[Ranglepung]

I was wondering if anybody has any views on this hypotethical situation:

Imagine if there was enough for everybody. By that I mean everybody had enough food, all the clothes they'd want, the gadgets of their dreams, their dreamcar, dreambike, dreamboat, everything, including energy.
And when I say everyone, I mean everyone in the world.

All this is provided free of charge, think Star Trek matter converters (remember, hypothetical situation ) All this is provided without pollution of any kind.

What would happen to our society? Of course the population would scyrocket, but if all limits to our growth are removed, this ball of rock can house a lot of people.

What I mean is would we have any kind of civilation? No- one would have any need to work, so why should anyone fight fires, unclog sewerpipes, empty garbage, fix phonewires etc. The only thing that would have any value would be real estate, as that can't be made.

But would there be any system to keep track of what belong to whom? Would murder, violence and rape increase? As there is no incentive (salory) to be a cop, I think few would like to be.

Or would this be the biggest blessing we could ever get? I think it sounds good on paper, but when put to the litmus test, I think it would be he undoing of practically everyting we are.

I enjoy thinking about these things, and was wondering if anybody had any thoughts on this subject.

[Nano]

In our western, suburban world we are shielded from the facts of nature to a large degree. Those facts are very harsh indeed! Your scenario is unthinkable for myriad reasons.

[Ebyss]

I think things would go downhill very quickly. "The devil makes work for idle thumbs" is apt for that kind of situation. People have little respect for things they did not earn themselves. They'd probably find out very quickly that material goods mean nothing in the grand scheme of things, family and friends are everything. I wonder would religion have any place in a world like that, given that most (if not all) religions favour frugality in their subjects.

[uNkNowN ElEmEnt]

The premise behind Star Trek is not that no one works. Everyone works but they do a job they want or are good at. you still have to have something marketable. If you are an artist, there still has to be a demand for your art.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')ould murder, violence and rape increase? As there is no incentive (salory) to be a cop, I think few would like to be.

[Ludi]

If everyone has what they need and want, why would violence increase? It would only do so out of boredom, it seems to me, but if anyone can have anything they desire, why would they be bored?

[RonMN]

I'd write a computer virus to damage all energy/matter converters & make this entire fantasy planet bow at my feet HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

[uNkNowN ElEmEnt]

the premise that you can have everything you want is a falacy. You can't have so and so's wife. you can't be a rock star unless you are good. you can't be a doctor unless you know what you are doing.

people are not a contented species, they always want more, need more, need challenges, this creates strife. people aren't interested in movies or books unless there's a problem involved, otherwise its boring.

maybe tibetan monks could live in such a society, but humans on the whole can't and never would. its like they said in the matrix when they created a perfect utopia for the first matrix, and they lose whole crops of people. people won't believe it. that's life. (and I'm a wolf)

[Ranglepung]

Ebyss wrote:
I wonder would religion have any place in a world like that, given that most (if not all) religions favour frugality in their subjects.

Good point, haven't thought about that.
I think religion would would at first see a dicline in "members", but as time passes, people would begin to feel "empty", if you understand, and start to search for something to fill that void.
With no jobs, people will have a lot of free time.

So I think the end result would actually be more religion.
But I think it would be more benign then the ones we have today.
Not so organised, a lot of local evangelists/crackpots. It's often hard to see the difference .

[Ranglepung]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('uNkNowN ElEmEnt', 'T')he premise behind Star Trek is not that no one works. Everyone works but they do a job they want or are good at. you still have to have something marketable. If you are an artist, there still has to be a demand for your art.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')ould murder, violence and rape increase? As there is no incentive (salory) to be a cop, I think few would like to be.

[frankthetank]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'p')eople aren't interested in movies or books unless there's a problem involved, otherwise its boring.

[uNkNowN ElEmEnt]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'p')orn?

[Ranglepung]

<hickup>

[Doly]

Frederick Pohl had a great story on this theme, called "The Midas Plague". I recommend it.

[gg3]

There'll always be a need for law enforcement, fire protection, paramedics, emergency rooms in the hospital, and all the other things that are necessary to deal with emergencies.

And, absent crimes of greed, there are, as someone pointed out, crimes of passion.

But why assume this thought-experiment scenario is a fantasy? We already had a working example. Middle Class America in the 1950s and 1960s.

Anyone with a highschool diploma could work their way into the middle class, buy a home, send their kids to college, have decent vacations every year, health insurance from their employer or their union, and have virtually any material need satisfied. Clean-enough water, safe-enough food, comforts and conveniences and entertainments that would have seemed nothing short of miraculous 200 years prior.

We were there. We took it for granted and abused the privilege. Now we're royally screwed.