[strider3700]

I'm wondering if anyone else has had enough of trying to convince people that there is a serious problem and it will affect them?

I've known about peak oil for a good 2 years now and after going through denial the first 6 months I've slowly been prepairing since then. During that time I've tried to convince others, mainly friends and family that this is an issue and it's coming soon. During that time I thought we had 10-15 years, and the fact that they didn't believe me or care was easy to figure out, there where no direct indicators that it was coming, it didn't affect their lives yet. Some understood the logic behind my arguments and looked into themselves.

In the end 1 person changed their lifestyle and started prepairing. 1 out of about 30 that I've talked with. Lately gas prices are at all time highs and everyone is complaining so I brought the subject up again. They don't want to believe or they don't really understand, I'm not sure which it is. I hear comments about gas being $1per liter and then people talk about their new truck and how they think they'll be going with the blue instead of the black. Point out how much it will cost to fill up that thing and how often it will need to be done and I get back comments about how it will be a little worse but having a new car is worth it.

Now I'm not someone that wants things to end. I have a very comfortable lifestyle with lots of choices and advancement possible. I have a nice little nest egg and debt is very under control by todays standards. The peak is likely to take my comfy place and make it very hard just like everyone else.

Anyways at this point I don't care anymore. I've given up on saving the world, hell even David Suzuki was hoping the peak gets here sooner then later to help stop the other damage. And when he's giving up I feel justified in not trying anymore. The one last person I want to convince is my girlfriend. She's a keeper but thinks I'm crazy when I talk to her about this. If I can make her understand I'll be happy. If I can't I have to decide if she is that keeper I'm thinking of or not.

Has anyone else stopped trying to help or prevent the peak from coming? How have you handled it? I have the strongest feeling that I should be trying to save the world while at the same time I'm completely aware that it's impossible and doing so only eats up time and resources that are rapidly becoming short in supply.

[Evltre]

and will probably give up on friends and family soon too. My sister is a classic - won't even talk about it because "its too negative and I don't like to think about bad things" FFS she has two little boys and lives on takeaways. I not a total doomer, but I do believe that things will be, at least economically, henious, probably for a good long time. You'll need to have good basic life skills as a minimum, like cooking a meal from scratch (let alone growing it!)

Grrr - I'm not having a good day today.

[Schneider]

Feel the same here than you

I have give up because i can't change the world and even more because people just don't want to hear bad news..it is as straight and simple than that,sad but true ..

To be honest,i know about peak oil since roughtly a year..and it's just began to really sink while the last 2-3 months (at least,i don't panic anymore)! I thought like you before that ; got some years of no brainer and have enough time to do it gradually (but faster the better)..

But since november,things have changed..partly because of some words of the olduvai cliff update . Others news like Ghawar who seem to have peaked or will do soon and the news infos of a really sharp decline for 2006 of 14% by year for Cantarel said by PEMEX have make me realise that a lot of hardship will be over us a lot more sooner than i was expecting ..

Not counting that the next economic depression who seem to be coming soon will make any preparatives a hell lot harder to do !

Anyway,i don't speak of all this anymore..like you,it didn't really have done any good. I do what i can to prepare to help thoses i cherish when times of crisis will come and if i do any interventions,i don't do any mentions about peak oil ..

Here what i do :

1)Prepare/open my mind and be mentally ready
2)Buy books who might be usefull in the future
3)In the process to build new skills like :
Martial arts
Primitivism survival
Learning permaculture
Basic health care
Basic Herbalism
4)Save money to buy land
5)Think about a dog
6)Plan to buy some gears
7)Much more..

This is just the beginning,but trying to make my mind to be used to all this and keep my mind clear is the hardest...

Oh,by the way..don't push too hard on your girlfriend,try to do it by the "backdoor" (like.."honey,what about a garden and things like that)..


Schneider
French-Canadian

[SupplyConcerns]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Schneider', '
')Oh,by the way..don't push too hard on your girlfriend,try to do it by the "backdoor" (like.."honey,what about a garden and things like that)..

[ArimoDave]

A soon as I started reading several of the postings here (I fell into it by accident when I was googling for something else), I imediately recongnized what devil and MonteQuest were talking about in one of the energy technology posts. Namely that batteries were not energy sources, but energy carriers. Given what they were saying, I recognized that these guys, among many other on this site, were well educated, and thinkers. I had heard about Hubbert's theory before, but paid little attention.

Shortly thereafter, I felt like I needed to tell the world. But, I also recognized that my feelings were akin to those of a smoker who recently quit, and his/her need to prevent others from smoking around them.

In giving this some more thought, I believe that the reason many people don't seem to get the PO problem is they don't have enough of a math background to fully comprehend, nor the desire to use any math skills they do have. This is especially true, I think, here in the US. I know many people who have trouble balancing their checkbooks. Of those that don't have trouble, many somehow don't really seem to get the idea of credits and debits. They just follow the instructions given on their bankstatements.

I think, that in order to really understand the PO problem requires, at least intuitively, an understanding of functions. Many of the freshman in college, whom I sometimes help out with their math homework, don't like word (story) problems. From what I can tell, the reason they don't like these is they have to understand the math they need to apply, rather than going through a bunch of memorized steps.

The peak oil problem is really a very complicated word problem. There are some aspects which can be solved fairly easily (estimation of when PO will occur for example), while other aspects may have no solution. But even the "fairly easy" solutions may take a complicated differential equation to first model the problem, and a computer to estimate a solution. Beyond my abilities a this time, though I am learning.

Then there are the psychological factors which prevent people from even wanting to address the issue. One of the biggest hurdles here is that PO counters many things a person has learned up to this point, including his or her religious, cultural, and peer teachings.

I think too, that many people are not really thinkers, they don't like to think for themselves. They tend to want information handed to them. When new information is handed to them which goes against previous information, there is the natural tendency to reject the new ideas. If you get their attention, they are likely to start looking stuff up on the internet and find counter examples to your arguments, and find their original assumptions vindicated.

The only way we might be able to convince the public is through the mass media. I am working right now on a couple of articles for national magazines in which I present the problem in accessible terms, and give a few solutions. I also try to show that some of the so called solutions that are prevalent in the public's mind (e.g. hydrogen, and fuel cells) have significant problems and in the case of hydrogen it is not an energy source.

We really can't give up if we believe that there is a glimmer of hope that we can avoid a catatrophic die off of the human race.

ArimoDave

P.S. I hope this gives you some useful ideas.

[NeoPeasant]

i am still writing "google PEAK OIL" in the margins of my money in the hopes of enlightening a few random curious strangers.

There was some question whether it was legal. The subject of the legality of writing on U.S. currency was discussed to exhaustion on the "Where's George" fad related websites. the concensus was that it was legal to write on U.S. currency if it is clearly not intended to make the currency unusable.

[Evltre]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NeoPeasant', 'i') am still writing "google PEAK OIL" in the margins of my money in the hopes of enlightening a few random curious strangers.

[TrueKaiser]

still hammering out what exactly to say.
considering a good 80% of whats on here or any links this place points to claim it to be amrageddon when it's not.

[RickTaylor]

I think it's important to keep spreading the world. You never know what will convince someone. Also, when the oil shortages start go get serious, people may begin to make the connections, if they've already been told what to expect.

--Rick Taylor

[savethehumans]

No, I don't talk PO with anyone much anymore.

I do find, however, when I mention that the economy's about to crash, or that it might be a good idea to grow some of our own food since grocery prices keep going up, or that even that SUV you're driving now has a hybrid on the market--people kind of listen, nod, somewhat agree. Funny how putting PO preparations in different terms, terms the sheeple don't MIND hearing about, plants seeds in their minds.

It's disgusting, it's necessary--and it's gonna take more time than we have to get even a minority convinced! Sheeple in general don't decide it's time to do something until the crisis strikes--and then, of course, there's not an awful lot anyone will be able to do!

The whole thing makes me sick. But I've always preferred knowledge to selective ignorance, and I doubt I'm gonna change. . . .

[Doly]

People understand things when you put them in their own terms. Most early peakoilers were technical people, who have no problems understanding scientific terms, even if they are in a branch of science they aren't familiar with.

If you are talking to a non-technical person, you need to put the problem in non-technical terms. I find the easiest way of putting is is talking about "the coming oil crisis". People understand what an oil crisis is. There was one in the seventies.

[linlithgowoil]

i believe it is completely pointless to tell anybody anything. i also believe it is impossible to prepare for peak oil, unless you happen to be a millionaire and own vast tracts of land.

i want to know what people who are trying to convince someone to change their life will say?

will it be:-

'Oil is about to get really expensive! Quick - sell your house, and live in a shack in the woods - even though you have a wife and children to support and they'll probably think you are a complete nutcase and walk out on you'.

What do you expect people to do? Its like telling someone they are going to die in 30 years. What do you think people would do with that info? Nothing. Absolutely nothing.

Far better just to keep an eye on things - at least you will know whats going on, even if you will be 100% helpless to do anything about it.

[Permanently_Baffled]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')I believe it is completely pointless to tell anybody anything. i also believe it is impossible to prepare for peak oil, unless you happen to be a millionaire and own vast tracts of land.

[Evltre]

I totally agree PB - even if you aren't wealthy there are things you can do. Since October we've sold our house, cleared all of our debt, and are renting until we find the perfect spot to settle. In the meantime we've spread our money out into lots of different areas from terms investments, savings accounts, cash and gold. Spreading it out to hopefully minimise risk. I'm not one who sees the world crashing down overnight - but you never know!

We've starting meeting other local PO people, through local forums - it's good to have a network.

We've brought a lot of books, mostly second hand, on subjects ranging from basket making and quilting, to building a cob house. It's all stuff we're into anyway - it's nice to have paper reference on hand - and books are lovely things to have around the house.

Once we've settled somewhere I intend to start stocking up on basics everytime I shop - some extra coffee, sugar etc each week. You never know when you might need it. My mum had always had a big "incase of disaster" kit hanging somewhere in the house in case of flooding - it came in really handy on a couple of occasions when money got tight through redundancy (there never was a flood)

[Sys1]

A friend of mine announced me some days ago that she was pregnant. How the hell could i speak her about peak oil after that? It's like murdering her.
I just congratulated her...

In the same time, another friend who is still a student were really interested and now get as well as me what's the meaning of peak oil. He plans to travel as much as possible

[OilyMon]

People don't want to hear "THE WORLD IS ENDING! QUICK, GRAB WHAT YOU CAN AND GET OUT!" I always find a much more reasoned approach is necessary when your talking with somebody about the subject. There's a similar thread here about methods of approach. It may be an interesting read for many of you!. I've told everyone about the possibility of an economic meltdown, just never told them that it's going to happen. As great as I think peak oil would be for man kind, lets face it, there is not a 100% chance that within the next 5 years we'll be growing our own food. Can you imagine if everybody statred growing their own food overnight? If you're in a mojor western city, densely populated, what they hell do you do? There would be a person every couple of hundred meters! If Peak oil does happen, there has to be a die-off and this is the reality that people find hard to swallow when first introduced to the subject. People also tend to ignore it because it's all the more plausible. There are actually scientists working on this one, and it's not about something we can fix (Y2k). On top of that, there's a possibility that it won't happen, and that sombody will find a solution - albeit a very tiny one!

[Doly]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilyMon', ' ')If Peak oil does happen, there has to be a die-off and this is the reality that people find hard to swallow when first introduced to the subject.

[Questionmark]

Most, if not all, peak oilers have gone through very serious emotional reactions to this knowledge when first presented with it. Therefore it's a bit unreasonable to expect others to simply accept it when we try to warn them. So what I've begun to do is point out various events and show how they're connected to peak oil as they occur. I've managed to win over several of my more educated friends but none of them have begun to prepare yet. Although I think that will begin to change as things become more and more drastic.

I've certainly stopped talking about it with people that I've just met. People tend to lump peak oilers in with conspiracy theorists and it makes for a bad impression.

[Xenophobe]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('strider3700', 'I')'m wondering if anyone else has had enough of trying to convince people that there is a serious problem and it will affect them?