$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Twilight', 'A')pologies for the off-topic post.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sheb', 'T')ure enough enough, Twilight. Although I had heard it was 1% alcohol that would kill any pathogenic (to mammals) microorganisms. I'm sure it is probably between 1% & 2%.
It is for this reason I take a small quantity of grain alcohol with me whenever I camp or hike. Should the need arise, it can be a water sanitizer, disinfectant, fire accelerant, and (in dire cases), an anesthetic. I still need to get a gallon or two for emergency supplies...though vodka may be a cheaper (per C2H5-OH content) substitute for home.
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US Gas shortage concern
Re: US Gas shortage concern
by Tanada » Sun 29 Apr 2007, 09:53:44
I've heard 1% too, but I don't like to use that as a guide. Better make sure, and at half the strength of weak beer, even a day's intake is not going to cause any unwanted side-effects, especially as it's spread out.
I like the grain alcohol idea for camping or hiking, but I've gone for vodka before just because it's more widely available. I have used water purification tablets in anger too, but it's never a good idea to rely on one thing. They do pack a lot more power for the size and weight, but you need to have them with you, they're not something you can improvise in an urban emergency. Plus, they're not going to disinfect a wound either.
I looked into this last night because I have heard it a lot. Unfortunately it turns out not to be true, for true instant disenfectant power you need 70% alcohol by volume which is what rubbing alcohol is sold as. A small bottle of rubbing alcohol would do well for disenfecting wounds. As for the water problem, the reason small beer (aka 3.2 beer aka 3% alcohol beer) is safe to drink is because the process of making beer involves roasting the solids to toast them, then boiling them in the water. The boiling does a lot more to kill microbes than the 3% alcohol does. Most microbes actually have the same enzymes your liver hold which convert Ethanol into Glucose, hence it takes a pretty large dose to garuntee killing them.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Alfred Tennyson', 'W')e are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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Re: US Gas shortage concern
by Valdemar » Sun 29 Apr 2007, 10:49:01
Evaporation or reverse-osmosis will deal with bugs better if you don't have any chemical aids like chlorine tablets. As Tanada points out, you need quite harsh chemical agents to deal with microbes. When I clear up in a laboratory environment, the use of TriGene is mandatory (never can remember what it's made of), and often burning alcohol off instruments is needed for aseptic technique.
It's really just a good idea in general to never underestimate microbes and their abilities to adapt to just about anything.
It's really just a good idea in general to never underestimate microbes and their abilities to adapt to just about anything.
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Re: US Gas shortage concern
by Troyboy1208 » Sun 29 Apr 2007, 11:14:56
isnt this discussion thread about US gas shortage? YOu should set up a new thread on iodine tablets or whatever
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Re: US Gas shortage concern
by Sheb » Sun 29 Apr 2007, 11:31:50
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tanada', '
')I looked into this last night because I have heard it a lot. Unfortunately it turns out not to be true, for true instant disenfectant power you need 70% alcohol by volume which is what rubbing alcohol is sold as. A small bottle of rubbing alcohol would do well for disenfecting wounds. As for the water problem, the reason small beer (aka 3.2 beer aka 3% alcohol beer) is safe to drink is because the process of making beer involves roasting the solids to toast them, then boiling them in the water. The boiling does a lot more to kill microbes than the 3% alcohol does. Most microbes actually have the same enzymes your liver hold which convert Ethanol into Glucose, hence it takes a pretty large dose to garuntee killing them.
')I looked into this last night because I have heard it a lot. Unfortunately it turns out not to be true, for true instant disenfectant power you need 70% alcohol by volume which is what rubbing alcohol is sold as. A small bottle of rubbing alcohol would do well for disenfecting wounds. As for the water problem, the reason small beer (aka 3.2 beer aka 3% alcohol beer) is safe to drink is because the process of making beer involves roasting the solids to toast them, then boiling them in the water. The boiling does a lot more to kill microbes than the 3% alcohol does. Most microbes actually have the same enzymes your liver hold which convert Ethanol into Glucose, hence it takes a pretty large dose to garuntee killing them.
Just for clarification...for firestarting & disinfection, I was thinking 100% ethanol.
As for water sanitizing...the key term is *pathogenic* microorganisms. There are many fungi, protists, and monerans which can live in alcohol concentrations of 15% or more. But, as with the flora of our livers, they are *not* pathogenic. On the other hand those that thrive in the human body's acqueous environment and pH--those which are the bad ones for us--don't do so good even in small alcoholic concentrations (Staph, Strep, botuli, E-coli, etc). That's a key underpinning in the inherent safety of zymurgy (the making of fermented drinks). Even the bacterial infections of a bad batch don't hurt you. They just *taste* foul.
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