[Graeme]

I don't think you can dismiss the entire phenomena as religion. Certainly there is that aspect. But there are other explanations. Here is one for some UFO's:

Geophysical variables and behavior: XXIII. Relations between UFO reports within the Uinta Basin and local seismicity.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A') strong temporal correlation was found between the numbers of reports of UFOs (unidentified flying objects) and nearby seismic activity within the Uinta Basin for the year 1967. The numbers of UFO reports per month during this classic UFO flap were correlated 0.80 with the sum of the earthquake magnitudes per month for events within 150 km of the report area. Numbers of UFO reports were not correlated significantly with earthquake activity at distances greater than 150 km but less than 250 km away. The strongest correlation occurred between UFO reports and nearby seismic activity within the same month but not for previous or consequent months. Close scrutiny of daily shifts in epicenters and reports of UFOs indicate that they occurred when the locus of successive epicenters shifted across the area. These analyses were interpreted as support for the existence of strain fields whose movements generate natural phenomena that are reported as UFOs.

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Olaf', 'I') don't see how wanting to see a little proof means someone is presenting a 'retarded argument'.

No I haven't watched video you posted. I'll watch it later since you think it is the grail. I doubt it will impact me much, because I already believe that alien craft COULD be out there.

Your argument seems flawed to me in that you could argue it from any topic that people don't believe in.

Don't believe in God. Want credible proof. Sorry, that argument is retarded. Any credible scientists, priests, researchers will just present information flawed to my paradigm so I will disregard it.

Don't believe in global climate change...

ad infinitum.

What your logic discounts is someone's ability to change an open mind.

[yeahbut]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Olaf', 'I') don't see how wanting to see a little proof means someone is presenting a 'retarded argument'.

[Olaf]

I watched the video. In fact, I went on to watch about 6 more just for the sake of it. The astronaut comes across as a credible eyewitness, but it isn't enough on its own. Now, if someone had a copy of that video he says they filmed of the ship landing directly in front of them and taking off again, that would be something.

Olaf

[Maddog78]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('yeahbut', ' ')Hopefully it's just something you reserved for me, rather than anyone who expresses some scepticism about something you are convinced of.

[TWilliam]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tanada', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Graeme', '
')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'D')r. Peter Sturrock also polled the membership of the American Astronomical Society and found that "the greater the amount of time one spent on reading UFO-related material, the more likely one is to accept their reality" [2](p. 210).

[TWilliam]

Speaking of religion and UFOs, George Carlin once made some rather interesting observations with regard to the treatment of the two subjects by the press:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('George Carlin', 'I') find it discouraging and a bit depressing when I notice the unequal treatment afforded by the media to UFO believers on the one hand, and on the other, to those who believe in an invisible supreme being who inhabits the sky. Especially as the latter belief applies to the whole Jesus-Messiah-Son-of-God fable.

You may have noticed that, in the media, UFO believers are usually referred to as buffs, a term used to diminish and marginalize them by relegating them to the ranks of hobbyists and mere enthusiasts. They are made to seem like kooks and quaint dingbats who have the nerve to believe that, in an observable universe of trillions upon trillions of stars, and most likely many hundreds of billions of potentially inhabitable planets, some of those planets may have produced life-forms capable of doing things that we can't do.

On the other hand, those who believe in an eternal, all-powerful being --a being who demands to be loved and adored unconditionally
and who punishes and rewards according to his whims-- are thought to be worthy, upright, credible people. This, in spite of the large
numbers of believers who are clearly close-minded fanatics.

To my way of thinking, there is every bit as much evidence for the existence of UFOs as there is for the existence of God. Probably far
more. At least in the case of UFOs there have been countless taped and filmed and (by the way) unexplained sightings from all over the world, along with documented radar evidence seen by experienced military and civilian radar operators.

This does not even begin to include the widespread testimony of not only highly trained, experienced military and civilian pilots who
are selected for their jobs, in part, for their above-average eyesight and mental stability, but also of equally well-trained,
experienced law-enforcement officers. Such pilots and law-enforcement people are known to be serious, sober individuals who
would have quite a bit to lose were they to be associated with anything resembling kooky, outlandish beliefs. Nonetheless, they
have taken the risk of revealing their experiences because they are convinced they have seen something objectively real that they
consider important. All of these accounts are ignored by the media.

Granted, the world of UFO-belief has its share of kooks, nuts and fringe people, but have you ever listened to some of these religious
true-believers? Have you ever heard of any extreme, bizarre behavior and outlandish claims associated with religious zealots? Could any
of them be considered kooks, nuts or dingbats? A fair person would have to say yes.

But the marginal people in these two groups don't matter in this argument. What matters is the prejudice and superstition built into
the media coverage of the two sets of beliefs. One is treated reverently and accepted as received truth, the other is treated
laughingly and dismissed out of hand.

As evidence of the above premise, I offer one version of a typical television news story heard each year on the final Friday of Lent:

"Today is Good Friday, observed by Christians worldwide as a day that commemorates the crucifixion of Jesus Christ, the Son of God,
whose death redeemed the sins of mankind."

Here is the way it should be written:

"Today is Good Friday, observed worldwide by Jesus buffs as the day on which the popular, bearded cultural figure, sometimes referred to as The Messiah, was allegedly crucified and, according to legend, died for mankind's so-called sins. Today kicks off a `holy' weekend that culminates on Easter Sunday, when, it is widely believed, this dead 'savior' --who also, by the way, claimed to be the son of a sky-dwelling, invisible being known as God-- mysteriously `rose from the dead.'

"According to the legend, by volunteering to be killed and actually going through with it, Jesus saved every person who has ever lived
and every person who ever will live from an eternity of suffering in a fiery region popularly known as hell, providing so the story goes
that the person to be 'saved' firmly believes this rather fanciful tale."

That would be an example of unbiased news reporting. Don't wait around for it to happen. The aliens will land first.

[ian807]

One person's invisible friend is as good as another (absent of instructions to kill others, of course).

[threadbear]

Hi TWilliam-Great quote from Carlin. Thanks for that. A person's ability to think outside the mainstream, or rationally, hinges on what has been termed Positive Disintegration. Have you heard of this before? I don't know how I came upon it, but it dovetails with some of Jung's theories of personality development and the process of individuation. I no longer try to reason with people who are frozen in the primary integration stage. I'm getting to the point where I think. "Sweet, clever little monkeys....now there, there, run along now." They can have IQ's of 150 or higher, but if they are frozen perceptually in a primary stage of development, it doesn't matter. They don't and most likely won't "get it". They're consensual delusion "buffs" We're ahead of the curve. They're behind it.

Positive Disintegration:
The Theory of Positive Disintegration (TPD) by Kazimierz Dąbrowski describes a theory of personality development. Unlike mainstream psychology, Dąbrowski's theoretical framework views psychological tension and anxiety as necessary for growth. These "disintegrative" processes are therefore seen as "positive," whereas people who fail to go through positive disintegration may remain for their entire lives in a state of "primary integration." Advancing into disintegration and into the higher levels of development is predicated on having developmental potential, including overexcitabilities, above-average reactions to stimuli. Unlike some other theories of development such as Erikson's stages of psychosocial development, it is not assumed that even a majority of people progress through all levels. TPD is not a theory of stages, and levels do not correlate with age.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Positive_Disintegration

[Graeme]

Just watched TV3 60 minutes program about UFO's. All people interviewed believed they saw objects flown by intelligent "pilots". These included airline pilots, politicans, airforce military personnel. The most credible imagery were multiple crafts budding off a mother ship photographed in Mexico. Another filmed in Arizona was huge - thousands of feet long - with a row of bright lights along the front of the craft.

My wife said what I was thinking that they may be our future selves coming back to the past. How is that for a wild idea.

[Graeme]

Why the UFO Cover-Up Will Continue

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he push is on around the world to get governments to come clean on UFOs. Britain, France, Brazil and others have released some files. But getting the governments to tell us what is happening in our skies will not happen.

Most people in the world believe that we are not being told the truth about UFOs. But for some people, they must have governments tell them that there is something more to the UFO phenomenon. I guess that will make it real for them, even though their governments lie and engage in deception continually.

Think about it.

Even after a massive UFO sighting in Phoenix in 1997 by many of its inhabitants. The US government acted as if nothing happened.

....The Phoenix Lights (sometimes referred to as the "lights over Phoenix") were a series of widely sighted optical phenomena (generally unidentified flying objects) that occurred in the skies over the U.S. states of Arizona and Nevada, and the Mexican state of Sonora on March 13, 1997. A repeat of the lights occurred February 6, 2007, and was filmed by the local Fox News TV station....(source: wikipedia)

After a city of 2 million and a great deal of the American Southwest had an incident involving an armada of UFOs, there was no word from the American government on what happened.

[Graeme]

ET, phone Brussels: EU calls for opening UFO data

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')BRUSSELS — E.T., phone Brussels.

A European Union lawmaker urged member governments Tuesday to open their secret files on UFOs, saying people need to know about close encounters of the third kind.

Mario Borghezio, an Italian member of the European Parliament, told The Associated Press in an e-mail Tuesday that the EU needs its own "X Files" archive where anyone can see information on UFOs — including data gathered by the military. Borghezio said all European governments should go public and stop what he called a "systematic cover-up."

Opening the files is not unprecedented: Last year, Britain published 4,000 pages online on 800 alleged encounters with aliens during the 1980s and 1990s. And over the past three years the British defense ministry has been gradually releasing previously secret UFO papers after facing Freedom of Information demands.

Borghezio also said it is essential to have a scientific center to research unidentified flying objects. Its investigations could have "major scientific and technological spinoffs," he said.

"I think that, under the principle of transparency, the EU member states have a duty to make public and available to all scientific data on UFOs which today are partially or wholly withheld," he wrote in the e-mail.

He is seeking the support of other lawmakers from the 736-member assembly for a statement calling on governments to act.

So far, though, he's collected only 18 signatures.

[Graeme]

UN to appoint Earth contact for aliens

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he United Nations is set to appoint Earth's first contact for any aliens that may come visiting.

Obscure Malaysian astrophysicist Mazlan Othman, the head of the UN's little-known Office for Outer Space Affairs, is to describe her potential new role at a scientific conference next week, news.com.au reports.

Othman is scheduled to talk about the recent discovery of hundreds of planets around other stars, which she says has made the detection of extraterrestrial life more likely than ever before.

She was recently quoted as saying in a talk to other scientists: "The continued search for extraterrestrial communication, by several entities, sustains the hope that some day humankind will receive signals from extraterrestrials.

"When we do, we should have in place a coordinated response that takes into account all the sensitivities related to the subject. The UN is a ready-made mechanism for such coordination.

She attended the University of Otago in 1975 earning a Bachelor of Science (honours).

[Graeme]

Otago graduate not alien contact

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'E')T - phone Mazlan Othman on extension 8118.

For a fleeting few moments in space and time, the world believed the University of Otago physics PhD graduate was the United Nations' first official point of contact for extra-terrestrials visiting Earth.

Alas, it was not true - at least, not in this universe.

Earlier this week, the Sunday Times in Britain ran a report on the Malaysian astrophysicist who is the head of the United Nations' Office for Outer Space Affairs (UNOOSA).

The publication claimed she would be officially announced as the UN's ambassador to visiting little green men, at next week's meeting of the Royal Society in Buckinghamshire.

As a result, Prof Othman found herself in the media's tractor beam from all corners of the globe - many taking the report seriously, others more cynically.

However, the agency, a little-known branch of the United Nations General Assembly, based in Vienna, Austria, termed the report "nonsense", and Prof Othman herself has dispelled the myth.

"It sounds really cool, but I have to deny it," she told The Star newspaper in Malaysia.

[Expatriot]

This reminds me of that scene from Aliens - "I say we take off and nuke the entire site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure."

If aliens have gotten here, we are like monkeys to them, so there is nothing to worry about - they will do what they want with us. Fears of being eaten and having them fornicate with our females are just our silly primal instincts coming out.

Really, our only fear should be that they've been observing us and have, rightfully, concluded that we, as a species, are pathogenic killers, and they decide to . . . take off and nuke the planet - it's the only way to be sure these humans don't spread.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aCbfMkh940Q

[EnergyUnlimited]

There may be some nice ideas to keep mobs busy with UFO while economy is crumbling.
Perhaps enough of fake documents will be released to secure additional powers for UN and various local TPTB and extend a life of existing social order for a while more.

[ian807]

Is there anyone else here who just finds the whole thing to be a bit of a giggle?

[highlander]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Graeme', 'M')y wife said what I was thinking that they may be our future selves coming back to the past. How is that for a wild idea.

[Graeme]

ET machines sought by astronomer

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'O')ur idea of extraterrestrial life has changed drastically in 100 years, but our search strategies have not kept up. In his upcoming paper “What ET will look like and why should we care?” for the November-December issue of Acta Astronautica, Shostak argues that SETI might be more successful if it shifts the search away from biology and focuses squarely on artificial intelligence. Shostak sees a clear distinction between life and intelligence: he says we should be searching for extraterrestrial machines.

“The continued exponential growth in computer power implies that even consumer-grade computers will have the processing power of a human brain by the year 2040,” he says.

If and when we do create true AI, it would surpass us quickly. An AI would have the power to self-direct its own evolution.

“If we build a machine with the intellectual capability of one human, then within 5 years, its successor is more intelligent than all humanity combined,” he says.

The window between a society’s technological birth and its shift to artificial intelligence is amazingly small.


ET machines would be infinitely more intelligent and durable than the biological intelligence that invented them. Intelligent machines would in a sense be immortal, or at least indefinitely repairable, and would not need to exist in the biologically hospitable “Goldilocks Zone” most SETI searches focus on. An AI could self-direct its own evolution. Every new instance of an AI would be created with the sum total of its predecessor’s knowledge preloaded.

[Graeme]

Well, this story is far from a cover-up. Contact with aliens is now a serious scientific topic and this issue has been published in a respected journal!

Earth must prepare for close encounter with aliens, say scientists

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')orld governments should prepare a co-ordinated action plan in case Earth is contacted by aliens, according to scientists.

Scientists argue that a branch of the UN must be given responsibility for "supra-Earth affairs" and formulate a plan for how to deal with extraterrestrials, should they appear.

The comments are part of an extraterrestrial-themed edition of the Philosophical Transactions of the Royal Society A published today. In it, scientists examine all aspects of the search for extraterrestrial life, from astronomy and biology to the political and religious fallout that would result from alien contact.

"Will a suitable process based on expert advice from proper and responsible scientists arise at all, or will interests of power and opportunism more probably set the scene?" asked Professor John Zarnecki of the Open University and Dr Martin Dominik of the University of St Andrews in the introductory paper. "A lack of co-ordination can be avoided by creating an overarching framework in a truly global effort governed by an international politically legitimated body." The pair argue that the UN has a ready-made mechanism for such a forum in its Committee on the Peaceful Uses of Outer Space (Copuos).

Member states of Copuos should put "supra-Earth affairs" on their agenda, say the scientists, and establish structures similar to those proposed for dealing with threats from near-Earth objects, such as asteroids, that might be on a collision course with our planet.

According to Simon Conway Morris, a professor of evolutionary palaeobiology at Cambridge University, anyone planning for alien contact should prepare for the worst.