[Maddog78]

In 30 years of working in the oil industry I've never heard EROEI discussed or even mentioned when it comes to approving or continuing to operate a project.
It's just like rockdoc123 says. Forward economics.

[Maddog78]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kiwichick', 'r')ocdoc

why have so many rigs and projects stopped or been delayed?

[shortonsense]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kiwichick', 'r')ocdoc

why have so many rigs and projects stopped or been delayed?

[shortonsense]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', 'T')his discussion is pointless. I am not going to waste my time defending net energy analysis with you Rockdoc. I can see it is a waste of time.

[shortonsense]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Maddog78', 'I')n 30 years of working in the oil industry I've never heard EROEI discussed or even mentioned when it comes to approving or continuing to operate a project.
It's just like rockdoc123 says. Forward economics.

[TheDude]

Everyone from the energy industry seems to have the same evaluation of EROEI's practicality: This was my initial impression of it as well, that it was popular among the ecological economics crowd but would make precisely no headway among the dollars and cents mindset of big industry. Imagine trying to talk about it at a boardroom full of your fellow six figure earners...it has value for sure but I think it's more productive to reemphasize the need for sustainability for the good of society, instead of trying to get people to wrap their heads around ultimate energy flows. You can reel them in with promises of profits along the way. Cash is king. Nate Hagens says EROEI has essentially no currency among politicians, either, and they're ostensibly the ones who're looking out for our long term well being. I repeat, ostensibly.

Ironically Dave Blume says in his ethanol book that EROEI was a concept cooked up by researchers on Big Oil's payroll to discredit biofuels. I don't think you can make a bioplastics equivalent of a tinfoil hat.

[Blacksmith]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kiwichick', 'r')ocdoc

why have so many rigs and projects stopped or been delayed?

[shortonsense]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', '
')
If the energy required to obtain energy is greater than the energy in the obtained energy source then you stop trying. Let me try it another for the thick of skull.

[Maddog78]

Hahaaa, water under the sand? That's the best you got?


A much better prepared troll? Wow, I made three posts in this thread.
What more do you want? I was relaying my experience based on 30 years of working in the industry.
You're right, this discussion is pointless.
You really think oil cos. say hmmm, can we get more EROEI on this project?

They are in business to make money not improve an EROEI ratio.
If the project makes money, it goes ahead or continues, simple as that.
Call me all the [explicative deleteds] you want, it doesn't change that fact.

[TheAntiDoomer]

oh man p4brains you are just getting mowed down this thread, ouch.

go sit and the corner and think about what you have done:

[rockdoc123]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')f the energy required to obtain energy is greater than the energy in the obtained energy source then you stop trying. Let me try it another for the thick of skull.

[shortonsense]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rockdoc123', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')f the energy required to obtain energy is greater than the energy in the obtained energy source then you stop trying. Let me try it another for the thick of skull.

[dbuckley]

Its amazing how poorly understood EROEI is.

Almost all of the time, EROEI is a complete irrelevance. This is because energy is just a analog for money, and then the equation becomes money returned over money invested. But, and the next bit is important, the exchange rate for energy for money invested is different than the exchnage rate for energy for money returned. Electricity costs less than oil. And there are additional terms in the equation. And energy is (effectively) unlimited, it just costs money.

EROEI becomes the only important factor when energy is limited. You have 100 litres of gas, should you burn that directly to stop your familiy from freezing to death, or use that gas to power a chainsaw to cut wood and then burn the wood. EROEI will answer that question.

Finally, batteries have an EROEI less than one, and always have had. If EROEI was the deciding force, then we would never have had batteries. But because batteries have properties we think are useful we are prepared to accept the energy loss to gain the utility of the battery.

[shortonsense]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', ']')You are confusing primary energy with an energy carrier. This is a common mistake for people who do not understand the importance and the method of arriving at eroei.