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Russia to diversify economy

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General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Re: Russia to diversify economy

Unread postby pogoliamo » Tue 11 Jul 2006, 09:54:08

Luther, do you know about Global Events Magazine ?

I think the author shares some of your views giving also good
insight and reasoning about the subject of Eurasia and Russia.

Of course, just an opinion, but it might be well worth the money...
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Re: Russia to diversify economy

Unread postby lutherquick » Tue 11 Jul 2006, 14:42:10

pogoliamo,

"Global Events Magazine", I will look at later in the week, thanks, it looks interesting...
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Re: Russia to diversify economy

Unread postby Russian_Cowboy » Wed 12 Jul 2006, 15:28:54

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('sch_peakoiler', 'T')o sum it up - I am sure Bush has no serious power over anything whatsoever, and does not even defecate without consulting the real puppet string holders. So his own abilities do not play any role. In this case it does not matter if his IQ is 20 or 200.


The same without any doubt applies to Putin. He is just a phantom created by those in power to improve Russia's tarnished image.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Vick', ' ')Yes, it is a problem - and we are working on it. I think sch_peakoiler have not heard about new Russia`s immigration and family programs (they are starting in 2007).


So far, it has been nothing more than bla-bla-bla. However, Putin just signed a law mandating you to pay much higher bribes than before if you want to be a draft-dodger. Besides that, these programs are against Russia's long term interest. Extra immigrants will exacerbate Russia's already high ethnic tensions. The family program will have the same effect because it will increase the birth rate among the muslim and oriental minorities of Russia, but will not have a serious effect on the rest of the Russians. Again, it will help prepare a new civil war in Russia 20 years down the road. Russia has hundreds of thousands stray kids, the medical services for children and education outside of Moscow and Spb are in a horrible shape. Instead of working on these issues like crazy, Putin wants more cannon fodder. To be more exact, it is not even Putin, but Russia's popular opinion that is so totally wrong and out of touch with what is going on in the world.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Vick', 'M')enya, esli chestno, sinofobia "europeitsev" sil`no zadolbala. Che vy ih tak boites`?


The Chinese are buying the Siberian officials wholesale and the Moscow's control of the latter is weakening. This is akin to Khodorkovskiy's lobbying the Duma. Alas, Putin cannot imprison all the Chinese :), hence, all this anti-Chinese fear-mongering by the Russian propaganda.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('sch_peakoiler', 'i')t depends on information which you have about what exactly Putin does. I agree that he does many good things


Name one "good thing" that Putin did. In terms of doing good things so far Putin is well behind even his notorious predecessor. On the other hand, Putin is trying to build a hypercentralized inefficient empire based on readily accessible oil and gas. As has been discussed at length on this board, the easy to extract oil and gas are going to run out within years. Hence, Putin's empire will go down the toilet in just a few years as well.



[web]http://www.brookings.edu/views/articles/gaddy/20040701.pdf[/web]
We do not inherit the Earth from our parents, but borrow it from our children - Antoine Saint Exupery
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Re: Russia to diversify economy

Unread postby lutherquick » Wed 12 Jul 2006, 16:00:45

Russian_Cowboy,

The US, before the Iraq war, offered Iraqi scientists US green cards, free homes in Long Island, and LOW and BEHOLD, the Iraqi scientists, said the right words, they said WMD were in Iraq... Quickly they went into their corners and manufactured the evidence...

My point, your post... Good to know you have a green card from Canada.

Try coughing up some proof, some stats some sites, so evidence.

The way I look at it, Russia is held to much higher standards as she needs to prove herself. To that end, Putin can't be as bold as Bush, can't screw up as Bush, can't lie as Bush, can't think so short term as Bush.

As Putin's last term is coming to an end, he's saying more and more what he can, diplomacy is being set aside. I love how this latest MSNBC interview how he said that he trusts "NOBODY" and that Cheney's comments where another failed hunting accident (I paraphrase).

Below, in you post, there are many errors. First, this thing about birth rates. The new law will NOT give money to migrants, only Russian citizens who have children.

Your English might sound good wrapped by a paragraph of other errors, but anyone with a clear understanding of what the Russian Federation is doing and how this Russian government built of performance and deliverables, you will realize they are doing what is best for Russia. Fvck Canada and the US. Your problems and hate in Canada aren't Putin's problem. Simply look at debt payments, economic recovery (sure, allot to do, but on it's way), it's position in Energy, compare this to the US with it's civil war in Iraq, no wmd, etc...

If you want corruption, look in the US, nothing is more corrupt and as fvcked up.

Here is American virtue:
http://www.ipenergy.com/data/ENRON-GotThePower.mp3
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Re: Russia to diversify economy

Unread postby MOCKBA » Wed 12 Jul 2006, 16:06:08

Russian_Cowboy, Great article, BTW.
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Re: Russia to diversify economy

Unread postby gg3 » Wed 12 Jul 2006, 23:16:24

From here in the US it appears that Putin is highly competent, and is "all-business" in the sense that he is committed to his purpose and does not indulge in foolishness. If I'm not mistaken he has a majorly impressive background, academically, militarily, and in a high position in one of the intel services, and he speaks four or five languages.

The contrast to present American leadership is frankly embarrassing to the point of mortifying. I frankly feel compassion for GW Bush. He seems like someone who would be quite competent in any number of jobs in the civilian world, though not senior management positions; and he's been dragged into office by a bunch of very cynical ansd power-hungry people who needed someone they could use as a figure-head.

It used to be said that we (in the US) get the government we deserve, but since the last two elections were likely stolen, we got the government that someone else chose for us. Thus it's no contradiction to say "we really do deserve better." We need someone like a Wesley Clarke or a Colin Powell (real warriors with solid track records), or an Al Gore (real understanding of science & technology issues). Even Hillary Clinton, who I view with major skepticism, appears to be smart, coherent, and capable.

I notice something interesting about Western press coverage of Putin. He is always photographed in a manner that makes him look "sneaky" or "not trustworthy." Chin pointed down, eyes looking up, photographed from slightly above his head. Eyes looking in some other direction than he is facing. 3/4 side views where he is not looking at the camera. Very rarely do we see him photographed in the manner of other world leaders, looking straight ahead into the camera.

Re. "pardon my English": No pardons needed. I am always amazed by the degree to which people from other countries are highly capable in English on this board. Likely most of you (overseas folks) speak thee or four languages, whereas most of us Gringos speak only English and then whine loudly and demand everyone speak English. I love the English language (and the English (UK) heritage of our legal system) and believe I use the language well, but I'm also well aware that we adopt many words from the rest of the world's languages, and we need to place much more of an emphasis on multilingualism here. Not just for business reasons (though those are important) but also for national security reasons: a culture that encourage learning many languages will necessarily increase the number of its people who learn languages from regions that are potential military trouble spots.

Last but not least it's highly interesting to me to read what y'all Russians (whether by birth or adoption) have to say. We rarely if ever get detailed news from Russian people about life in Russia or about Russian perspectives on world events. Much less do we get news from the perspective of Russian patriotism, both regarding internal events and world events. This is all very interesting and I've learned much.
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Re: Russia to diversify economy

Unread postby Russian_Cowboy » Thu 13 Jul 2006, 05:00:01

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lutherquick', ' ')Good to know you have a green card from Canada.


More important is that I have a job that pays above average for North America. A green card by itself is meaningless, cuz it would not make me happy at all to have a green card and clean toilets till the end of my life.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lutherquick', 'T')ry coughing up some proof, some stats some sites, so evidence.


Everything I am saying is open-source. As a computer specialist, you should be able to find proofs for everything I say on the internet, e.g., in the news. The only exception is the incomes of the Russian government officials, but they are easy to guess by checking out the prices of their McMansions. I already posted one Russian McMansion advertised for sale at $39 million.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lutherquick', 'T')he way I look at it, Russia is held to much higher standards as she needs to prove herself. To that end, Putin can't be as bold as Bush, can't screw up as Bush, can't lie as Bush, can't think so short term as Bush.


Ok. The creators of the hologram called George W. Bush deserve a lower grade than those who created the hologram called Vladimir Putin. So what?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lutherquick', 'B')elow, in you post, there are many errors. First, this thing about birth rates. The new law will NOT give money to migrants, only Russian citizens who have children.


I never meant to say that the Russian government is going to give money to the migrants, though it should if those migrants are Russian citizens. Although lots of migrants did bribe their way into Russian citizenship, at least 15% of Russia's indigenous population are muslims and orientals with the birth rates about twice as high as that of the other Russians.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lutherquick', 'S')imply look at debt payments,

Ok, Russia has increased its debt significantly in the last 6 years. The government debt was largely replaced by the corporate debt. If you recall that those corporations are largely government-controlled, you will realize that in terms of the debt no progress was made at all.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lutherquick', 'e')conomic recovery (sure, allot to do, but on it's way),

Ok, let's look at the other countries with high natural resource endowments. In the last ten years, Equatorial Guinea grew its GDP per capita 20 times, Azerbaijan and Kazakhstan more than 2 times, and Russia only 50%.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lutherquick', 'i')t's position in Energy, compare this to the US with it's civil war in Iraq, no wmd, etc...

Russia has an ongoing civil war in Chechnya and around it. This is a part of Russia. Iraq is not a part of the US.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lutherquick', 'I')f you want corruption, look in the US, nothing is more corrupt and as fvcked up.

At least the police in the US do not beat up whole cities, like the Russian police in Blagoveshchensk did two years ago and do not shoot to kill people peacefully protesting against corruption like the police officers in Dagestan did three months ago.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gg3', 'F')rom here in the US it appears that Putin is highly competent, and is "all-business" in the sense that he is committed to his purpose and does not indulge in foolishness. If I'm not mistaken he has a majorly impressive background, academically, militarily, and in a high position in one of the intel services, and he speaks four or five languages.

Putin does speak German cuz he was a spy in the DDR in the 80ies working together with the Staatsicherung. As far as everything else is concerned, I challenge everybody on this board to name a single good thing that Putin did. I can only name the judicial reform that somewhat improved the courts in Russia. This is well behind Yeltsin who is credited for the market reform and privatization that left the industrial property in Russian (not foreign) hands. Yeltsin allowed ordinary Russians to take possession of their state-owned residential property gratis, lifted all the restrictions on travel abroad as of January 1, 1993, and granted full freedom of speech at the end of 1991 (later retracted by Putin).
We do not inherit the Earth from our parents, but borrow it from our children - Antoine Saint Exupery
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