[The_Toecutter]

I've built one off of a KMX frame with added front suspension. It currently has no motor and is entirely pedal-powered. Here's videos of me doing 30-40 mph down a street in the local hood:

https://vimeo.com/284616898
https://vimeo.com/284616919

It would be much faster if I got the aerodynamics right, but on this first build, I did get the ergonomics correct for my needs the first try. It's very comfortable to ride and easy to use, with plenty of storage space. It can also be brought through a doorway into an apartment.

From downhill testing, I was able to derive a CdA figure of 0.25 m^2, but commercial models exist that have less than 1/5th that amount of aerodynamic drag. With the first body I made for it shown in the above videos, it required approximately 500W of power to hold 30 mph on flat ground. I've reached more than 50 mph downhill in it and it has proven stable while making a lane change at that speed over imperfect roads, and the mechanical braking system has proven adequate.

I’ve put more than 500 miles a month on it since building it. I no longer use a car for transportation(I might again one day when I can finally get the electric Triumph GT6 finished).

Specs as shown in the above videos were as follows:

-KMX framekit with added coroplast body; unladen weight of about 65 lbs with a CdA of 0.25 m^2
-Exa gas shocks set up for 60 psi for front suspension
-Ackerman steering
-Velocity USA 20" double-walled rims up front with 13ga spokes with 26" rear wheel with 12ga spokes
-Schwalbe Marathon Greenguard 20x1.5" e-bike tires up front rated for 50 km/h continuous use with a Schwalbe Marathon Plus Tour 26x1.5" tire in the rear
-Shimano Tourney 165mm crankset with 28/38/48T gearing and a DNP Epoch 32-11T 7-speed freewheel
-KMC "gold" 7/8-speed chain

Of course, I plan to put an electric motor to it when financing permits.

I took the body off last year to make repairs to the drivetrain and have the next body shell designed, and am waiting on a friend to get his truck legal so I can pick up the plastic sheet I need to finish the 2nd design iteration of the shell. The goal is a CdA of 0.12 m^2, which would allow me to do 30 mph on only 250W of power, and possibly reach close to 50 mph on flat ground when pedaling hard for short periods.

Adding a motor to it, with enough power, could make it capable of performing like a car.

The long term goal is to build a vehicle with the following traits:

-Less than 100 lbs total unladen vehicle weight. This figure includes having installed the motor, battery, and rest of electric drive system with the vehicle ready to ride. Just add rider, tools, luggage, ect. to get laden weight.

-CdA of under 0.12 m^2, but the lower the better(current guesstimate for the new shell I'm building may be around 0.10 m^2, but really don't know. It will have wheel farings to cover the outboard front wheels and streamlined boots over the suspension arms).

-Conventional bicycle parts for the human power drivetrain; derailleurs, chain, sprockets, ect.(Currently planning a 26/39/52T chainring set up front with 152mm crankarms, an 11-34T 8 speed cassette in the rear, and will be adding a Schlumpf high speed drive sometime after the financing permits me to convert it to electric). The bicycle drivetrain will be sealed from outside the velomobile. This will allow it to last tens of thousands of miles, and the gearing would be appropriate for anything from slogging up a 20% gradient with the motor disabled at 3.5 mph with 60 cadence, to careening down the highway at 55 mph with 140 cadence with the motor on or downhill at that speed with the motor off, and cruising along on flat ground at 30 mph with a leisurely 90 cadence without even needing to be in top gear. With a Schlumpf high speed drive added in combination with an electric motor, it becomes theoretically capable of cruising along at freeway speeds, like a car, and exceeding any U.S. speed limit, with human power adding useful motive force at any operating point.

-Torque sensing PAS to multiply pedal output. The assist doesn't add power unless the user is pedaling. For emergencies, in case of failure of the bicycle drivetrain, a throttle could be added with the Cycle Analyst computer limiting throttle-only mode to 20 mph to keep it legal in areas where this is necessary

-Electric drive system capable of no less than 6 kW peak and 1 kW continuous(Currently planning to use a Leafbike hub motor which can handle 4 kW peak and 1500W continuous out the box and can be modified for 6 kW peak with ease)

-1.5+ kWh pack of Tesla Model 3 batteries with aftermarket BMS

-Light duty DOT-compliant moped rims laced on all hubs, with Schwalbe Energizer solar race car tires all around. Must be safe at highway speeds, have a low enough rolling resistance to be pedaled like a normal velomobile with the drive system disabled, and as light as possible to minimize the acceleration penalty over normal bicycle wheels/tires from inertia

-Hydraulic disc brakes on all wheels set up with a single pull lever

-Full suspension, keeping the gas shocks at the front and adding a gas shock to the rear

-The rider must be enclosed for all weather riding. NACA ducts aimed at neck and armpits for cooling, with more air drawn in from footholes.

-Roll cage. It only needs to be strong enough to match the weight of the laden vehicle in a wreck to protect the rider.

-Ability to carry tools, camping gear, a few changes of clothes, hygiene items, 2 gallons of water, and a 2-3 days worth of food, all at once, with room to spare OR carry tools, 1 gallon of water, and 2 weeks worth of groceries

-Small 12V auxiliary battery fed from traction pack via DC-DC converter running headlights, running lights, brake lights, turn signals, and gauges(speedometer, cadence meter, heart rate monitor, power meter for rider, power meter for motor, battery pack state of charge, motor temperature, Cycle Analyst)

Theoretically, if all of the above were done, with the motor activated, it should be good for 0-30 mph acceleration in around 3 seconds and 0-60 mph acceleration in under 10 seconds pedaling as hard as I can with the hubmotor doing the rest, a top speed of more than 100 mph with the Schlumpf drive engaged while human power still accounts for 10% or more of the motive force needed to hold 100 mph(even if not for long), maximum "safe" cruising speed around 45 mph(it is a short wheelbase tadpole after all, but full suspension will make a big difference for stability. With just the front suspension I have now, it is stable downhill at 50 mph for short durations and I'd trust it all day long at 35 mph over bad roads) where human power still accounts for roughly 30% of what is needed to maintain speed, perhaps 200 miles range at 35 mph with rider input of 150W and 120 miles range at 45 mph with a rider input of 200W, and with the motor deactivated, it would still be able to move like a velomobile, perhaps with the rider able to do flat ground speeds of 20 mph on 100W, 30 mph on 250W, 35 mph with 350W, and brief sprints of up to 45 mph with 650W.

Perhaps if I can fit it within the allotted weight budget, solar panels could even be added to greatly extend the range. A 100W solar panel system would go a very long way to extending its usable range, especially when combined with the pedal input.

It would be legally an "electric bicycle" in a few U.S. states and "undefined"/"unregulated" in many others, while also highly illegal in many jurisdictions as well. For the states where it would be illegal, turn the motor off and ride it like a normal velomobile. For states where it's legal, have fun on state highways and side roads, just stay off the interstates.

The energy efficiency equivalent when operating the motor would be in the thousands of miles per gallon range. If it only needs 250W to do 30 mph and 1,600W to do 60 mph, with 33 kWh in a gallon of gasoline, this is the equivalent to 4,000 miles per gallon at 30 mph and more than 1,200 MPGe at 60 mph. Far better is possible, if I had wind tunnel access and knew enough about aerodynamics to get there. By comparison, a Milan SL velomobile needs 130W to do 30 mph and 750W to do 60 mph, which could yield close to 7,500 MPGe at 30 mph and more than 2,500 MPGe at 60 mph with a high efficiency drive system.

It would be a great off-grid bug-out vehicle. If I end up homeless, I may end up living out of it. I'd be able to cover quite a bit of distance in it as well, almost as quickly as a car, but without any of the expense.

In the long run, as better motor technology enters the market, I could make this thing much faster. There exist prototype PMDC motors that weigh in at only 7 lbs that can make 30 kW peak. Such a monster would allow this vehicle 0-60 mph in under 4 seconds, IF it can get enough traction to achieve that...

[Newfie]

Yup, you need a job. Turn that creative energy into cash!

There a bunch of folks who are hot on building electric powered sailboats. IF you ever get bored with land transport.

Neat stuff you are building.

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Newfie', 'T')urn that creative energy into cash!

[The_Toecutter]

An update.

Pics of the bike:











So far here's the realized specs:

-46 mph top speed on flat ground on a full charge with the motor enabled
-1,500W peak power, plus rider effort
-7 watt hours per mile @ 30 mph w/light pedaling
-9 watt hours per mile @ 35 mph w/light pedaling
-12 watt hours per mile @ 40 mph w/moderate pedaling
-12 watt hours per mile in the snow with enough effort to do 30 mph on flat ground, but riding at speeds from 20 to 40 mph with a 20 mph rolling average
-While powered yields a consistent 40-50 mile range with enough effort to cruise at 30-35 mph on flat ground in freezing weather. I get about 8.5AH from the 46.8V pack in the cold, although it is rated to 10.5AH. This should improve to perhaps 60 miles range at the same speed in warmer weather due to reduced air density and increased battery capacity.
-With the motor disabled, I can pedal it to 35 mph in a sprint and cruise on flat ground around 23 mph. I lost a few mph unpowered after installing the motor due to its additional weight and cogging losses.

I tend to cruise around 30-35 mph and my lifetime average energy consumption is about 9 wh/mile.

At any operating speed with which it is capable, it feels stable and tracks straight. It has been up to 60 mph downhill before I motorized it and felt stable. It is very controllable at 30-40 mph in 30+ mph crosswinds with 50 mph gusts, although one will need a bit of effort to keep it straight in those extreme conditions. The brakes are good up to about 35 mph, but after that they are questionable and require careful modulation.

Regarding what specs this will eventually have, I'm in the process of building another battery pack. It's going to be 72V 21AH, capable of delivering 5 kW peak, and is liable to give me a 150-200 mile range @ 30-35 mph, acceleration like a car(simulation shows 0-30 mph in about 5 seconds with a 96A phase current, but a better controller and a 150A phase current could allow 4 seconds), and a 70 mph top speed. I’m also going to finish a set of wheel fairings, a windshield, roof, and rear wheel cowling to cut drag further. I also plan to add brake lights, permanent running lights, headlight, and turn signals, as well as solar panels and a charge port for electronics. Later upgrades may also include hydraulic disc brakes, thicker brake rotors, and perhaps a rear suspension.

Here's some additional specs:

-Weight: 82 lbs
-CdA: Unknown
-Trike Frame: KMX framekit
-Body shell: Custom corrugated plastic bodywork with aluminum ribbing, mounts, and supports
-Battery: 46.8V 10.5AH pack of 13S3P Panasonic NCR18650GA cells, 490 Wh rated capacity, 1,500W rated peak power
-Motor: Leafbike 1500W 4T wind brushless PMDC motor, w/10k NTC thermistor and 10-12 awg bullet terminals, laced to 26" rear wheel w/13ga spokes and double-walled aluminum rim
-Controller: Phaserunner v3, currently set to 1,500W maximum power output, 750W maximum regenerative braking
-Computer: Cycle Analyst v3 DP, currently set to 1,500W maximum power output
-Charger: GrinTech Cycle Satiator HV model
-Torque sensor: Sempu 2-wire w/115mm spindle width, no throttle installed at the time
-Front wheels: Velocity 20" 32-spoke w/13ga spokes laced to double-walled aluminum rims
-Front tires: Schwalbe Marathon Greenguard 20x1.5" @ 95 psi
-Rear tire: Schwalbe Marathon Plus Tour 26x1.5" @ 60 psi
-Front crankset: Suntour XCT Jr. with 152mm crankarms, modified with 26/39/53T chainrings
-Rear gearing: SunRace 34-11T 7 speed cassette
-Front derailleur: Microshift Mezzo
-Rear derailleur: Shimano Tourney RD-TX35 7/8sp
-Chain: KMC Z7, lubricated with Boeshield
-Torquearms: custom KMX torquearm designed and made by EndlessSphere member dhwahl(left-side), GRIN Torquearm Kit v4(right-side)
-Right shifter: Shimano Revoshift 7 speed index grip shift
-Left shifter: SRAM 3-speed index grip shift
-Front suspension: EXA gas shocks on upper/lower swingarms at 65 psi, suspension designed and made by EndlessSphere member adam333
-Brakes: Avid BB7 calipers with 165mm disc rotors, cable-pull operated
-Right Brake lever: Terratrike dual-pull lever with parking brake
-Left Brake lever: GrinTech ebrake, operated for regenerative braking in the rear

[Plantagenet]

Wired magazine had a story about German velomobiles several years ago...a company named Leiba manufactures them there....

saddle-up-yer-velomobile-in-Germany


German Leiba velomobiles

Apparently you can buy one of these for about $5000-$6000 in Germany, so if you decide to sell yours, toecutter, thats the going market price for velomobiles.

Cheers!

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', '
')
Apparently you can buy one of these for about $5000-$6000 in Germany, so if you decide to sell yours, toecutter, thats the going market price for velomobiles.

Cheers!

[The_Toecutter]

I bought a Milan SL, mainly to reverse engineer aspects of its design, most especially its aerodynamics. It can do 30 mph on 140W, and I can pedal it to just under 50 mph on flat ground in a sprint and hold 30-35 mph all day long on flat ground, completely unmotorized. My goal is for the next iteration of my custom build to have twice the drag area of the Milan, which while while it will not be as slippery and efficient as the Milan, it will come with the advantages of a few inches more ground clearance, more suspension travel, shorter turning radius, faster cornering without tipping over, more storage space, and accessibility of all the mechanical parts making it easier to service. If I get a CdA twice that of the Milan and the solar car tires I install end up with a Crr of 0.008, I'm looking at roughly 225W needed to hold 30 mph, BUT in a vehicle rugged enough to handle crap roads, and on good roads, able to cruise at 70 mph and reach 100+ mph with the electric motor running.

Here's some pics of the two trikes:

[phaster]

about a year and a half ago took delivery of an Arcimoto FUV which is a three wheel electric motorcycle because I found it wasn't possible to carry stuff (like from the grocery store) basically since then I have not used my electric beach cruiser,...

anyway since I'm a fan of odd efficient modes of transportation my plan is to buy a two seat three wheel tilting eBike when the design is perfected

http://electrek.co/2022/02/25/arcimoto-unveils-radical-three-wheel-drive-electric-leaning-trike-that-it-thinks-can-beat-e-bikes/

might be possible to add an "aero" body???

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('phaster', '
')
might be possible to add an "aero" body???

[theluckycountry]

A lovely hobby, I'm a cyclist myself, but by the time the roads are clear of truck traffic so it's safe to ride them, they will be in such disrepair you won't be able to anyway. I only ride road, smooth road, but I envisage the day when I will have to use a full suspension MTB on those same roads, Already I have had to buy an adventure motorcycle, with the long suspension and knobbly tires, for long rides up country. The roads are just too bad to take my sports bike. And after the recent floods it's taking the government bodies inordinately long to repair all the potholes too. They are running out of money, oil is money.

Nice one that Jetrike toecutter. I wonder if there would be a way to partially counter the crosswind effect? something like vertical stabilizers that can tack like a sailboat does? All computer controlled of course. Pointing straight ahead or laying against the body and adjusting angle or popping up when the wind loading becomes extreme. Just a thought...

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'I') only ride road, smooth road, but I envisage the day when I will have to use a full suspension MTB on those same roads

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'I') only ride road, smooth road, but I envisage the day when I will have to use a full suspension MTB on those same roads

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'Y')ou've got a rear hub motor in that eh?

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', '
')That was the first motor I had in my electric velomobile, when I was running 3kW peak power. It's a Leafbike 1500W

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', 'I') would never consider an EV, they are a Joke, a gimmick car with their 1 ton battery packs and limited range at that. A typical end of the oil-age kneejerk reaction where the company makes all the money and the consumer is left with an albatross they have to make stories up about.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', 'T')he fact that modern electric cars are even worse by this metric than ICE cars from the 90s was a deliberate industry choice made, in attempt to maintain a paradigm of infinite growth on a planet of dwindling natural resources

[The_Toecutter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('theluckycountry', '
')Yes, totally, and it's not just cars, it's Houses and appliances, everything the consumer buys. But that's the world and I don't regard myself as an A-typical consumer. Let them do as they please, I don't have to buy their products.

[Tanada]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', '
')The problem is that a large percentage of the population is not only ignorant of the political dynamics at play regarding what they can buy, but they also have no genuine choice either, other than to do without altogether.

[theluckycountry]

Perhaps losses are a factor in some cases. Certainly Aluminium has greater resistance, ergo higher losses. There is also corrosion to be factored in. I sold a 1980's era motorcycle back a couple of years ago, a Kawasaki GPZ 900R. It had sat abandoned in a garage for 30 years, covered from rain but an inch of water crossed the floor every time the rain was heavy enough. Every aluminium alloy surface was white power, quite deep too was this corrosion. These were factory painted surfaces too, Wheels, frame, brake fluid reservoirs. Only anodized aluminium seems to withstand this sort of corrosion I have noticed.

When they want very low losses they use Silver wire. Solar panels, space tech, missiles etc.

[theluckycountry]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('The_Toecutter', '
')I have appliances from the 1950s myself. They will possibly outlast me. They are also very inefficient regarding energy consumption and when time permits, I plan to design and build my own to address that. They won't be "energy star compliant", but they will likely be far more efficient than anything government approved.