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Doomstead Diner

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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby Plantagenet » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 00:42:37

God bless the geologists and other scientists, for they bring us closer to the truth.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby flapjax » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 00:58:33

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('pstarr', 't')hanks you 2.

...trouble reading the small text, had to "view the image" and enlarge.



I felt the same way after seeing the uploaded final product. The text is too small. I hope to improve the text next time :)
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby flapjax » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 01:03:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', 'T')o help with the time issue of all the drawing, you could make a few stock close-ups of the characters (that could be repeated) just for the sake of having more dialog. Like, have a few standard poses for each character that you could cut and paste.
I'm not saying make the whole comic that way, just use it to give more back and forth dialog without overburdening the artist.


Not a bad idea here at all and I can see myself using this solution once I have more material completed. Thanks for the kind words, sixstrings :-D
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby Sixstrings » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 08:47:25

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('flapjax', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', 'T')o help with the time issue of all the drawing, you could make a few stock close-ups of the characters (that could be repeated) just for the sake of having more dialog. Like, have a few standard poses for each character that you could cut and paste.
I'm not saying make the whole comic that way, just use it to give more back and forth dialog without overburdening the artist.


Not a bad idea here at all and I can see myself using this solution once I have more material completed. Thanks for the kind words, sixstrings :-D


Ya, I'm not exactly a reader of comics, but if memory serves me this is a technique I've seen before. I seem to remember comics having the big detailed panels, then next panel would be a very close-up face shot with just dialog.

It's also a cinematic technique, the close-up during dialog. So, I think if you had a choice of 4 detailed panels and no storyline or 4 detailed panels and six cut-and-paste stock poses WITH a storyline, you'd be better off with the latter. Plot, characterization, dialog, and conflict are all important -- without them, there is no story.

But anyway the few comics I used to like are the satirical types, so I like your work a lot. Reminds me of Doonesbury.

EDIT: one last piece of unsolicited advice ;) : if you keep up with the comic, you'd probably want to develop the characters in more non-peakoil.com-specific way. Go ahead and make the characters your own and develop them, so that you can market your work to a larger audience.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 10:31:19

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '
')EDIT: one last piece of unsolicited advice ;) : if you keep up with the comic, you'd probably want to develop the characters in more non-peakoil.com-specific way. Go ahead and make the characters your own and develop them, so that you can market your work to a larger audience.


The characters of the Doomsday Diner are a vehicle from which the world a large is examined. You'll see more in the second strip, where in fact none of the Peak Oil characters appear. Second strip is a background primer in Economic History. I'm writing the strip to appeal to a much larger audience than just Peak Oil members.

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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby Plantagenet » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 21:07:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ReverseEngineer', ' ')in the second strip, where in fact none of the Peak Oil characters appear. Second strip is a background primer in Economic History.


Great!

I can't wait to see how Flapjax draws Adam Smith and Karl Marx! :)
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 21:53:36

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'G')reat!I can't wait to see how Flapjax draws Adam Smith and Karl Marx! :)

Sorry, only Isaac Newton appears in the strip, along with Ben Bernanke and assorted unidentified Pigmen. Up now at the Doomstead Diner.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby mos6507 » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 23:50:18

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sixstrings', '
')Ya, I'm not exactly a reader of comics, but if memory serves me this is a technique I've seen before. I seem to remember comics having the big detailed panels, then next panel would be a very close-up face shot with just dialog.


Or cutting to silhouette, a Doonesbury cliche.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Mon 30 Mar 2009, 23:58:40

Oops I forgot, Alexander Hamilton appears in the strip also.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 02:52:24

I just fired off the script for DD#3 to FlapJax. Smallpox has a Feature Role in the next one :-) He's drawing them up a lot faster than I thought possible. This isn't even his best stuff, he is a little out of practice, but boy if he is this good already once his drawing hand gets lubed up it could be AMAZING!

Opinions on DD#2??? I didn't put up the strip in the thread here because it is too wide and screws up the pages, but should I do that anyhow?

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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby MD » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 05:31:12

Excellent effort! The narrative needs a little work as does the pacing.
Stop filling dumpsters, as much as you possibly can, and everything will get better.

Just think it through.
It's not hard to do.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 05:48:03

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MD', 'E')xcellent effort!The narrative needs a little work as does the pacing.

Any suggestions on how I might improve on narrative and pacing? I'm new to this motif, as you know I'm a very long winded sort of writer usually, so its hard for me to translate downward to this format. I have to figure out short sentences and then pictures for FlapJax to draw that bring a greater scope to just a couple of sentences. Its hard for me to do that. Any suggestions will be greatfully accepted and used if they make the strip better.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby MD » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 06:12:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ReverseEngineer', 'A')ny suggestions on how I might improve on narrative and pacing? I'm new to this motif, as you know I'm a very long winded sort of writer usually, so its hard for me to translate downward to this format. I have to figure out short sentences and then pictures for FlapJax to draw that bring a greater scope to just a couple of sentences. Its hard for me to do that. Any suggestions will be greatfully accepted and used if they make the strip better.

You're trying to pack too much into a single strip and that is leaving you with a... "leap-frog" effect is what comes to mind. You are starting off developing the theme, which is good. Maybe try developing one character at a time.

Who actually runs the diner? Who are the regulars? Turn the caricatures into characters. And finally...don't go for a punch line, at first. Let the humor develop itself. The characters will lead the way.
Stop filling dumpsters, as much as you possibly can, and everything will get better.

Just think it through.
It's not hard to do.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 06:36:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MD', 'Y')ou're trying to pack too much into a single strip and that is leaving you with a... "leap-frog" effect is what comes to mind. You are starting off developing the theme, which is good. Maybe try developing one character at a time.

Yea I know I am packing in more than a typical strip, I originally figured on 4-6 panels, I'm having trouble keeping it down to 8 or 9. I feel like I need to get the exposition done and introduce most of the concepts in these first few strips. I think they will get shorter as time goes by, once the characters and the ideas get developed. Then rather than trying to throw the whole kitchen sink into one strip, I'll focus down a bit more and develop an idea over several strips, rather than incorporating it all into one strip as I am doing now.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')ho actually runs the diner? Who are the regulars?

I haven't figured out who runs the Diner yet. Pops is a likely candidate, because the DD as FlapJax drew it looks a good deal like Pop's farm in the Ozarks. I been there of course. The Pops character also is suitable for the Diner owner, I can do the "Bartender" thing there with Pops dishing out the "Make a Plan and Work It" philosophy while he scrambles some eggs. LOL.

Regulars right now are the Posters here who I have the most regular conversations with. However, if you are one of those folks, your strip character probably will evolve somewhat over time, and possibly not in a way you approve of. LOL. Don't be too pissed at me! I'm going to change the names of the characters from the handles used on Peak Oil to keep it somewhat anonymous.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')urn the caricatures into characters. And finally...don't go for a punch line, at first. Let the humor develop itself. The characters will lead the way.

I will try to do that. Again though, right now I'm trying to make each strip Punchy on its own, until the readers get to know the characters. Then I will start to develop more individual story lines with less in the way of "punch lines" in every strip.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby MD » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 06:49:10

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ReverseEngineer', '.').. I feel like I need to get the exposition done and introduce most of the concepts in these first few strips.


Try to lose that feeling. It's not like the end of the world is rushing at us or anything.
Stop filling dumpsters, as much as you possibly can, and everything will get better.

Just think it through.
It's not hard to do.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 07:03:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MD', 'T')ry to lose that feeling. It's not like the end of the world is rushing at us or anything.

Of course not. I am sure its going to be a Long Emergency, a gradual descent into Hell. NOT!!!!! LOL. I gotta get this shit written as fast as I can! DOOM is right around the corner! ROFLMAOPIMP.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby flapjax » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 09:20:06

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ReverseEngineer', 'I') just fired off the script for DD#3 to FlapJax. Smallpox has a Feature Role in the next one :-) He's drawing them up a lot faster than I thought possible. This isn't even his best stuff, he is a little out of practice, but boy if he is this good already once his drawing hand gets lubed up it could be AMAZING!
Opinions on DD#2??? I didn't put up the strip in the thread here because it is too wide and screws up the pages, but should I do that anyhow?

I wouldn't mind if you posted it here. The actual strip will be harder to miss than the link. I dunno.
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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 14:59:40

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('flapjax', '
')I wouldn't mind if you posted it here. The actual strip will be harder to miss than the link. I dunno.


OK, for those of you who missed the link, here's Doomstead Diner #2, the Economic History of the wold in 9 panels :-)

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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby Plantagenet » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 15:45:14

RE...a question about the strip...

Would you please explain what "FIAT MONEY" is?

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Re: The Doomstead Diner Thread

Postby ReverseEngineer » Tue 31 Mar 2009, 16:06:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Plantagenet', 'R')E...a question about the strip...

Would you please explain what "FIAT MONEY" is?



No.

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