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Re: Another Oil price Record

What's on your mind?
General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Re: Another Record

Unread postby Leanan » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 17:09:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')sk yourself this question where were all the peak oil theorists last year when oil was trading around $45? How about 2 years ago?


Right here, baby. Look at the date I joined. :-D
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby therealtruth » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 17:24:33

Pretty soon the market will sell off for whatever reason, people will realize the world is not coming to an end come to their senses and see that there is not much fundamentlly holding this prices up. I think this situation is the perfect setup for a major correction and who gets burned? All the little people who really don't have a clue about whats going on and got in late in the game! People who trusted these Hegde fund managers with their hard earned money and retirement funds.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby joewp » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 17:29:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('therealtruth', 'A')sk yourself this question where were all the peak oil theorists last year when oil was trading around $45?


We were right here, waiting for it to go back up. :-D
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby emersonbiggins » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 17:34:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('therealtruth', 'P')retty soon the market will sell off for whatever reason, people will realize the world is not coming to an end come to their senses and see that there is not much fundamentlly holding this prices up.


"not coming to an end"

We indeed have seen the end of cheap oil, which might well equate with the world we know *gasp* "coming to an end". Even if oil is $20/bbl again, it will be because we're in a depression, not because your theorized bubble burst.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby UncoveringTruths » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 17:39:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('therealtruth', 'P')retty soon the market will sell off for whatever reason, people will realize the world is not coming to an end come to their senses and see that there is not much fundamentlly holding this prices up. I think this situation is the perfect setup for a major correction and who gets burned? All the little people who really don't have a clue about whats going on and got in late in the game! People who trusted these Hegde fund managers with their hard earned money and retirement funds.


Sounds like some of the same stuff we have been talking about since 04 except now the fuel tank is half full with no petro station in sight. Sorry your late to the ho down! But there is still some time for you to prepare for a less energy dependent future.

No the world will not come to an end however it will be fundamentally changed to run on less energy and it won't be the same as the past. I think I will go have a steak now!
It's a cold cold world when a man has to pawn his shoes.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby DantesPeak » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 18:06:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Leanan', '[')url=http://money.cnn.com/2008/03/12/markets/oil_eia/index.htm]Oil prices burst record 110 dollars[/url]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')EW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- Oil prices rebounded to another record high Wednesday afternoon after initially plummeting when a government report said supplies of crude and gasoline had risen much more than expected.

In afternoon trading, U.S. light crude for April delivery surged to a high of $110.20 before closing at $109.92. Oil had traded as low as at $107.09 following the report's release on Wednesday morning.


From the above article:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')This market is not about supply and demand, it's about the dollar," said Alaron senior analyst Phil Flynn. "The dollar is weaker and investors are buying anything they can get their hands on."


Well Phil is only half right, the falling dollar is accelerating the move up in oil. However almost everyone seems not to have noticed a worldwide shortage in diesel. Every day the price of diesel climbs as supplies dwindle.

Do you have to be a petroleum engineer to realize the only way to get more diesel is to refine more oil? The high price of diesel justifies paying the high price for crude. Analysts in the above article only look at gasoline and conclude the demand for oil must go down.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby emersonbiggins » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 18:20:41

Great insight, DantesPeak. I hadn't thought of it from that angle, though I drive a diesel car, and can attest to the price increases, sometimes 20 cents in a day.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby dukey » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 18:44:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('therealtruth', 'P')retty soon the market will sell off for whatever reason, people will realize the world is not coming to an end come to their senses and see that there is not much fundamentlly holding this prices up. I think this situation is the perfect setup for a major correction and who gets burned? All the little people who really don't have a clue about whats going on and got in late in the game! People who trusted these Hegde fund managers with their hard earned money and retirement funds.


the oil market doesn't really work like that
it's not like the stock market
when you buy crude futures you will have to take delivery of the crude, or sell to someone who can. Therefore the likelyhood of a bubble, will be short lived at most.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby Gandalf_the_White » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 18:58:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('therealtruth', 'A')sk yourself this question where were all the peak oil theorists last year when oil was trading around $45? How about 2 years ago?


Let's see where was I,... oh yeah I was dealing with my second straight quarter of depression because I had been forced to see that peak oil was going to shortly remove both candle and wick from the global economy. It just so happened that my mathematics training, combined with a physics background and alot of research left me know other conclusion. I knew I was right before any of this recent activity began to happen. And BTW, oil was $22 per gallon just four years before that. It double in four years and now it has doubled in less than that. We call that exxxxpooooo-nennnnncheeellllll growth. The Saudi's call it a new 747 with King Faud memorial golden bede's.
I return to you now at the turning of the tide.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby darren » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 20:08:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('therealtruth', 'T')hese prices are pure speculation and have absolutely nothing to do with the underlying fundamentals of the market!


Krugman had an interesting observation recently: there is a certain kind of person who is absolutely sure that oil is 'just a bubble', and housing isn't.

The realists, on the other hand, figured all along that housing was a bubble, and the oil price increase was the real deal.

Start of the end times? 8O
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby meemoe_uk » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 20:40:04

Woah, that was a fast $10 rise. I'm wondering if it is the exponential rise characteristic of demand overtaking supply. A few months ago when we broke $90, some well informed member matter of factly stated it wouldn't go past $100 for a few months, His reason involved crack spreads and tech talk. I didn't understand it. But he was right. I wonder what he thinks of the current situation. Is $120 possible before April? Or will the same crack spread stuff get in the way again till summer?
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby therealtruth » Wed 12 Mar 2008, 21:34:32

[/quote]
the oil market doesn't really work like that
it's not like the stock market
when you buy crude futures you will have to take delivery of the crude, or sell to someone who can. Therefore the likelyhood of a bubble, will be short lived at most.[/quote]



I'm just curious how you came up with the conclusion that because the oil market is not like the stock market that prices can't come down? There is nothing written in stone that says you have to take delivery on a contract! You think the average Joe speculating in oil is taking delivery on 1000 barrels of oil? I think not! In fact the whole point of speculators being in the futures market is to add liquidity to the markets so it is easy to get in and out of a contract. So you're theory is incorrect! Look I'm in the business so I've seen both sides and I'm telling you when everybody starts jumping on the bandwagon, thats when the smart money gets out and the rug gets pulled from underneath all the late comers! I've seen it happen even to Hegde Funds with billions of dollars look up Amaranth and Mother Rock see what happen to them in the energy markets!!
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby Zardoz » Thu 13 Mar 2008, 01:12:17

Indonesian Tapis now at $111.85 on the spot market.
"Thank you for attending the oil age. We're going to scrape what we can out of these tar pits in Alberta and then shut down the machines and turn out the lights. Goodnight." - seldom_seen
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby Gandalf_the_White » Thu 13 Mar 2008, 01:26:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('therealtruth', '<')/div>
the oil market doesn't really work like that
it's not like the stock market
when you buy crude futures you will have to take delivery of the crude, or sell to someone who can. Therefore the likelyhood of a bubble, will be short lived at most.[/quote]



I'm just curious how you came up with the conclusion that because the oil market is not like the stock market that prices can't come down? There is nothing written in stone that says you have to take delivery on a contract! You think the average Joe speculating in oil is taking delivery on 1000 barrels of oil? I think not! In fact the whole point of speculators being in the futures market is to add liquidity to the markets so it is easy to get in and out of a contract. So you're theory is incorrect! Look I'm in the business so I've seen both sides and I'm telling you when everybody starts jumping on the bandwagon, thats when the smart money gets out and the rug gets pulled from underneath all the late comers! I've seen it happen even to Hegde Funds with billions of dollars look up Amaranth and Mother Rock see what happen to them in the energy markets!![/quote]

So you think it is coming back down? I would be surprised about that, if it pops back $5 or $10 and then creeps around between $97 and $105 for a while hows is that different than what we have now really. Certainly no different at all to the common man. Well, its a prognos, and if that is your line of sight, we'll see if it will happen. I think it will touch $115 before we see $100 again. In fact I am expecting the next two years to be the time when eveyone on earth finally admits that oil supply is not going to increase dramatically above 85 mbpd ever. That too is a hunch.

I do enjoy reading the different perspectives from people in different fields though. I have no doubt that alot of people have lost their shirts in the energy markets, and in all the markets. It is hard for an amateur to beat a professional in any field, thus we have the term pro.
I return to you now at the turning of the tide.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby lowem » Thu 13 Mar 2008, 08:50:07

NYMEX crude just went vertical. $110.65 and going.

Gold at $996+ and looks like it could make a run for $1000.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby kilik » Thu 13 Mar 2008, 08:56:21

$110.68

I think we will see some profit taking around $115, but it will definitely not go below $100.
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby lowem » Thu 13 Mar 2008, 11:18:55

Crude oil just hit $110.70.

And gold just hit $1000 !!
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby kilik » Thu 13 Mar 2008, 12:14:01

$110.90
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby chris-h » Thu 13 Mar 2008, 12:14:30

88822-88822=0
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Re: Another Record

Unread postby lowem » Thu 13 Mar 2008, 12:33:43

Wow. Guess it didn't want to stop at $110 huh.
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