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Amish Under Fire
Re: Amish Under Fire
by Pretorian » Mon 14 Jun 2010, 16:17:46
Pops mind me asking how much profit per acre a diary /beef farmer can get in your area?
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Re: Amish Under Fire
by pup55 » Tue 15 Jun 2010, 08:19:02
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')heir cows generate heaps of manure that easily washes into streams and flows onward into the Chesapeake Bay.
1. My guess is if you told them that their fertilizer was washing into the streams, the industrious Amish would exert a lot of effort to keep it from happening. They hate to waste fertilizer.
2. How do you distinguish Amish BS from white man BS? Surely the non-Amish farmers in the area generate just as much pollution or more.
3. What's worse, a little livestock-generated effluent, or having your river system glow in the dark, like it is in Iowa, courtesy of Monsanto-derived pesticides and other stuff pumped into the groundwater?
http://cdn.publicinterestnetwork.org/assets/fd87b55f901d776fb48c14a681b63a34/Industrial-Pollution-in-Iowa-Waterways.pdf
4. If you had taken the same measurements in 1910, the "good old days" before the invention of the Ford Tractor, what would have been the outcome?
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Re: Amish Under Fire
by thesmallr » Tue 15 Jun 2010, 10:47:22
Being related to Amish by marriage, I can tell you that the typical Amish farmer raises somewhere between 20-30 head of cattle, but not all Amish farms raise livestock, or that many head of cattle. Assuming one of three Amish farms in Lancaster raises cattle (for one example), that averages to 10 head per farm (5,000 farms noted in the article), or 50,000 cattle over a county of 607,398 acres, or a ratio of .08 head/acre.
According to the University of Nebraska at Lincoln, the average commercial feedlot raises 10,000 cattle on 80 acres, or 125 head/acre.
You tell me where the real transgressions are being committed. The Amish have been attacked because they are politically powerless. The EPA is using this as a ruse to turn our attention away from the politically powerful commercial operators.
www.the-small-r.com
According to the University of Nebraska at Lincoln, the average commercial feedlot raises 10,000 cattle on 80 acres, or 125 head/acre.
You tell me where the real transgressions are being committed. The Amish have been attacked because they are politically powerless. The EPA is using this as a ruse to turn our attention away from the politically powerful commercial operators.
www.the-small-r.com
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Re: Amish Under Fire
by Pops » Tue 15 Jun 2010, 13:35:22
Seventeen of 25 Amish farms visited had runoff problems.
What part of that statement upsets you people so much?
What part of that statement upsets you people so much?
The legitimate object of government, is to do for a community of people, whatever they need to have done, but can not do, at all, or can not, so well do, for themselves -- in their separate, and individual capacities.
-- Abraham Lincoln, Fragment on Government (July 1, 1854)
-- Abraham Lincoln, Fragment on Government (July 1, 1854)
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Re: Amish Under Fire
by Pops » Tue 15 Jun 2010, 14:29:39
how much profit per acre a diary /beef farmer can get in your area?
It's not easy to generalize because this area is so varied soil-wise but the stats say there are .3 head/farm acre in this county including both cows and calves. This county is always one of the top calf producers in MO and Mo is only second to TX in calves.
Right now dairies are going "Teats-Up" all over the place. I think rule of thumb is milk needs to be at least 3x grain costs to break even. I think it's in the $12-$14 hwt area and corn is $3.50-$4. Not as bad as it was but what hurts now is it is really hard to get any operating money - loose lending to farmers caused the recession ya know, and after a couple really bad years people are in a bind.
There is a big push from the NRCS, Extensions, etc toward pasture based dairies in MO, lots of grass dairies coming here from New Zealand.
Land is pretty cheap here <$3k/ac, that's the main thing, still the stats say:
171ac. avg size farm
$59,000 avg income
$55,000 avg expense
Lots and lots of part time farmers here, making just enough to keep uncle sam off their backs while they pay the place down.
It's not easy to generalize because this area is so varied soil-wise but the stats say there are .3 head/farm acre in this county including both cows and calves. This county is always one of the top calf producers in MO and Mo is only second to TX in calves.
Right now dairies are going "Teats-Up" all over the place. I think rule of thumb is milk needs to be at least 3x grain costs to break even. I think it's in the $12-$14 hwt area and corn is $3.50-$4. Not as bad as it was but what hurts now is it is really hard to get any operating money - loose lending to farmers caused the recession ya know, and after a couple really bad years people are in a bind.
There is a big push from the NRCS, Extensions, etc toward pasture based dairies in MO, lots of grass dairies coming here from New Zealand.
Land is pretty cheap here <$3k/ac, that's the main thing, still the stats say:
171ac. avg size farm
$59,000 avg income
$55,000 avg expense
Lots and lots of part time farmers here, making just enough to keep uncle sam off their backs while they pay the place down.
The legitimate object of government, is to do for a community of people, whatever they need to have done, but can not do, at all, or can not, so well do, for themselves -- in their separate, and individual capacities.
-- Abraham Lincoln, Fragment on Government (July 1, 1854)
-- Abraham Lincoln, Fragment on Government (July 1, 1854)
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