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Postby Specop_007 » Tue 03 May 2005, 00:53:28

Rerere, you do an amazing job of copy and paste. Where do you find all of that?

Your obviously just doing this to start argument and are (As usual among liberals) so blinded by hate and rage you couldnt see truth if it bit you in the ass.

Is there any logical level headed individual who wants to discuss why the Geneva Convention doesnt apply?

*EDIT*
And just to show I'm not dodging the subject, you can even use the information re was so kind enough to look up.
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Postby threadbear » Tue 03 May 2005, 01:04:41

Speccop, We're talking about the rape of innocent civilians here, Speccop. In what way is this a liberal issue and why do you bring this up? It has nothing to do with anything. You may as well be launching a defence of Charles Manson along party lines. How abundantly stupid, morally bereft, and completely lacking in courage. God, I'm glad it's an act.
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Postby rerere » Tue 03 May 2005, 01:27:54

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'R')erere, you do an amazing job of copy and paste. Where do you find all of that?


The links that I gave. Not that facts have ever stopped you in the past.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')Your obviously just doing this to start argument


No, I'm doing a good job of showing anyone reading this thread that your position is wrong.



$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 's')o blinded by hate and rage you couldnt see truth if it bit you in the ass.


Self-describing your existance?


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')Is there any logical level headed individual who wants to discuss why the Geneva Convention doesnt apply?


The President of the United States says Geneva Convention applies in Iraq. So does Mr. Rumsfeld. Just because YOU are uninformed and you expressed an uninformed opinion, does not make your opinion correct.

But feel free to come up with official US Government documents that support your position, as I have done.

(edited to quote Specop_007 correctly)
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Postby rerere » Tue 03 May 2005, 01:38:04

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'S')peccop, We're talking about the rape of innocent civilians here, Speccop. In what way is this a liberal issue


He's hoping by saying the word 'liberal' magical powers will defend his position. Or a few posters will come in and pat him on the back and say 'good job'. Because there are still a bunch of people who think in terms of simple labels like 'liberal' or 'conserative' - and SpecOP_007 is one of these feeble-minded folk.

Go back thru his early posts - if SpecOP_007 didn't like what someone said they were a 'dirty hippy'.
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Postby rerere » Tue 03 May 2005, 01:51:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Hawkcreek', '
')Yeah, he may be trying to align himself with the coporate bastards who think like that. May save him when the SHTF.


The kind of people who are going to be 'over' us don't bother reading this place. And as a toady, SpecOP_007 shows poor toading skills. Not consistant in his world POV - unless that POV is what is in his head.

As a toady, his head's contents are useless, he's got to adopt to his masters message.
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Postby Specop_007 » Tue 03 May 2005, 03:10:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'S')peccop, We're talking about the rape of innocent civilians here, Speccop. In what way is this a liberal issue and why do you bring this up? It has nothing to do with anything. You may as well be launching a defence of Charles Manson along party lines. How abundantly stupid, morally bereft, and completely lacking in courage. God, I'm glad it's an act.


Because, take a comparison of liberals vs conservatives on the issue.
Liberals take issue to the fact we got them naked or whatever. But not once does a liberal say "Jeez, ya know...Would I rather be raped or have my picture taken in the nude, or get my head cut off with a rusty knife...Hmmmm"
Whereas conservatives will say "Hey, rape sucks yeah, but they didnt get their HEAD CUT OFF"

Liberals somehow (conveniently, as usual) overlook what the other guy is doing no matter how hienous or how horrible, and focus only on the stuff we (America) do, no matter how insignifigant. If we treated those prisoners completely according to the law of the land, liberals would STILL bitch because the prisoners dont have cable TV, or didnt get steaks for dinner. Whereas how are prisoners are treated by the terrorists...You know, stuff like being EXECUTED, liberals dont even bat an eyebrow to that.

Why is that? Why in the fuck is the big issue what takes place in OUR prisons, and not the inhumane treatment of our prisoners by the enemy? What would YOU prefer, raped/naked pictures or getting your head removed from your shoulders?
Have you seen the videos? Have you heard the guys moan and gurgle? That makes rape or naked pictures or standing on a chair in a cold shower look like a week vacation in the Marriott.
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Postby Specop_007 » Tue 03 May 2005, 03:11:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rerere', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'S')peccop, We're talking about the rape of innocent civilians here, Speccop. In what way is this a liberal issue


He's hoping by saying the word 'liberal' magical powers will defend his position. Or a few posters will come in and pat him on the back and say 'good job'. Because there are still a bunch of people who think in terms of simple labels like 'liberal' or 'conserative' - and SpecOP_007 is one of these feeble-minded folk.

Go back thru his early posts - if SpecOP_007 didn't like what someone said they were a 'dirty hippy'.


No, there a dirty hippy because they think standing around naked with a bag on their head is inhumane treatment, but getting your head cut off is A-Ok.
Thats a start. Maybe I'm tired of people hating America just to hate America. Talk about living with the blinders on.

And then we move on to people like you. But thats a issue for another time.
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Postby Specop_007 » Tue 03 May 2005, 03:13:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rerere', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'R')erere, you do an amazing job of copy and paste. Where do you find all of that?


The links that I gave. Not that facts have ever stopped you in the past.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')Your obviously just doing this to start argument


No, I'm doing a good job of showing anyone reading this thread that your position is wrong.



$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 's')o blinded by hate and rage you couldnt see truth if it bit you in the ass.


Self-describing your existance?


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')Is there any logical level headed individual who wants to discuss why the Geneva Convention doesnt apply?


The President of the United States says Geneva Convention applies in Iraq. So does Mr. Rumsfeld. Just because YOU are uninformed and you expressed an uninformed opinion, does not make your opinion correct.

But feel free to come up with official US Government documents that support your position, as I have done.

(edited to quote Specop_007 correctly)

I wasnt going to respond, but I just have to.

Since you believe what the President says (You admitted as much in your last sentence...Not changing your stance on me are you?) then obviously you agree that we needed to go to war, and that 9/11 isnt a consipracy theory.

I'll be damned. Did you finally see the light?! 8O
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Postby Specop_007 » Tue 03 May 2005, 03:18:41

And for the record, alot of you ARE still dirty hippies.
The difference is, and pay close attention here......If *I* make fun of *YOU*, then Monte breaks out his sword and goes on a Crusade against me. But if *YOU* make fun of *ME*.....Not one peep from the admins. Pretty funny eh?
Not suprising. You know why? Heres the big kicker. And trust me here, it happens on alot of liberal minded forums, I see it day in and day out.
Liberals LOVE to tout the First Amendment, Freedom of Speech. But, only so long as you share their common beliefs. So, if I shared the same view as the rest of the liberal community here, I could go on and on and on and say whatever I wanted to about America, Republicans etc etc. But the minute a "not assimilated" individual (me, Libertarian) goes against the grain and speaks negatively about another country (France) or the people here (Liberals)
WHOA!! CANT HAVE THAT!!

But I'm not angry, not by any stretch. It just confirms my belief that liberals, and the Democratic Party at large, give not a shit about rights or freedoms, but only in conforming to their views and buying into thier lies.
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Postby smallpoxgirl » Tue 03 May 2005, 03:34:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'L')iberals somehow (conveniently, as usual) overlook what the other guy is doing no matter how hienous or how horrible, and focus only on the stuff we (America) do, no matter how insignifigant.


Specop. I think you are failing to understand one very basic difference between "The Terrorists" and the Americans. THEY LIVE THERE! If someone invaded your home, stripped you naked, made you pose for pictures, and then raped you, you would not hesitate one minute if you got a chance to behead them. Would you?

As for moderators sticking up for you, you seemed like you were doing a pretty good job of sticking up for yourself. Maybe I'm wrong, but I didn't get the sense that you needed my help.
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Postby Specop_007 » Tue 03 May 2005, 03:52:04

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'L')iberals somehow (conveniently, as usual) overlook what the other guy is doing no matter how hienous or how horrible, and focus only on the stuff we (America) do, no matter how insignifigant.


Specop. I think you are failing to understand one very basic difference between "The Terrorists" and the Americans. THEY LIVE THERE! If someone invaded your home, stripped you naked, made you pose for pictures, and then raped you, you would not hesitate one minute if you got a chance to behead them. Would you?

As for moderators sticking up for you, you seemed like you were doing a pretty good job of sticking up for yourself. Maybe I'm wrong, but I didn't get the sense that you needed my help.


Let me get this right.....
So, its ok that they are cutting off heads. Thats what your saying?
So, naked pictures and whatnot bother you, but cutting off heads doesnt??
What the hell kind of weird logic is that??
Am i missing something here.....I have to be....Clue me in, what is it?

And your right, I dont need the mods to stick up for me, and wouldnt ask them to. I'm pointing out how "you guys" can say whatever you want about me, but I cannot do likewise.
A double standard if you will.
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Postby smallpoxgirl » Tue 03 May 2005, 05:59:28

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'S')o, naked pictures and whatnot bother you, but cutting off heads doesnt??
What the hell kind of weird logic is that??
Am i missing something here.....I have to be....Clue me in, what is it?

What bothers me is people being invaded and humiliated, having their homes trashed and their children blown up by a hostile nation out to steal their oil.

If "the terrorists" invaded your home and blew up your children, you'd be out to decapitate some mother F-ers, and I'd support you. But that's not the scenario. You're invading their home and blowing up their kids, and I don't have much problem with almost anything they do to get you out.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'A')nd your right, I dont need the mods to stick up for me, and wouldnt ask them to. I'm pointing out how "you guys" can say whatever you want about me, but I cannot do likewise.
A double standard if you will.

In all fairness Specop, I think you give as good as you get. I wouldn't get too deep in the self pitty.
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Postby rerere » Tue 03 May 2005, 09:00:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'B')ecause, take a comparison of liberals vs conservatives on the issue.
Liberals take issue to the fact we got them naked or whatever.


Do I need ot re-quote Warner and Rumsfeld on this issue? Or is Warner/Rumsfeld now "liberals"?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')Why is that? Why in the fuck is the big issue what takes place in OUR prisons, and not the inhumane treatment of our prisoners by the enemy?


So blind, so wrapped up in your own hate. So unaware.

I'll state it again.

Your position is for the US of A to not occupy the moral high ground, but to instead wollow in the gutter with others.

Embrace that you were wrong about the application of the Geneva Convention.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')What would YOU prefer, raped/naked pictures or getting your head removed from your shoulders?


We know what SpecOp_007 perfers. Neither. SpecOP_007 sits at his keyboard, far from the risk.
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Postby CarnbY » Tue 03 May 2005, 09:06:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'B')ecause, take a comparison of liberals vs conservatives on the issue.
Liberals take issue to the fact we got them naked or whatever. But not once does a liberal say "Jeez, ya know...Would I rather be raped or have my picture taken in the nude, or get my head cut off with a rusty knife...Hmmmm"
Whereas conservatives will say "Hey, rape sucks yeah, but they didnt get their HEAD CUT OFF"

So you're saying that as long as you don't abuse prisoners as bad as the enemy does it's ok? "Sure, I cut his fingers off, but at least I didn't take his head, ain't I a nice guy?" And are you so naive that you think undressing people and putting hoods on their heads is the worst thing that ever happened in Abu Ghraib? Let me give you an example from a NYT article (free registration required):
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n November 2003, after several months in Nasiriya in southern Iraq, the 320th was redeployed to Abu Ghraib. The violence there was sickening, Mr. Delgado said. Some inmates were beaten nearly to death.

and
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'M')r. Delgado, who eventually got conscientious objector status and was honorably discharged last January, recalled a disturbance that occurred while he was working in the Abu Ghraib motor pool. Detainees who had been demonstrating over a variety of grievances began throwing rocks at the guards. As the disturbance grew, the Army authorized lethal force. Four detainees were shot to death.

Mr. Delgado confronted a sergeant who, he said, had fired on the detainees. "I asked him," said Mr. Delgado, "if he was proud that he had shot unarmed men behind barbed wire for throwing stones. He didn't get mad at all. He was, like, 'Well, I saw them bloody my buddy's nose, so I knelt down. I said a prayer. I stood up, and I shot them down.' "


Of course decapitations and torture done by terrorists are horrible acts, but these terrorists aren't the ones attacking other countries claiming to be liberators and defenders of freedom and democracy. Defending barbaric acts performed by the US military by comparing them to acts of terrorists is only indicative of a simple mind and lack of morals.
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Postby rerere » Tue 03 May 2005, 09:06:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'I')n all fairness Specop, I think you give as good as you get. I wouldn't get too deep in the self pitty.


Actaully, SpecOP_007 doesn't give as good as he gets. SpecOP_007 gets actual facts, actual legal arguments and actual logic. SpecOP_007 GIVES hand waving and whining.

When SpecOP_007 is shown to be wrong, he whines to the authory figures.
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Postby Doly » Tue 03 May 2005, 09:08:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '[')What would YOU prefer, raped/naked pictures or getting your head removed from your shoulders?


A couple of precisions:

1) As far as I know, nobody claims that anybody went to the USA to remove anybody's head from their shoulders.
2) The video of the guy whose head was cut, according to all medical experts, was dead already by the time the head was cut. Otherwise, you get something pretty much like a fountain of blood.
3) There are suspicions that this video was done in the same prison as the naked/raped pictures. At least, they use the same model of chairs in both places.
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Postby rerere » Tue 03 May 2005, 09:32:45

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')I wasnt going to respond, but I just have to.


Your none raging mind over your public embarrsment says no, but your typing fingers say yes, yes you must try to salvage your in-your-mind-rightness.

So, let me slap you about some more...school ya a bit more.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '
')Since you believe what the President says (You admitted as much in your last sentence...Not changing your stance on me are you?) then obviously you agree that we needed to go to war, and that 9/11 isnt a consipracy theory.


I'm all for going to war - lets pay for it however. That has been my position, and continues to be my postion.

Because when the military can't scramble jets to intercept 4 hijacked planes - either the government/military is incompetent or it needs more more for training.
Because the intelligence orginization of the nation believed:
Al tubes for rockets were thought to be for centerfuges
Claimed WMD in Iraq were a immedate threat to the US of A
Forged documents WRT Yellowcake were real
(other stuff I'm just not gonna type because this list is long)
This shows the nation's intelligence needs more money and more ability to be invasive to do their jobs correctly. Mainly more money. Lots of it.

George Bush is a right and just man - but he just doesn't understand that taxes need to be raised to pay for his just and right actions. You need to help him SpecOP_007. You need to write your congressmen and women and get them to raise your taxes. Raise them high! To keep the war machine well fed!

Be sure to call the resulting people who chaffe at more intrusive government data collection cowards. People who want rape rooms, people who want the terrorists to win. And the people who decide they'd rather have their American Dollars in their pockets than feeding the war machine unamerican.

When it costs $27,514,833 to deliver $82,100 in LPG fuel is a very good use of taxpayer dollars, don't you agree SpecOP_007?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'I')'ll be damned. Did you finally see the light?! 8O


That the Geneva Convention DOES apply? Never was in that dark place. When will you remove your head from the dark place where it is wedged and post on how you've read the Geneva Convention and understand your interpertation was flawed due to English not being your 1st language.
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Postby Specop_007 » Tue 03 May 2005, 12:12:31

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('CarnbY', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'B')ecause, take a comparison of liberals vs conservatives on the issue.
Liberals take issue to the fact we got them naked or whatever. But not once does a liberal say "Jeez, ya know...Would I rather be raped or have my picture taken in the nude, or get my head cut off with a rusty knife...Hmmmm"
Whereas conservatives will say "Hey, rape sucks yeah, but they didnt get their HEAD CUT OFF"

So you're saying that as long as you don't abuse prisoners as bad as the enemy does it's ok? "Sure, I cut his fingers off, but at least I didn't take his head, ain't I a nice guy?" And are you so naive that you think undressing people and putting hoods on their heads is the worst thing that ever happened in Abu Ghraib? Let me give you an example from a NYT article (free registration required):
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n November 2003, after several months in Nasiriya in southern Iraq, the 320th was redeployed to Abu Ghraib. The violence there was sickening, Mr. Delgado said. Some inmates were beaten nearly to death.

and
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'M')r. Delgado, who eventually got conscientious objector status and was honorably discharged last January, recalled a disturbance that occurred while he was working in the Abu Ghraib motor pool. Detainees who had been demonstrating over a variety of grievances began throwing rocks at the guards. As the disturbance grew, the Army authorized lethal force. Four detainees were shot to death.

Mr. Delgado confronted a sergeant who, he said, had fired on the detainees. "I asked him," said Mr. Delgado, "if he was proud that he had shot unarmed men behind barbed wire for throwing stones. He didn't get mad at all. He was, like, 'Well, I saw them bloody my buddy's nose, so I knelt down. I said a prayer. I stood up, and I shot them down.' "


Of course decapitations and torture done by terrorists are horrible acts, but these terrorists aren't the ones attacking other countries claiming to be liberators and defenders of freedom and democracy. Defending barbaric acts performed by the US military by comparing them to acts of terrorists is only indicative of a simple mind and lack of morals.


So all terrorists in Iraq are Iraqi's? Interesting, and hear I had heard that the Muslim community was encouraging Muslims from many nations to go (Specifically Saudi Arabia). I'll be damned.

The reason I dont give 1 little itty bitty bit of care to what happens to prisoners we take is because no one gives any bit of care to what happens to our soldiers taken prisoner. Why isnt there just as much outcry against the terrorists as there is against what we've done? Answer me that. Wheres the world to denounce the beheadings, or hanging them from bridges.
Oh sure, maybe a small snippet in a newspaper or something, but OUR prisoner abuse made front page news for weeks.

Its ridiculous, and as such I wish we had done ALOT worse to those towlies we caught.

If your gonna get caught with your hand in the cookie jar, might as well eat all the cookies right?
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Postby Specop_007 » Tue 03 May 2005, 12:15:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'S')o, naked pictures and whatnot bother you, but cutting off heads doesnt??
What the hell kind of weird logic is that??
Am i missing something here.....I have to be....Clue me in, what is it?

What bothers me is people being invaded and humiliated, having their homes trashed and their children blown up by a hostile nation out to steal their oil.

If "the terrorists" invaded your home and blew up your children, you'd be out to decapitate some mother F-ers, and I'd support you. But that's not the scenario. You're invading their home and blowing up their kids, and I don't have much problem with almost anything they do to get you out.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', 'A')nd your right, I dont need the mods to stick up for me, and wouldnt ask them to. I'm pointing out how "you guys" can say whatever you want about me, but I cannot do likewise.
A double standard if you will.

In all fairness Specop, I think you give as good as you get. I wouldn't get too deep in the self pitty.


Homes trashed and children blown up?? Oh please. You jest. This isnt the Gaza strip, we're not running bulldozers. We dont have suicide bombers that specifically and intentionally target schools, bus stops and airplanes. We use multi million dollar precision missles to strike military targets (Well, usually. :oops: )
You've made it sound like we intentionally kill the children. A bit far fetched I should say. As proof that the Iraqi's want us there and appreciate our help, I think one only has to look at the voting results. People risked their LIVES so their voice could be heard. That says something.

And yes, I give every bit to what I get. I dont cry foul and I've never, on any forum I've been on in my life, went to an admin with a problem UNLESS some other person got away with what I couldnt. I dont mind flamefests, I dont mind Gestapo mods. But keep it fair.
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Postby threadbear » Tue 03 May 2005, 12:50:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'S')peccop, We're talking about the rape of innocent civilians here, Speccop. In what way is this a liberal issue and why do you bring this up? It has nothing to do with anything. You may as well be launching a defence of Charles Manson along party lines. How abundantly stupid, morally bereft, and completely lacking in courage. God, I'm glad it's an act.


Because, take a comparison of liberals vs conservatives on the issue.
Liberals take issue to the fact we got them naked or whatever. But not once does a liberal say "Jeez, ya know...Would I rather be raped or have my picture taken in the nude, or get my head cut off with a rusty knife...Hmmmm"
Whereas conservatives will say "Hey, rape sucks yeah, but they didnt get their HEAD CUT OFF"


Liberals somehow (conveniently, as usual) overlook what the other guy is doing no matter how hienous or how horrible, and focus only on the stuff we (America) do, no matter how insignifigant. If we treated those prisoners completely according to the law of the land, liberals would STILL bitch because the prisoners dont have cable TV, or didnt get steaks for dinner. Whereas how are prisoners are treated by the terrorists...You know, stuff like being EXECUTED, liberals dont even bat an eyebrow to that.

Why is that? Why in the fuck is the big issue what takes place in OUR prisons, and not the inhumane treatment of our prisoners by the enemy? What would YOU prefer, raped/naked pictures or getting your head removed from your shoulders?
Have you seen the videos? Have you heard the guys moan and gurgle? That makes rape or naked pictures or standing on a chair in a cold shower look like a week vacation in the Marriott.


The US in the invading force here, Specop. If Russia or China invaded the US, to get rid of George Bush, and then proceeded to round up innocent people, humiliate them, rape them, etc...and you retaliated by catching a Russian and decapitating him, I'd applaud you. Would that be fair? Yes it would.
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