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What it is really all about..

Unread postby t888 » Tue 14 Apr 2009, 23:41:58

Existence exists. Reality is real. I think, therefore I am. Through contemplation it is realized that "awareness" is all there really is.. And so if there is a "God", there is this all pervasive meta-consciousness that takes the form as countless cognizant lifeforms expressed and manifested in each their own unique and distinct ways, embodied localized beings of awareness reflecting back to its 'father' in a self similar way..

There may not be a 'physical world' or physical reality at all! Perhaps in the end though this all might just be a play of words.. But if all computers are just emulators (the computer doesn't do the computing, it is the actual underlying physical reactions and/or the laws of physics that do the work of computing.. the beads on an abacus are symbolic representations of numeric values in the platonic realm, they beads exists for place keep sake and do not compute anything at all) and if the universe (omnium multiverse) is the ultimate grand computer .. then in the final analysis isn't it just canonical qualia encoding in such and such a manner mathematical to produce the so called "physical world" and our own conduits to be "aware" of the structured "awareness" itself?

If all there is is just raw canonical quale and the mathematical encoding of that qualia (pattern ground simplicity..) still then what explains (or explains away) the "fire in the equations"..? What accounts for the precise ratios and "laws of physics" for the way they are? Why are constants that precise singular value and not some other arbitrary value? Why do qualia exists? Why does anything exists instead of nothing at all? Or perhaps existence and non-existence can never be separated and one has no meaning without the other? Maybe the only possible 'default' is not mere "existence" or "nothingness" but a nondual holistic superpositional state of everything and nothing, zero and infinity, form and the void all coexisting everywhere forever, in fact these polar dualities are actually two sides of the one same coin, always meaning and going back the exact same thing..

Eventually we find the initial base case, the first final "a priori assumption", something so fundamental that it cannot be explained in terms of anything else even more fundamental than itself without resorting to circular logic and self referentiality.. Perhaps this is qualia wheel/spectrum?

Maybe the human mind in any of its seemingly infinitely (almost infinite) possible configurations of neurons and synapses and neocortal columns and firings and chemicals is simply ill capable of comprehending or grasping this ultimate reality.. the reality that when it comes down to it, the mathematical , platonic, mental and qualia worlds/domains are really all fundamentally and categorically all the same one essence deep down... (we'll call it tualia)..

And perhaps because of the 'zero ontology' principle 'tualia' had no other 'choice' than to 'exists' and to be.. and through a series of darwinistic evolution and via the atrophic principle of "qualia" itself, the laws of physics eventually "settled down" to an immutable set of laws.. (much like DNA structure eventually became prominent and took over on earth..) and the cosmic Cambrian explosion (aka big bang) occurred once local universe 'found its own way'..

And then evolutionary darwinism (both the facts and theories) explains satisfactorily and vigorously all life on earth.. In the end, and even now, and forever and always, it is about "survival" in this epic struggle of existence.. And something as simple of this "survival" (natural selection, inheritance, mutation, genetic drift, sexual reproduction, etc etc) gives rise to all the varieties of life, the complex ecosystems, the hierarchies and food chains, the emergent properties impossible for foresee... All of man, all our disciplines, our faculties our desires and wants our states of mind, our deepest inner questions can be answered one way or another through the understand and application of evolutionary darwinism and all the infinite intricacies that it entails... Good and bad, pleasure and pain, beauty and disgust, these are all our individual "modes of perception" dictated by our functional "modes of survival" which itself reverts back to the same one principle of everything, the urge to exists in general and survival and thrive specifically.

Understanding this it is no small wonder that we are where we are today... Infinite growth in a finite environment, Bacteria in a petri dish, Easter Island, Olduvai Gorge, the Post Industrial Stone Age, Peak Oil, Capitalism, Fiat Currency, Fractional Reserve Banking, Petrodollar Hegemony, Globalization, New World Order, EROEI, Point of Diminishing Returns, "Cannibalism", the supernova of mankind, the greatest depression, population dieoff...

It had to happen this way... As weird as this may sound... this is what nature INTENDED to do all along.. Macroscopically nothing has "gone wrong" and everything is happening exactly the way it should...

Be happy.
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby Jotapay » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 07:49:53

Existentialism much?

This also brings up my second favorite line/idea ever: "Do you think that's air you're breathing now?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRIKyNQOHvw

To find enlightenment one must 'let go'.
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 08:05:14

POPS!!!
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby SpringCreekFarm » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 08:34:36

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'U')nderstanding this it is no small wonder that we are where we are today... Infinite growth in a finite environment, Bacteria in a petri dish, Easter Island, Olduvai Gorge, the Post Industrial Stone Age, Peak Oil, Capitalism, Fiat Currency, Fractional Reserve Banking, Petrodollar Hegemony, Globalization, New World Order, EROEI, Point of Diminishing Returns, "Cannibalism", the supernova of mankind, the greatest depression, population dieoff...

It had to happen this way... As weird as this may sound... this is what nature INTENDED to do all along.. Macroscopically nothing has "gone wrong" and everything is happening exactly the way it should...


Although the preceeding stuff is quite a mouthful, I agree with this and It has crossed my mind that this mess we are all in is indeed a matter of fate and that it is a train we got on a long time ago and where it will take us is beyond our control.

Try to make life comfortable and safe for those you love and enjoy the ride.
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby Micki » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 08:59:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'U')nderstanding this it is no small wonder that we are where we are today... Infinite growth in a finite environment, Bacteria in a petri dish, Easter Island, Olduvai Gorge, the Post Industrial Stone Age, Peak Oil, Capitalism, Fiat Currency, Fractional Reserve Banking, Petrodollar Hegemony, Globalization, New World Order, EROEI, Point of Diminishing Returns, "Cannibalism", the supernova of mankind, the greatest depression, population dieoff...

It had to happen this way... As weird as this may sound... this is what nature INTENDED to do all along.. Macroscopically nothing has "gone wrong" and everything is happening exactly the way it should...

And if you resist it...fight it...change it, then that is also how it should be.
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby cipi604 » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 09:05:51

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('t888', 'E')xistence exists. Reality is real. I think, therefore I am. Through contemplation it is realized that "awareness" is all there really is.. And so if there is a "God", there is this all pervasive meta-consciousness that takes the form as countless cognizant lifeforms expressed and manifested in each their own unique and distinct ways, embodied localized beings of awareness reflecting back to its 'father' in a self similar way.. --snip--
It had to happen this way... As weird as this may sound... this is what nature INTENDED to do all along.. Macroscopically nothing has "gone wrong" and everything is happening exactly the way it should... Be happy.

I wish you didn't tell everyone the most important thing of them all.
Last edited by Ferretlover on Wed 15 Apr 2009, 12:26:57, edited 1 time in total.
Reason: Deleted excessive quoting.
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby Ludi » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 09:27:49

It was our "fate" to be so stupid and self centered that we knew exactly what we were doing to ourselves and did it anyway.

"The sad reality is that we are in danger of perishing from our own stupidity and lack of personal responsibility to life. If we become extinct because of factors beyond our control, then we can at least die with pride in ourselves, but to create a mess in which we perish by our own inaction makes nonsense of our claims to consciousness and morality." - Bill Mollison

The great thing about the "it's our fate" philosophy is that we don't have to do anything different. It's a wonderful cop-out. "It's our fate. Oh well."
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby SpringCreekFarm » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 10:19:04

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'I')t was our "fate" to be so stupid and self centered that we knew exactly what we were doing to ourselves and did it anyway.
"The sad reality is that we are in danger of perishing from our own stupidity and lack of personal responsibility to life. If we become extinct because of factors beyond our control, then we can at least die with pride in ourselves, but to create a mess in which we perish by our own inaction makes nonsense of our claims to consciousness and morality." - Bill Mollison
The great thing about the "it's our fate" philosophy is that we don't have to do anything different. It's a wonderful cop-out. "It's our fate. Oh well."

Well I didn't mean "it's our fate, oh well". (that is, if you are addressing me...). I meant that this big mess of a civilization we live in was a fate set in motion many generations ago and it is nearly impossible to change it now.

Anyone who knows me on here knows I live a more self-sufficient life than most already and have been doing so for most of my adult life. It would take an extreme collective effort by a lot more people to change the course set before us by our ancestors.

I just don't think we'll gather the political will globaly to change it in a large enough way to save us. I feel justified in saying that I do my part however small the scale.
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby SeaGypsy » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 11:25:21

Well I think it's a load of shit.
But it takes shit to make flowers grow.
Good shit perhaps?
Well thought out shit?
Can you do shit about shit?
Or wank on until TSHTF?
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby Ludi » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 11:45:17

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SpringCreekFarm', '
')I feel justified in saying that I do my part however small the scale.



That's all any of us can do. But I also think there is a large segment of the population who figure "oh well." They generally want everyone else to change before they will.

I certainly don't put you in that group. :)
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby Ludi » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 11:47:03

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SeaGypsy', '
')Or wank on until TSHTF?



Wankers wank on with essays filled with fancy words and justification for not doing shit about shit. :razz:
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby t888 » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 12:23:32

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Jotapay', 'E')xistentialism much?

This also brings up my second favorite line/idea ever: "Do you think that's air you're breathing now?"

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KRIKyNQOHvw

To find enlightenment one must 'let go'.


The current established scientific paradigm is based upon the a priori assumption that consciousness is an epiphenomenon of a material reality that existed prior to, and independent of consciousness. Quantum mechanics has produced strong evidence that it is wrong. The Einstein Podolsky Rosen (EPR) paradox was a thought experiment designed to demonstrate failure of the uncertainty principle in the case of the creation of a pair of twin particles and the subsequent determination of certain physical characteristics of the particles at some distance from the point of their creation. If elementary particles travel through space as localized phenomena, as EPR (and common sense) insist, then it is easy to show that the correlation between a pair of particles in an EPR-type experiment cannot exceed a specific numerical value. John Bell was able to show mathematically that if Bohr was right, that value would be exceeded. Experiments carried out by Clauser and Freedman, Aspect, and others, have proved that Einstein was wrong; Bohr was correct. As John Wheeler has said: "No elementary phenomenon is a phenomenon until it is a registered phenomenon." This startling conclusion has been born out by a number of experiments, including the so-called 'delayed-choice' experiment. In fact it is decided, after the fact, whether a photon behaved as a wave or as a particle. Elementary phenomena like photons do not exist as localized particles or waves until they register by impacting upon a receptor. If quanta do not exist until they register as effects on a receptor, and we have no way of knowing of them until evidence of their effects is received in our consciousness via a chain of quanta and receptors, how are we to know whether they exist or not, without the presence of consciousness? And information is carried from the object to the observer by a series of sources, particles, and receptors. But what is the final receptor? If it is a physical structure, it is by definition made of elementary particles, and if the energy of the incoming quanta is absorbed by physical particles, how can we account for the image of the object of observation that arises in consciousness? Is it composed of energy? If so, there is a minimum volume within which the image of an object can appear and be stored, since energy can only occur in quanta, or discrete, finite packets. What is the consciousness that perceives this image? Is it also made up of quanta of matter and energy? If so, then the elementary particles of which it is composed also had no local physical form until they registered on a prior receptor. And that prior receptor, if it was composed of quanta of matter and energy, also had to have had a prior receptor, and so on. Thus the quest for the first receptor becomes an infinite regression in time and space. But time and space are finite in the physical world and there is, therefore, a "bottom" to physical phenomena, the infinite regress or descent is impossible, and we have a logical contradiction. Conclusion: the final receptor and the images it perceives are not composed of quanta of matter and energy.


Where.. for example does the canonical quale of say 'redness' reside? We can say 'in our minds' but if we are to take our currently understanding of there being a 'physical world', then 'where' exactly in our minds? Language doesn't really describe it, (after all how can the word "RED", define or give rise to essence and quality of RED if I have never previously experienced any sensation of the color red in my life before?) Math can't encode it, sure we can allude to the wavelength and physical characteristics of the color red in the EM spectrum, but still that tells us nothing at all about the quality of redness itself! .. After all it can't be in the physical processes, the neurons and gray matter itself! So if we assume physical reality exists and assume that it is not some fundamental consciousness-space-time (incorporating consciousness as another extension/dimension to 'spacetime' thus resolving the so called mind body problem, the epiphenomenon paradox and the 'hard problem of consciousness'..) then we are still left with the problem of where exactly does these qualia reside? We cannot very well say 'they don't really exists, they are just appearances' because if that was truly the case then we would be in a sense 'mindless zombies' going around Exactly the way we are now but instead of "me being aware of my self identity" there would be a pervasive 'nothingness'.. And Descartes' "I think, therefore I am" boils down to the same conclusion, except he really meant there is 'qualia' and therefore 'something exists' .. (not that there is an actual physical world 'somewhere out there', because we can never have first hand empirical evidence of that! if we are to assume there is separation (physical world and qualia realm) if we assume nonduality then it becomes that these distinctions become meaningless..

If we take the nondual stance then these problems resolve themselves.. There isn't a problem.. If we continue with the current scientific paradigm then we are faced with the problem of how we can ever really PROVE that a physical world exists 'out there' somewhere, but we really can't because ironically that position is where our assumptions naturally lead us to!!! (we are already assuming there is a fundamental distinction between the reality of the physical world out there and our inherent limitations and sense data and perceptual filters, etc..) We really shot ourselves in the foot with this one, because if we assume that all we can ever know are only just the immediate sense data and nothing else, then we can't ever know of the ultimate external reality 'out there' can we? Nope.. Of course then the question becomes does it even matter? If all we can ever come into contact with is our own subjective 'inner worlds' then is not the so called correspondence theory being rather silly and superfluous? Corresponding to exactly what?

Regardless, consciousness does seem to be localized and embodied.. Anyway I was saying it does appear that human consciousness as we know it to be, is a localized and embodied phenomenon regardless of whatever worldview and/or paradigm we take.. If the details of the Mandelbrot set or the irrational non repeating ratio of PI doesn't and cannot possible reside in their entirely within the physical universe itself, (so goes without saying they cannot exists entirely in our minds..) but yet we know they do have 'existence'.. Then 'where' do they 'exists' or reside? If not in some other 'world', then where? It only make sense that the so called 'physical world' (which is not really physical at all, there is nothing 'physical' about physical..) is a subset embedded in a large existential platonic world of qualia.
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby t888 » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 12:35:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Micki', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'U')nderstanding this it is no small wonder that we are where we are today... Infinite growth in a finite environment, Bacteria in a petri dish, Easter Island, Olduvai Gorge, the Post Industrial Stone Age, Peak Oil, Capitalism, Fiat Currency, Fractional Reserve Banking, Petrodollar Hegemony, Globalization, New World Order, EROEI, Point of Diminishing Returns, "Cannibalism", the supernova of mankind, the greatest depression, population dieoff...

It had to happen this way... As weird as this may sound... this is what nature INTENDED to do all along.. Macroscopically nothing has "gone wrong" and everything is happening exactly the way it should...

And if you resist it...fight it...change it, then that is also how it should be.


You are assuming there is such a thing as "free will".. The short answer is everything is predetermined, we can call it fate or destiny or god’s plan or whatever, but ultimately on the highest level it has already happened, nothing can be changed or needs to be changed, and there is no ‘free will’ or ‘choice’ in the ultimate sense. Even your own actions, your emotions, your believe in your ability to 'choose' and that 'feeling that you made a choice' is but a mere illusion of illusions. The human brain is a finite state machine, even if we account from 'randomness' on the quantum levels / molecular levels affecting the individual neurons and firings, there is still nothing doing the "deciding".. if there was it would result in an ad infinitum into absurdity!! (who is the final decider, the final Computer if you will, except for the laws of physics and the omnium multiverse itself!!!) Everything (all things) is settled and done and finished once and for all. If even time travel was real and by going back in time (even if this was possible on a macro scale) we change the past and alter the present and influence the future then that too simply becomes part of ‘everything that is going to happen’ scenario and incorporated within the ‘highest timeline’ which itself is always a ‘constant’ and immutable terrain and cannot be in any way changed or altered or effected. (and if it could, then it would be superseded by a higher timeline that would and so on and so forth until it eventually does “settle up” to an ultimate constant unchangeable flat timeline) To be sure, there can be eddies and self contained self resolving paradoxes or temporal loops and temporal-temporal anomalies that appear to come and go (time travel that evolves into existence just to later play themselves out in orderly fashion and promptly de-evolves back into nothingness) within the ultimate highest level timeline structure. But time travel “as we know it” is not possible simply because “free will”, “freedom”, “choice” are nothing more than mere analytical overlays and abstract labels and misunderstood concepts and ideals that have no amount of reflective existence in the larger totality of reality and existence. Put simply, evolutionary darwinism explains perfectly the biological aspect of life, and coupled with qualia and a foundational “consciousness-space-time” our mental experiences perfectly and naturally parallels the chemical reactions in our brains, bodies and nervous systems correlating biochemical reactions to “epiphenomenon” states of being. There is no ultimate mysterious of mysterious, no ‘ghost in the machine’ to be found, so transcendental or ethereal soul or spirit that is more than mere the sum of its parts.. Magic may be fun, but magic isn’t ‘real’, its just magical. Reality is quite boring and non-interesting.. It is only because our brains (or rather our high level consciousness) cannot be aware of the inner workings of our lower level functions (we can’t possibly see what is going on in our own thinking process at the NCC neocortical column level or neuron and synapse or electro-chemical /quantum reactions within each neuron (etc) ) that we are given rise to this appearance/illusion of life being this great awe-inspiring magical inexplicable wonder and miracle.. In reality our mind is nothing more than the physical brain (pattern information complexity) and intertwined with the raw “what it is likeness to experience or feel” a subjective inner mind experience is no more than mere ubiquitous qualia (consciousness aspect of consciousness-space-time) being filtered and tinted through the pattern of our bio-physical “brains”.. (like pure white light given form and existence and content when shined through that of a film on a projector) ..

So in the end and even now in the in-between it is realized that there is no inexplicable phenomenon or mysterious of mysterious. Take the example of a chess game for example. To even the greatest of grandmasters chess seems forever “alive” and new and grand and interesting, to them each game is unique and when playing them they derive a certain satisfaction and they can feel the taste and flavor and the different “moods” of a game or a certain strategy or tactic.. To them, chess is life.. But chess, much like life itself, is not infinitely fascinating… There are only a certain number of finite moves to chess, a hypothetical quantum computer in the far future could map out in real time “on the fly” all the possible combinations and permutations of chess to make the game a dead/solved game much like tic-tac-toe is today. Imagine instead of an opening book that we had a book that contained all the possible chess moves, indeed a book and index of all the possible games of chess down to every single last one! So by playing chess with this hypothetical book both sides would always TIE and no one would ever win or lose.. (each move by each player is considered a further ‘branching’ down the timeline, by each player both choosing the branch that lead themselves to ‘win’ each time it is guaranteed that they will both land in the realm of “TIE” ALL THE TIME) ..

Likewise, the human brain, as complex as it is, is only a mere finite state machine. Hypothetically if we could live forever and ever and ever eventually our brain states will start to ‘repeat itself’(we would have a ‘collision’/exact coincidence of mental states/ neuron configurations)… One last simple illustration to prove the point.. Imagine you have a digital camera with just 4 pixels (four single pixels not 4 megapixels) and it was grayscale 0 1 (only black and white, no shades in between).. So we have 2*2*2*2 = a maximum of 16 possible configurations. So we can take a gazillion pictures on earth but they would all be approximated down to the 16 categorical “representations”… Likewise the same for a computer monitor. There is a finite number of different screen images any monitor could ever display! So even when exploring the mandelbrot set on my computer, if I did it long enough I would eventually have a “collision” in which from the monitors approximate point of view I would encounter two different regions of the mandelbrot set to be exactly the same (when we know this in reality is not possible!!!) And this applies to us humans no less, because our brains are bounded by the number of neurons we have and their finite possible connections and configurations! Even if we take the entire planet earth as a whole, using Bekenstein bound we see there is still a finite upper limit of total possible informational states and/or entropy in any region and system! Therefore the possibilities are NOT limitless, not by any definition. .. By The human brain can never “reach around” and understand itself in its entirety, nor can we comprehend the absolute of reality in any ‘complete’ way. The best we can hope for is closer and closer approximations to the truth, and a best reductive model and definition that best represents the larger reality “out there”.. But everything is happening EXACTLY as it should, nothing could have ever been any other way!
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby t888 » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 12:53:55

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SpringCreekFarm', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'I')t was our "fate" to be so stupid and self centered that we knew exactly what we were doing to ourselves and did it anyway.
"The sad reality is that we are in danger of perishing from our own stupidity and lack of personal responsibility to life. If we become extinct because of factors beyond our control, then we can at least die with pride in ourselves, but to create a mess in which we perish by our own inaction makes nonsense of our claims to consciousness and morality." - Bill Mollison
The great thing about the "it's our fate" philosophy is that we don't have to do anything different. It's a wonderful cop-out. "It's our fate. Oh well."

Well I didn't mean "it's our fate, oh well". (that is, if you are addressing me...). I meant that this big mess of a civilization we live in was a fate set in motion many generations ago and it is nearly impossible to change it now.

Anyone who knows me on here knows I live a more self-sufficient life than most already and have been doing so for most of my adult life. It would take an extreme collective effort by a lot more people to change the course set before us by our ancestors.

I just don't think we'll gather the political will globaly to change it in a large enough way to save us. I feel justified in saying that I do my part however small the scale.


Not trying to sound like a broken record, but darwinistic evolutionary really already explains all of this in all its glory.. it is so simple a theory yet so profound that few can grasp the full extent of its power. From a macroeconomic/geopolitic/historical standpoint when looking at the bigger picture as a whole and in general human species have been just like "bacteria in a petri dish".. We grow, we overextended and over populate, we reach the limits of growth, we depopulate by orders of magnitude, then finally we settle down to appropriate 'sustainable' population level and way of life, and/or we eventually become extinct..

People often make the distinction between 'nature' and 'man', few realize that 'man' is just an extension of 'nature'.. No one "had a choice" when monkeys evolved into 'humans'.. Perhaps in any planet supporting life with any configuration there will always eventually be an alpha species far superior to that of any other.. If it wasn't "homo sapiens" it could have been something else, some other species taking the place and the fate of humans today!

The ancient Chinese civilization was 'relatively' more peaceful, closed, and nonexpansionary... They were once on top of the world.. But if any group, society, civilization, etc does NOT take full advantage of the plentiful resources (and take advantage in a way that will mathematically insure eventual overgrowth and population overshoot) some other civilization, will do so and eventually take its place... This is evolutionary darwinism at work, this is the anthropic principle, the concept that "anything that can happen eventually will happen".. Eventually the "relatively more sustainable way" was replaced and displaced by something not sustainable but that "worked wonders" in the short term... This is true when describing the way of life on all scales! Every species and every form of life tries to reach this "maximum" in their epic "struggle of existence"...

Now that we are at the peak of peaks.. there is no where to go but down.. It HAD to be this way.. man cannot control himself.. life is just the way it is, the laws of nature dictate that we had to overextend, to overpopulate, and only by this correction can/does nature ever "self control" itself... This IS natures ultimate control mechanism! Don't you realize we will NEVER return to Pax American way of life ever again! We don't need politicians to be conservative, man will never willingly control or discipline himself, and in hindsight he didn't really have to.. this, everything that has transpired and will yet to happen, is the only way it ever could have been.. it is just too bad (from my personal subjective biased prejudice) that this correction will result in 90%-99% global population dieoff within the next 5-10 years, and a return to the stone age for those that "made it" .. But hey, that's life.
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby mos6507 » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 20:26:01

ReverseEngineer's got a new rival in t888 for word wanking :)
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby Ludi » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 21:17:29

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'R')everseEngineer's got a new rival in t888 for word wanking :)



I want to see 'em go mano a mano or palabra a palabra! :-D
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby jasonraymondson » Wed 15 Apr 2009, 22:35:59

Welcome back Raph
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Re: What it is really all about..

Unread postby oowolf » Thu 16 Apr 2009, 17:14:19

Not bad..easy to dance to..but around here, you need to freely quote dudes like Fichte or Korzybski to make a real impression.
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