[Aqua]

When I was a hard up student we once ate Tench, and Rudd. Really bony but they tasted OK sort of earthy flavour and a welcome meal, many people I know would say they are inedible but it depends on how hungry you are.

I’m backing on a fish diet in my part of the world when things start getting really tough. There are several rivers and streams no more than an hours bike ride from where I live where I can confidently catch fish ranging from 15lb salmon down to 8th lb river trout if the pickings are slim. As for pole fishing I fish artificial fly for trout and salmon, there is seldom a time I go out when I do not catch at least something. Grant it on most days what you catch gets thrown back in, I seldom take anything under a 1lb and most would be 2 to 8 to a pound. With proper hunger pains 8 scaldies would make a most enticing meal to any mortal. On the coast in summer mackerel abound, they are so easy to catch all you need to do is cast out a feathered hook among a shoal from the shore, reel in a few times and success is assured.

Skiwi you are making me jealous with that description of new Zealand fishing and that picture thank you from a cold harsh winter. This has actually made me remember to get a seine net for my supplies, thanks, I once helped to bring in (legally) over seventy salmon and sea trout with one of these one time from a river pool where they had been trapped by low water and in danger of death. Useful tool to have in the future for some profitable and reliable fishing.

[Itch]

Fishing poles are great, but their effectiveness depends on many different things.

If you are fishing for panfish, like bluegill, you don't have to put in much effort, since I've found that they'll bite a shiny hook as soon as it enters the water. You can use them as bait or catch a dozen or so and then fry them. If they were hesitant to bite a bare hook for whatever reason, I'd add some kind of improvised bait and they'd gobble it down. These fish stay in shallow areas in order to avoid the larger predator fish that stay at lower depths, so there isn't much work involved trying to catch them; you stand by the shore, lower the hook in, and yank out a fish when it bites. Sometimes you don't even need a pole; often times just some string and a hook is required.

Success on catching larger fish depends on many things. I've found that wild fish seem to be less picky than factory fish, since wild fish have been eating a variety of foods since birth, and are usually more aggressive and vigorous. They are in deeper waters, though they patrol the shores looking for smaller fish to eat sometimes, so greater range is required to deploy the bait. Lures work well, but the commercial ones are expensive. Homemade ones are relatively easy to make. The most basic one involves a solid base, something shiny, like a candy bar wrapper, water proof glue, and a hook.

If you are fishing in a lake, commercial fishing poles tend to have a range advantage. But if you are fishing in a creek, where the body of water isn't that large, an improvised pole, consisting of flexible stick, string, and hook, works just fine. They are quite durable if you have the right materials, and expedient and easy to camoflauge.

One thing I like about fishing poles, other than the fact that I find fishing with them to be enjoyable, is that they are quiet and precise. Unlike with a net, you don't have to slosh around in the mud, making noise, scaring the fish away and making the water murky in order to just set things up.

Poles also don't scrape up the bottom, where various eggs, which may be critical to the local environment, lie. I suppose that if you're good with a net, then maybe it can be avoided, but I don't think most people are expert net fishers.

Poles, and traps for that matter, give you what is needed. Nets catch a shit load of fish, and unless you have that many people to feed, are usually excessive.

[TorrKing]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Itch', 'I')'ve found that wild fish seem to be less picky than factory fish, since wild fish have been eating a variety of foods since birth, and are usually more aggressive and vigorous.

[katkinkate]

And you can always take up fish farming.

[Schneider]

Raising catfish in a barrel :
http://www.survivalplus.com/foods/page0007.htm

The Urban Aquaculture Manual :
http://www.webofcreation.org/BuildingGr ... Chap1.html

Schneider
French-Canadian

[Itch]

Hey, Torjus.

I guess our respective environmental conditions might make a difference in our fishing experiences. I somehow get the idea that the weather in Norway is maybe a bit different than the Pacific Northwest in the US.

But, you know, I did just get a pack of these automatic fishing reels. You put a hook and bait on, set the line to the desired length, and secure it in a notch. The fish bites the bait, tugs on the line, and unleashes the mechanism that secures the line, automatically reeling the fish in. I can't wait to try these out.

I have the same ideas about setting up multiple fish traps. For narrow places like creeks, you could have a long stick, with the bait and hook, hanging out over the water, supported by whatever is available.

In lakes and larger bodies of water, attaching a bait-bound stick to a line that is connected to the shore, and then pushing the armed stick out towards the deeper parts is more appropriate, if you are going for larger fish that is.

I think traps would be most appropriate for catfish and other fish with the same eating habits, where they basically eat anything on the floor that can be eaten. Actually, it's probably better for all bigger fish in general. But with small panfish, I've walked up to the shoreline, dropped the hook in the water, and pulled out a juicy bluegill out within seconds using a pole. At that rate I'd be able to catch a whole meal and surplus oil within minutes.

Nets and poles both have their uses for the appropriate fishing conditions. If net works in your area where poles fail, then I hope your net catch is bountiful, and hopefully legal; it isn't fun being fined for trying to eat relatively untainted food. Nets are very illegal where I live, and the risk for setting them up would be great. With an improvised pole, I don't have to worry about getting fucked with. And even if I'm fishing in the cleanest areas, where it is illegal to fish, of course, I can toss the pole in the water or bushes and sprint off, without losing a valuable tool behind. In my case, I'd rather use a net to make a ghillie suit, so the bad guys won't see me in the first place.

I guess the ideal thing for me would be to deploy traps in various areas, while I go back and pole fihs for my enjoyment. I think it's a good exercise for range estimation and hand-eye coordination. I catch what is needed using a pole, and maybe check the traps over the next few days to see if anything bit. The fish would be alive for quite sometime, since it would just be sitting there with a hook in its mouth. It might be depressing for the fish, though, spending all that time thinking about such a huge mistake.

[TorrKing]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Itch', 'H')ey, Torjus.

I guess our respective environmental conditions might make a difference in our fishing experiences. I somehow get the idea that the weather in Norway is maybe a bit different than the Pacific Northwest in the US.

But, you know, I did just get a pack of these automatic fishing reels. You put a hook and bait on, set the line to the desired length, and secure it in a notch. The fish bites the bait, tugs on the line, and unleashes the mechanism that secures the line, automatically reeling the fish in. I can't wait to try these out.

I have the same ideas about setting up multiple fish traps. For narrow places like creeks, you could have a long stick, with the bait and hook, hanging out over the water, supported by whatever is available.

In lakes and larger bodies of water, attaching a bait-bound stick to a line that is connected to the shore, and then pushing the armed stick out towards the deeper parts is more appropriate, if you are going for larger fish that is.

I think traps would be most appropriate for catfish and other fish with the same eating habits, where they basically eat anything on the floor that can be eaten. Actually, it's probably better for all bigger fish in general. But with small panfish, I've walked up to the shoreline, dropped the hook in the water, and pulled out a juicy bluegill out within seconds using a pole. At that rate I'd be able to catch a whole meal and surplus oil within minutes.

Nets and poles both have their uses for the appropriate fishing conditions. If net works in your area where poles fail, then I hope your net catch is bountiful, and hopefully legal; it isn't fun being fined for trying to eat relatively untainted food. Nets are very illegal where I live, and the risk for setting them up would be great. With an improvised pole, I don't have to worry about getting fucked with. And even if I'm fishing in the cleanest areas, where it is illegal to fish, of course, I can toss the pole in the water or bushes and sprint off, without losing a valuable tool behind. In my case, I'd rather use a net to make a ghillie suit, so the bad guys won't see me in the first place.

I guess the ideal thing for me would be to deploy traps in various areas, while I go back and pole fihs for my enjoyment. I think it's a good exercise for range estimation and hand-eye coordination. I catch what is needed using a pole, and maybe check the traps over the next few days to see if anything bit. The fish would be alive for quite sometime, since it would just be sitting there with a hook in its mouth. It might be depressing for the fish, though, spending all that time thinking about such a huge mistake.

[Doly]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Torjus', '
')And you are right, when fishing small fish it is probably better to use a line and hook. Otherwise one need very small meshes in the nets to catch them. And making small-meshed nets is alot of work.

[TorrKing]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Doly', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Torjus', '
')And you are right, when fishing small fish it is probably better to use a line and hook. Otherwise one need very small meshes in the nets to catch them. And making small-meshed nets is alot of work.

[doston]

Quite a few fisheries scientists believe that the coming energy crisis will take the pressure off our fish stocks -- fishing companies will find that it costs too much to deploy the boats. Nevertheless, the fishing industry is usually faster on the draw than scientists and bureaucrats. Here's a bit of background: salmon fleet dynamics

[nemo]

I sure hope there's some relief ahead for our oceans. Modern industrial fishing methods are just too darn effective at sweeping the water clean, IMO. If high fuel prizes keep some portion of current fleets in port, it might just help the heavily depleted fish stocks to recover a little. Does it really take a fisheries scientist to figure that out?
I didn't quite get the essence of that linked article, is it about fishermen catching more and different salmon than they should? Quotas and regulations don't seem too work very well - scientists and regulators want to keep catches down, but fishermen, having the financial pressure on to catch and sell whatever they can, find ways to circumvent the rules. Slashing the size of the fleet at sea might just be the most effective conservation measure, and if PO does what politicians won't, I guess it's a good thing?

[Ayoob]

A couple years ago, I went fishing with a friend of mine and his dad. We caught maybe 30 fish or so that day and kept them in a bucket of water on the boat. We got to the garage and dug out the scalers, which were bottle caps spot-welded to coat hangers. I have to say they worked pretty well.

After we'd scaled a couple of fish, I took a look at my friend's dad. He was grasping the fish by the lower part of the tail and smashing it's head against a bench to kill it. Now, I'm under no illusion whatsoever when I eat meat. I know what's happening as surely as if it was happening to me. If somebody grabbed me by my ankles and smashed my head against the side of a bench he might knock me right the fuck out. Then again, maybe not. And if he didn't and he took another swing with me, he's pretty likely to blow the side of my head open.

I work in emergency medicine. I have seen gunshot wounds to the head brought in to the ER and what we do to save their lives or reduce the pain they experience. Those guys are screaming and all over the place. It can be messy.

So that's what we were doing to these fish. His dad would give them a couple of whacks and hand one to my friend and one to me. I'd scrape away for a while and feel the fish jump in my hand. It's just nerves, his dad would say. Knowing what I know about nerves today, I'd have to agree. But you know what was happening in that fish's two-volt brains. It was panicking and freaking out while some ape scraped its skin off its body before slitting open its belly and pulling out its heart and lungs. Tell me that wouldn't fuck with your head a little. I think it would.

There's no difference between the pain and fear that animal feels and the pain and fear I experience when my finger gets slammed in a door or I cut myself with a piece of paper. Except I don't know what it's like to have my head slammed against a bench a couple of times and have my skin scraped off my body while awaiting the gentle caress of a dull knife open me from pelvis to neck and have my vital organs pulled out.

That has to be a low point in the life of a fish.

Bottom line though, I eat meat three times a day. For breakfast, I chop up a little beef jerkey to sprinkle on my poached eggs. Lunch generally has some chicken or beef in it, along with a healthy variety of beans and whole wheat bread. I make my own hummus, which is really easy and very tasty. That comes with lunch, too. I have dinner on the ambulance, mostly leftovers from lunch and occasionally a dinner out at a cheap restaurant of some Indian or Middle Eastern variety. Chicken shish kabob or tri tip schawerma if I can get it. If all else fails, there's usually a Whole Foods around and I can get to the salad bar and load up on lentils or winterbean salad or Persian cucumber/tomato salad. That stuff is good. But I like meat, too.

I like the taste of it, the texture, the spices, the care with which it is handled. I could probably have a healthy and happy life without eating any meat at all forever. How bad could it be? I'd just not have one particular culinary pleasure. I guess I just like it that much. I'm willing to put up with the knowledge that we harvest other animals and do to them what we do.

It's kind of like how I feel about Medicare-paid convalescent homes. We stick our old people in these horrible hotels and wait for them to die while they are neglected by the staff. Imagine spending five or ten years bedridden next to five other dying people. How's your cancer going, Jerry? Jerry?

Except Jerry can't talk anymore, he's hooked up to a ventilator. Nobody's come to visit him in years. He says to me, "Nobody would care if I died today." This has happened to me a couple of times. I know these people. Every once in a while, I can't remember their names. I've talked to them a dozen times, called a nurse over when they've needed their diaper changed, sometimes I've given them lifesaving medication or splinted a broken bone, and sometimes I've talked to somebody ten minutes after a suicide attempt. Sometimes it's been all of these situations and more. Maybe I was there when the person was fine, then right at the brink of death, and then fine again. I see when the family visits and when they don't.

That said, to the victor go the spoils. If you don't want to end up on somebody's plate, don't bite at the easy flies. And buy good health insurance so you don't end up at the Medicare home.

[PenultimateManStanding]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ayoob', '
')That has to be a low point in the life of a fish.

[Baldwin]

There are more humane ways of killing a fish than to bash it against a rock....

These things become easy however when one is hungry.

[I_Like_Plants]

Frankly I used to just let them die on the stringer. Not vary humane I guess. Bigger fish are different, have to conk 'em. Watch some video of people catching the larger fish on hooks, for food, they'll have a short stout stick they whack 'em on the head with - to keep the fish from knocking the hell out of everything and everyone thrashing around.

This was discussed in a book called, if I remember the title right, "On Killing". The point of the book is that in the 1800s, for instance, sex was forbidden and thus fetishized, now, with people seeing "meat" as little plastic wrapped packages and not killing their own chickens and even fish, killing becomes this forbidden mysterious thing and thus fetishized. Thus, you get violent video games and serial killers becoming media stars. The book came out of a study of the military's attempts, eventually successful, to get soldiers past their natural and normal aversion to killing other humans.

[jboogy]

remember the old myth your elders would tell when fishing"fish don't feel pain",or when too squeamish to bait your hook,"worms don't feel pain",uh huh,sure grampa.The wife's been veggy for a couple years now,she says it's cause of health reasons,I think it's partly because she's a bigtime animal lover too ,now the 14 year old daughter's been veggy for a couple months now,she's switched just because of humanitarian reasons,whatever.me and the boy are holding out ,we luv's bacon and chinese food.I gave my bull to my neighbor though,I had really cut back on the red meat and couldn't see slaughtering him when it would've taken me ten years to eat him.woulda had to buy more freezers too.He's livin' the good life now,I'd estimate he's got maybe 10 to 15 young cows all to himself and a good twenty acres of lush grass.I don't really have any hangups when it comes to processing animals though,you get used to it pretty quick,if your hungry you'll not only do it but drool while you're doing it,I'm talking REAL hunger,the kind most americans have no concept of , every year during hunting season I raid the deer processors dumpster for carcasses to butcher for dog food(4 dogs),THAT was hard to do the first time,now it don't bother me at all,digging thru fly covered gut piles can sharpen your focus ,i got a feeling a lot of vegetarians are going to re-aquire a taste for meat once the 3000 mile ceaser salad gets hard to come by,amazing how the people of leningrad aquired a taste for leather and sawdust during the ww2 seige."you want maggot gravy with your mud pie?"

[PenultimateManStanding]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jboogy', 'y')ou want maggot gravy with your mud pie?"

[truecougarblue]

The high point in a fish's life?...

Laughing at me and my pathetic attempts at spearfishing these past weeks.

[Pops]

I thought this was gonna be a fishing story…

Somewhere higher up on the chain (though I have killed fish in many ways) was the calf that broke it's leg a while back and died today.

That leg was shattered way down near the joint where the bone is thin, I could not even feel any intact bone touching as I moved the hoof.

The young neighbor said shoot it and I agreed, the old neighbor said you can always shoot it later – he isn’t cruel, he just hates to see anything die.

I already had my .22 out when he gave that advice and he has been right more than not.

Long story short the calf got up and around after I splinted and wrapped the leg – for a few days. Then he didn’t get up, I rigged a sling and block and tackle to get him up for circulation in his legs and to let his gut work.

The SOB would lay his head on my lap as I gave him aspirin and antibiotics, moved him, fed and watered him – I don’t get attached to food but it had been my decision to not shoot him and so I was responsible…

Yesterday he had the stink, I thought; OK I’ll put him down tomorrow if he doesn’t look better.

He suffered about 2 weeks before he died without my help…

[jboogy]

Wow Pops , that story didn't end the way I thought it was going to.poor thing. even though I was happy to have my bull live by giving him to my neighbor I gotta say I really don't like my cows at all.I'm just keeping them to make a little money and as a fall-back food source should the situation really sour in this country.do you eat a lot of beef Pops?