent muslim cliché? hahahaha. Each cliché developed for a reason. Maybe stop being such violent retards would help to change the cliché?
Makati1 on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 8:44 am
Jews, Muslims and Christians ALL worship the SAME god. All three claim that theirs is the true and only religion. Such ignorance in the 21st century…
Stercusferi on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 8:57 am
As far as tribal dogma goes, personally I find the Old Testament and the Torah to be the most genocidal and hate filled text. The Koran is considerably less bloody.
Davy on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 9:11 am
It’s a global hijacking that is occurring. We have the legalized hijackings and those branded illegal. Each side claims justification through laws or scripture. Violence in any form cannot be a basis of justification for righteousness. Those in the nasty dens of DC and NY are no better than the fanatical Muslim killers. The Muslim killer is overt the DC cave dwelling monster is covert. Both are engaged in sanctioned killing by justification through their righteousness. Both are killers by definition. Those who say give peace a chance are also in the wrong if they are part of a system that is waging war on nature and humanity. How can a greenie peace loving 1%er find justification being part of a system that is engaged in a wealth transfer war on nature and the poor. Humanity is engaged in a war with itself and nature. No good can come from that and no claim of righteousness is acceptable. All forms of government globally are engage in the evil. From this point on the paradigm of descent will be characterized with humanities civil war. It will not end until a reset takes place at a level closer to harmony with our place in Nature. I am not taking an ethical stand on this it is because it is. Nature will run its course and within nature we will run our course. If you are looking for blame then you are deceiving yourself. It is better to seek mitigation strategies. At least mitigation strategies have quantifiable results. The blame game will not put food on the table. The blame game cannot be won.
ghung on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 9:15 am
Stercusferi – I actually find that the Torah makes the most sense. An angry, vengeful God exacting punishment over a species (his children) who have proven themselves to be “genocidal and hate-filled”. At least it doesn’t pretend that mankind is something it’s not. The God of the Old Testament generally doesn’t allow for excuses.
Plantagenet on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 9:18 am
Muslims engaged in holy war or jihad are violent. Al Qaida and ISIS have declared holy war on the US and the west, therefore they are violent Muslims.
noobtube on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 10:05 am
I thought al-Qaida and ISIS were created by Americans (and their Christian exceptionalism) as an excuse to steal Arab oil?
J-Gav on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 10:14 am
Stercus feri, Salve!
You have a point and those who doubt it should reread Deuteronomy and Leviticus.
Personally though, I’ll confess (no pun intended) that I have no time for any of these “Religions of the Book,” as all have been and still are pretexts for all-too-human power-grabs, social and political terror and funneling wealth into their own coffers.
Beyond that, the fact that their worse than Mid-Evil (sic) doctrines, telling people how to act and what to think, shift from being merely childish fantasies to being dangerous fomenters of violence at the drop of a hat, ought to be of concern to people.
As for the article, who could disagree with the author’s first sentence? However, he neglects to mention that Islam remains the only religion amongst those three to have utterly failed in producing its ‘Reformation.’ Questioning the least comma of the sacred text can lead to very serious consequences. That time is pretty much past (through great human blood-letting) in Christianity and Judaism but Islam has yet to get there.
Any fucking Tom, Dick or Harry can rise up, declare a fatwah against any cartoonist, novelist etc they choose, gain a following which arms itself and dash off to chop heads.
I wouldn’t go so far as to say that religion is the cesspool of humanity but it is, as the saying goes, certainly within farting distance.
J-Gav on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 10:58 am
Stercus bis,
Not wishing to give the impression that I’m one of the run-of-the-mill Muslim-bashers mouthing off today, I’d like to add a few points.
There is absolutely no doubt that Islam contributed greatly to Western culture in being the first to resurrect (no pun intended) our own classical Greek past through Arab translations dating long before and inspiring our Renaissance discoveries. Western lyrical poetry is rooted in Arab poetry (l’Amour Courtois’ tradition in southern France came from Islamic Spain). Islamic contributions to architecture, medicine, mathematics (‘algebra’ is an Arabic word) and philosophy (mainly through Persians, ie Shia Muslims) are also not to be discounted.
Then things kind of petered out … Renewals and social or scientific evolution became increasingly difficult as internecine struggles sapped Islam’s energy. The Persian poets and philosophers continued writing, to be sure, but something was rotting from the inside.
My advice to anyone sincerely interested in Islam today would be to seriously study the Sufis and go from there. These comments come from a period some years ago when I spent a couple or three years independently doing comparative religion readings. None of that changes the reality that today I view the Prophet Mohammed more as a greedy, illiterate, ambitious, war-loving sex offender than as a model for human behavior.
ghung on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 10:59 am
J-Gav: “…I have no time for any of these “Religions of the Book,”…
Indeed. In The Power of Myth, Joseph Campbell made the case that religion underwent a fundamental change when people started writing the stories down. Prior to that, the stories that define belief systems were handed down by word-of-mouth in stories, songs, and art, constantly being adapted to the needs of the societies of the time. With the advent of writing, religions became more locked in time, dogmatic and ‘lawful’.
Davy on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 11:17 am
I find comparative religious studies of the deeper theologies most fascinating. If you go to the subtle and hidden meanings of the Gothic Cathedrals and the Sephirot in Jewish Kabbalah for example. I then loose myself in the void of Taoism, Buddhism, and the earlier Indian influences. I further embrace the deeper traditions of the Native Americans with their earth based spiritual connections and true humanity found in tribal traditions. Finally I realize that every day my body and mind is dissolving from entropic decay. Someday I may be lucky to know what car keys are instead of did I lose them.
Kenz300 on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 11:29 am
Hate, anger and intolerance…..
This is religion?
Solarity on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 11:29 am
Contemporary demographics of religion distribution provides proof of the historic record
that Islam was primarily proselytized by force. The army of Islam spread very rapidly among the primitive societies of North Africa, the Middle and Far East. When these jihadi confronted truly peaceful missionaries of other religions, the missionaries were murdered and lay people chose conversion rather than death.
Eventually the Jihadi confronted stronger resistance from societies having deeper religious cultures. Much of the proof of these confrontations survives today. In Europe was waged the battle against Christianity leading to the Spanish Inquisition and Count Dracula. This culminated in the Crusades, where the Christians waged the fight on Islam’s ‘home’ turf. In India Islam vied against Hinduism, and only gained ground along the fringes (Pakistan). In the Far East, it confronted Buddhism. The Buddhists and Hindus developed a unique way to defend against sword-bearing jihadi: martial arts. Using martial arts and an six-foot bamboo pole, a monk could break both arms of the aggressor without sustaining a scratch. Such outcomes must have made many a jihadi wonder whose side Allah was truly on.
Preston Sturges on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 11:41 am
http://www.evilbible.com has the Bible quotes about things like killing your kids if they leave the Christian church. Most Christian fundamentalists refuse to believe this stuff is in their Bible, but it is.
paulo1 on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 12:18 pm
Good job Bill Maher, for having the jam to say what is somewhat obvious for a great deal of the 1.4 billion Muslims, as well as almost evryone else.
Would you want your daughter to grow up Muslim, or married to a fundamental Baptist? I wouldn’t.
Time for religious fanatics to get a clue and let others live in peace.
Paulo
paulo1 on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 12:23 pm
One more thing:
If you are JoHo, please quit leaving tracts on my doorstep and making my dogs bark.
I live in the boonies for a reason and and these twits drive out and knock on our doors once a month.
As my dad once said to a particularly persistent couple…”let’s see, there are supposed to be 160,000 of you going to heaven. There are a few million of you right now, what do you think your chances are”? (They never came back).
It hasn’t worked for me, yet, and this is after I specifically requested to be put on their ‘don’t knock’ list. They have simply redoubled their efforts!!
Paulo
Preston Sturges on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 1:04 pm
Paulo, just answer the door naked.
Northwest Resident on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 1:23 pm
paulo1 — I used to get those geeks knocking on my door regularly. One time I interrupted their spiel and told them I already had religious beliefs — that I was a devil worshipper. I wish I would have had a camera to record the moment. They quickly made their exit, and I was amused to find out that they stopped knocking on my door — must have got put on the do-not-knock list.
Preston — I grew up going to church all the time, and one of the very first things that started really NOT making sense to me even at age seven or eight was all the barbaric practices described in the Bible being done on orders from God. Sacrificing ones own children, slaves, orders to kill all inhabitants of a conquered city man, woman and child — the whole drinking of Jesus Christ’s blood and eating of his flesh thing. That’s just the short list. And I kept asking myself, if God is this loving God described in the Bible, then how could he/she/it condone those actions, much less order them.
Rivaz Ahmed on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 1:32 pm
Islam is peaceful, but Saudi Arabia’s version of Islam is very intolerant and violent.
Since they have lot of petrodollars in hand, they spread this violent version the world over by funding Madrasas, Al Qaeda and Islamic State.
As long as petrodollars keep flowing there, this violence will be there.
Arabs will hold this violent Islam to their heart just like Americans keep gas guzzlers to their heart.
rockman on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 2:10 pm
Rivas – I appreciate your point as well as others made here. But: “Islam is peaceful, but Saudi Arabia’s version of Islam…”. I don’t tend to consider religions peaceful or violent. They are just various philosophies. People, OTOH, can be peaceful or violent. And can say they base their actions on any cause they want. But they are still actions they chose to take.
Just like guns, religions don’t kill people…people kill people. It would be equally wrong to say Democrats are mass murderers since nearly every massacre in the US in recent years has been committed by registered Democrats. Some even Democrat Party activists. They were all homicidal maniacs that just coincidentally were Democrats. Some in ISIS are homicidal maniacs that just coincidentally happen to be Muslim. I suspect there are ISIS members who are good troopers fighting for some particular cause they believe in and haven’t signed off on the atrocities. A common situation in all forces in evolved in every military conflict.
Davy on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 2:47 pm
NR, years ago at a farm I used to have I had issues with joy riders late at night on the county road near the farm house on the weekend. One night back when I used to drink in 2002 a truck stoped down the road so I walked down to see them with my assault rifle. This was a moonless dark cold night so they did not see me coming. I knock on their window and asked them if they seen any terrorist. I did that with a crazy look and nervous twitch. The whole group was quiet. Needless to say late night road traffic dropped considerably.
J-Gav on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 3:24 pm
Rockman- Well then, what the hell are they doing accompanying the beheaders,if I may be so bold? They don’t know? That wouldn’t be a valid defense, since they must know by now. Of course some naive Western Muslims will come back and describe horrors they didn’t expect to encounter in their “jihad.” A term which, in its original meaning, meant only (to be brief) a plan for self-betterment. Now it’s come to mean holy war … Language is so easy to distort, and this really is part of the problem.
“Coincidentally happened to be Muslim?” You must be joking. ISIS in its essence clearly explains that it claims to be the true word of Allah, and that Sharia law in its most extreme form must reign supreme.
J-Gav on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 4:09 pm
Rivaz Ahmed – I must disagree; Islam is NOT peaceful, even if most of its constituents are. We are in accordance that the dreadful Wahhabis of Saudi Arabia are pure poison in our present circumstance. But KSA is not the only Muslim country which harbors such views and you should know that.
J-Gav on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 4:28 pm
Rivaz – addendum – Are you contributing in any way to the reformation of Islamic dogmatism and its modernization, which might help to bridge the gap between such medieval views and our present world?
MSN Fanboy on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 5:17 pm
Kill all the muslims: problem soved.
God i am good. 🙂
Preston Sturges on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 5:27 pm
>>Democrats are mass murderers since nearly every massacre in the US in recent years has been committed by registered Democrats.
Sure rockman, because all those white supremacists are by definition Democrats, and in your world the KKK voted for Obama. Off topic and full of shit as always.
andya on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 6:34 pm
There are Muslim countries, where they have religious laws, beheadings, behandings, floggings. Sure, the religion of peace. LOL what peaceful people you are. As long as we see extremist Muslims acting violently, then I imagine we will continue to lable Muslims as violent. The extremists are actually trying to be as violent and brutal as possible. Name a secular country with a large muslim population that has not had to fend off an attack by violent Muslims.
Welch on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 8:10 pm
“Jews, Muslims and Christians ALL worship the SAME god.”
Actually, they worship the same figment of their imaginations.
Welch on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 8:12 pm
“Name a secular country with a large muslim population that has not had to fend off an attack by violent Muslims.
Name a secular country with a large Christian population that has not had to fend off an attack by violent Christians.
trickydick on Sun, 12th Oct 2014 9:00 pm
I will not bow down to a semitic desert god.
Norm on Mon, 13th Oct 2014 2:26 am
Erase this article, erase every post made. Because this is a website about peak oil topics, not about religious topics. My I.Q. is above 85, so i am able to accurately draw this conclusion. Guess everybody else here, not so fortunate.
Apneaman on Mon, 13th Oct 2014 3:50 pm
That’s right Norm. As if oil has anything to do with the Muslim middle east. C’mon guys!
If the U.S. and it’s minions ever decided on a genocidal strategy, as MSN Tardboy suggests, the moment it became apparent is the moment the fundies will start the wells on fire like in 1991. Except this time it will be all of them.
theedrich on Tue, 14th Oct 2014 4:45 am
I have never been particularly pro-Jewish, but the “dead-baby strategy” of Hamas and the energetic implementation of the “religion of peace” by ISIL and friends, to say nothing of the Submissionists’ invasion of Europe and the West (with Saudi oil money) has made me a strong follower of Benjamin Netanyahu and his 19-year-old son. There is nothing wrong with Mohammedanism that a good thermonuclear cleansing would not cure.
Davy on Tue, 14th Oct 2014 6:53 am
THee, your attitude is exactly why WWIII is possible. We all know WWIII is suicide. Systematically it would be a collapse of BAU and climatically it would be the end of a stable climate to produce food. The TPTB understand this they may just be hedging that they can step out of their bunker into a world that can be rebuilt for them without the population issues. They will be in the Stone Age. Complexity will have been lost and with it the ability to maintain technology, knowledge, production, and distribution. It is difficult to keep nuclear weapon exchanges localized. I would think once the trigger is pulled the chances of other powers escalating nuclear exchanges is very likely.