Re: Land redistribution and revolution

by **rangerone314** » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 11:53:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rangerone314', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ReverseEngineer', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'W')e know where you're going to be.

by **rangerone314** » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 12:01:37

You know, with about 290 million acres of arable land left in the US (roughly), that gives about 1 acre per person. I think that should be more than enough, if people move back to the land.

I'm NOT sure what form that will take - given that the people will need to be closer to the land they get food from, given peak oil.

I suppose either we break up all the land so each person gets an acre or people have to move onto existing land to be farmed.

Advantages to being farm workers on a big farm is that you have the expertise of the farmer, since there is probably too much of a learning curve for everyone to go back to growing their own food and doing their own thing.

One thing that does seem a given is that we need more arable land...

Some places, like England, are more screwed than the US in terms of arable land. UK has 1/5 our population but far less than 1/5 our arable land. Mexico, I dunno about...

by **mos6507** » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 14:24:16

When you run your math on acreage per capita, how are you factoring in soil quality? You're just assuming an infinite supply of external fossil fuel fertilizers, etc...? Remove the external inputs and you wind up with 1 acre of useless dustbowl per person.

by **Ludi** » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 17:41:03

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OutOfGas', 'W')hen the masses start pouring out of the cities it will become law of the jungle.

by **rangerone314** » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 17:41:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'W')hen you run your math on acreage per capita, how are you factoring in soil quality? You're just assuming an infinite supply of external fossil fuel fertilizers, etc...? Remove the external inputs and you wind up with 1 acre of useless dustbowl per person.

by **rangerone314** » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 17:45:06

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'W')hen you run your math on acreage per capita, how are you factoring in soil quality? You're just assuming an infinite supply of external fossil fuel fertilizers, etc...? Remove the external inputs and you wind up with 1 acre of useless dustbowl per person.

by **mos6507** » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 17:55:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rangerone314', '
')I'm doing some external outputs here only until I get a fine rotation of legumes & onions going with most of my garden beds.

As far as minerals, compost toilets should do a good job of keeping minerals internal.

It is stupid to flush minerals and nutrients down the toilet, and the replace them with external inputs.

by **oldchuck** » Thu 23 Apr 2009, 22:47:31

6.75 billion people, 290 million acres, etc.etc. These kinds of numbers are really not very useful, hypothetical abstractions at best. Arable land in India is of no use to me, or any particular threat. If I lived near Las Vegas I would be in a big sweat about the water supply. Here, I know where the water comes from and there is plenty. We have no access to natural gas piplines which makes the supply of propane very important. And so forth.

Just as Tip O'Neal said, "All politics are local," so too are all survival situations very, very local.

by **rangerone314** » Mon 27 Apr 2009, 08:38:16

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('seahorse2', 'R')on Paul, US Congressman, talks secession.

http://amfix.blogs.cnn.com/2009/04/21/ron-paul-secession-is-american/

State of Georgia (USA) senate talks about secession.

http://blogs.ajc.com/jay-bookman-blog/2009/04/16/georgia-senate-threatens-dismantling-of-usa/?cxntfid=blogs_jay_bookman_blog

Interesting, when the Fed seems weak, the old rivalries seem to resurface. I guess the old saying "save your confederate dollars" may not have been a joke.

Now, seriously, you just can't make this stuff up and would have seem ludicrous just 2 years ago - these articles are starting to read like something out of the "Onion."

by **rangerone314** » Mon 27 Apr 2009, 08:40:59

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_Annexation

Note the areas outside of Texas: parts of Oklahoma, Kansas, New Mexico, Colorado, Wyoming...

Could be a fairly large country...

by **rangerone314** » Mon 27 Apr 2009, 09:10:45

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('oldchuck', '6').75 billion people, 290 million acres, etc.etc. These kinds of numbers are really not very useful, hypothetical abstractions at best. Arable land in India is of no use to me, or any particular threat. If I lived near Las Vegas I would be in a big sweat about the water supply. Here, I know where the water comes from and there is plenty. We have no access to natural gas piplines which makes the supply of propane very important. And so forth.

Just as Tip O'Neal said, "All politics are local," so too are all survival situations very, very local.

by **mos6507** » Mon 27 Apr 2009, 09:52:58

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rangerone314', '
')I'm blessed to have a lot of water on just 2 1/2 acres... 3 full streams, 1 spring in the woods the results in a short stream that deadends (I'm extending it towards a tiny pond), and 1 spring in the front yard real close to one of the streams.

by **rangerone314** » Mon 27 Apr 2009, 10:02:59

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rangerone314', '
')I'm blessed to have a lot of water on just 2 1/2 acres... 3 full streams, 1 spring in the woods the results in a short stream that deadends (I'm extending it towards a tiny pond), and 1 spring in the front yard real close to one of the streams.

by **Ludi** » Mon 27 Apr 2009, 12:48:55

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', '
')Yes, that oasis ain't gonna be available to everyone. Make sure it's defensible.

by **seahorse2** » Wed 27 May 2009, 16:41:28

One idea to save California from its financial woes is to break it up into four different "states." Interesting -

http://www.breakingviews.com/2009/05/21/California%20break-up.aspx?sg=features

Remember the Russian professor that opined the US would break up due to its financial woes? Maybe he wasn't so far off his rocker. The leading cause of all divorce is financial stress, why would the US as a country be any different?

by **seahorse2** » Thu 28 May 2009, 11:07:21

World Bank warns of social unrest.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')The head of the World Bank has warned that the global economic crisis could lead to serious social upheaval.

"If we do no take measures, there is a risk of a serious human and social crisis with very serious political implications," Robert Zoellick said.

He pointed to Eastern Europe, which faces the "tricky situation" of fast-shrinking economies and protests.

Mr Zoellick suggested governments should start preparing for high levels of unemployment.

"In my opinion, in this context, nobody really knows what is going to happen and the best one can do is be ready for any eventuality," Mr Zoellick said in an interview with Spain's El Pais newspaper.

"There is also what I call the 'X-factor', that one can not foresee," such as the recent outbreak of swine flu, he said.

"Latin America has remained reasonably stable, even if Mexico and Central America are under pressure because they rely a lot on the North American market," Mr Zoellick added.

It was reported last week that Mexico's economy shrank by 8.2% in the first three months of this year compared with a year earlier. Mexico sends 80% of its exports to the US.

Other economies in Eastern Europe have registered double-digit declines in GDP, such as Latvia and Estonia, while the retiring Bank of England rate-setter David Blanchflower has said at least one million more people in the UK will lose their jobs.

The World Bank has previously warned of a "human catastrophe" in the world's poorest countries unless more is done to tackle the global economic crisis.

It said an extra 53 million people are at risk of extreme poverty.

by **seahorse2** » Thu 13 Aug 2009, 12:14:26

Market Watch has article warning of political social unrest by 2012.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A')merica's wealth gap will trigger grass-roots rebellion. Wall Street's greed is so pervasive, gluttonous and obvious the rest will rebel.

by **rangerone314** » Thu 13 Aug 2009, 12:48:36

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ColossalContrarian', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('seahorse2', 'R')ich under attack link

by **rangerone314** » Thu 13 Aug 2009, 12:57:26

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', 'T')hese are all phony rebellions. The people are well fed (some would say too well fed), dispersed, distant from the wealthy classes, and incapable of attaining a reasonable target.
The very structure of the suburbs was designed from scratch to allow for occupation and subjugation by the Rulers. There are no closed quarters (apartment buildings, tight city streets, mountain enclaves, etc.) and the roads were all designed for Maximum Patrol Policies (MPP's)--wide boulevards, sweeping corners (for fast transects), increased visibility (keep your hedges tidy!) gradual topographies, etc.
The only revolution is personal. Learn to knit! Build plywood cutouts of cows for your lawn! Join a Salon and buy books! Consume! There is no Choice!