[aahala2]

In the absence of taxes, bankruptcy costs, and asymmetric information, and in an efficient market, the value of a firm is unaffected by how that firm is financed. It does not matter if the firm’s capital is raised by issuing stock or selling debt. It does not matter what the firm’s dividend policy is.

I don't believe the above is necessarily true. Debt usually will
have a required rate of interest payments, independent of
the profit, cash flow or value of the firm. The firm can't simply
decide to lower or skip these payments without serious
consequences.

Dividends on the other hand can be changed by the company's
board(whether justified or not). In some cases, lowering the
dividend payment made actually increase the company's
stock price, if it's taken as a sign the company is "cleaning up"
its act financially.

[americandream]

Islamic finance....presumably the same principles allah uses to run his companies up in the ether.

Does the Islamic world strike anyone on here as incredibly successful capitalism wise? Certainly they sit on a lot of oil which looks to me like a massive natural subsidy.

[3aidlillahi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('americandream', 'I')slamic finance....presumably the same principles allah uses to run his companies up in the ether.

Does the Islamic world strike anyone on here as incredibly successful capitalism wise? Certainly they sit on a lot of oil which looks to me like a massive natural subsidy.

[Pretorian]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dream16', 'Y')ou are beginning to realize that you don't own yourself.


NO not beginnig ... have realized this for sometime, just voicing now.
Over worked under paid, over taxed, blah. All we will ever be are slaves that answer to the man. Im so tired of this. And this idiot thinks taxes are the answer... duh... Ok you go out and slave yourself to pay for thier niceitys while you and your family continue to do without and go hungry..
I take that back we are worse than slaves at least slaves are provided with food and shelter... If we cant work hard enough to satisfy the man and make our taxes he just comes in and takes whatever will make him happy and leaves us on the street in worse shape than we started. The answer to that is more taxes so we can put you on welfare till you can pay us again, or more taxes so we can put you in jail while you think about how you are going to pay us when you get out! Social security numbers are the mark of the beast... the beast is the man.

[phaster]

dude, chill out! If ya don't realize that we're all part of the problem then I feel sorry for ya. Essentually the state of the system always reflects the collective mismanagement of society as a whole.

Or perhaps by the emphasis on "Leftists" ya feel (as oppose to think), that conservative pundants such as Rush, Fox News and talk radio (basically not the sharpest tools in the shed IMHO), have all the answers and can do no wrong.





$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TommyJefferson', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', 'I') never understood why 50% of the population were Liberals.

[Javaman]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('phaster', 'Y')esterday on my way down to the airport I was listened to a pod cast interview with Daniel R. Amerman on Credit Default Swaps/ link , and had one of them eureka moments; why not raise taxes to fix the system!!!!

Yeah I know it might sound counterintuitive increase taxes at a time when there is an economic downturn, but if ya read on it might make sense...

We know "credit default swaps" otherwise known as CDS contracts have been widely used by hedge funds and others to speculate on the viability of banks, other financial institutions such as brokerage houses, and auto manufactures.

These bets on various companies were not made on any regulated exchange and no one knows the exact size of the problem; much like we don't know the actual oil reserves in the ground in secretive nation states like Saudi Arabia, Iran, etc.

Daniel Amerman mentioned in the interview "Credit default swaps" are similar to homeowners insurance, because the buyer pays a premium and, in return, receives a sum of money if a specified event occurs. However, unlike homeowners insurance the buyer of a CDS contract does not need to own the underlying security, in fact the buyer does not even have to suffer a loss from the default event.

I've read there might be as much as 70 trillion in CDS betting slips that will never be able to be paid off and this is why Warren Buffett called these financial derivatives financial weapons of mass destruction. Basically the uncertainty caused by credit default swaps is having a paralyzing effect on the credit markets and the real economy.

So I was wondering why can't the knuckheads in the US congress use their power to make tax laws, to in effect make CDS contracts worthless by imposing a 100% tax on CDS profits (with a three day tax settlement period) on owners of CDS contracts who do not own the underlying security. A well crafted rule like this would remove much of the uncertainty in the market and not penalize owners of of CDS contracts who own the underlying security.

Also with the $hitheads from Detroit: link asking for $25 billion to save the big three auto makers and justify the fleet of gulfstreams, I also thought wouldn't this be the right time to increase taxes on gasoline say 20 cents a year for the next ten years and use the funds to retool and make the US auto industry more completive?

This way we as a nation don't add more debt for future generations by "loaning" the auto companies some money (that might not get paid back) so they can continue the downward business as usual trend.

Also by increasing prices at the pump with targeted taxes for a troubled sector in the US economy, US consumers will become conditioned to use a non renewable resource more efficiently.

So now that I've figured out how to fix the US economy by increasing taxes, I think I deserve 100 hours blocktime in airforce one by president elect Obama, same goes for the auto companies they should each give me 100 hours blocktime in a gulfstream 550, or at the very least I'd like an ig-nobel prize in economics. link

Seriously though, since I'm not a trained lawyer or a formally educated economist what obstacles and downsides do ya all think would there be to using tax laws to help out the auto industry and indirectly regulate an unregulated market in "Credit default swaps?"

[phaster]

a fair tax proposal would not stop the complicated matter of a credit default swap destroying the real economy because there are estimates of the CDS market value being between 30 to 60 trillion, on bonds worth 5 trillion.

ya have to keep in mind that this "income" is based on capital gains, not wages! furthermore the big problem with CDS is no one really set aside actual reserves to cover the big bets being made with CDS. In other words I could bet 1 trillion dollars ya that an AIG bond would not default, BUT that does not mean if I loose the bet that I have 1 trillions dollars to give ya if I lost the bet!

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Javaman', '
')
Implement the FairTax:

http://www.fairtax.org/site/PageServer

No taxes on income, but on retail sales instead.

[TommyJefferson]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('phaster', 'O')r perhaps by the emphasis on "Leftists" ya feel (as oppose to think), that conservative pundants such as Rush, Fox News and talk radio (basically not the sharpest tools in the shed IMHO), have all the answers and can do no wrong.

[errorist]

It looks hot. Like in flames. If you do not see flames your ground is swamp. Relax, IT will get warmer there, day by day.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TommyJefferson', 'W')hen libertarians refer to "the left" they are referring anyone who supports nationalism, statism, war, big government, force, and the government guns/drugs/gambling/medical rackets. To us, "The Left" includes retards like Rush and Fox, as well as retards like communists and moveon.org. How the world looks depends on where are are standing.

[niknak]

No, we should let the system go. You trust them with MORE money after they screwed up averything already WITH money?

Trying to fix the gasoline crises they implemented ETHANOL! better if that were never done.

Probably to make bridges and repair them, they will build tennules under rivers instead.

these people are idiots, don't feed the idiots more money.

[TommyJefferson]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pretorian', 'I')s it a suggestion that Americans are working better than Chinese?

[Javaman]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('phaster', 'a') fair tax proposal would not stop the complicated matter of a credit default swap destroying the real economy because there are estimates of the CDS market value being between 30 to 60 trillion, on bonds worth 5 trillion.
ya have to keep in mind that this "income" is based on capital gains, not wages! furthermore the big problem with CDS is no one really set aside actual reserves to cover the big bets being made with CDS. In other words I could bet 1 trillion dollars ya that an AIG bond would not default, BUT that does not mean if I loose the bet that I have 1 trillions dollars to give ya if I lost the bet!

[pedalling_faster]

i'm surprised no one here said anything about this. or, maybe they did & i missed it. The "Exit Tax" in its current form was signed into law by BushCo in June 2008.

"President Signs Exit Tax for U.S. Expatriates

20 June 2008

New rules impose tax on expatriates and withholding requirements on trustees

Giving up a U.S. passport now carries a steep price tag. A new law enacted on 17 June 2008 subjects certain individuals who expatriate or give up their green cards to immediate tax on the inherent gain on all of their worldwide assets and a tax on future gifts or bequests made to a U.S. citizen or resident.

Tax practitioners had been made to feel like the boy who cried wolf in recent months as the U.S. Congress repeatedly threatened to enact legislation aimed at U.S. citizens who expatriate. Congress finally made good on those threats by unanimously passing the Heroes Earning Assistance and Relief Tax (HEART) Act (the ‘Act'), which provides tax relief for active duty military personnel and reservists.

The new tax regime applies to certain individuals who relinquish their US citizenship and certain long-term U.S. residents (i.e., green card holders) who terminate their U.S. residence (hereafter referred to as ‘expatriates'). The so-called ‘mark-to-market' tax applies to the net unrealized gain on the expatriate's worldwide assets as if such property were sold (the ‘deemed sale') for its fair market value on the day before the expatriation date. Any net gain on this deemed sale in excess of US$600,000 is taxable."

from
Withers Law Firm

there's a lot of legalese. "trustees of non-grantor trusts" ? what's that ?

short version - if you move out of the US, under certain conditions your assets are taxable & you need to talk to an attorney.

[Schneider]

It seem that the US government learned the lesson from the UK, where hundreds of thousands of peoples are leaving each year if i remember well.

The funny thing is..How do you tax someone with no intend to ever come back and leave !?

[mattduke]

The noose tightens.

[Jotapay]

This was discussed all over the place earlier this year.

[evilgenius]

So, what does it mean in the larger context? Does it mean, for instance, that the Administration believed that this mess was soon to be upon us? If that is the case then there is a strong implication that recovery is also in the cards, they merely need the right people to hang in there and that will keep the wheels on long enough. One of the things that an empire needs is order, the right kind of order, the kind that perpetuates the empire. They are implying that the empire needs a certain caste of people with this edict and they will not allow them to depart, not without substantial cost. It is staggering when you think about who this law is aimed at, seeing as how most of the super rich have hidden much of their wealth where it can't be touched by taxes or potential taxes due to either being derived or tied up behind veils. This law is aimed at the upper middle-class. This law is intended to dissuade the able to consider it newly rich from departing.

[Sixstrings]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')ov. David Paterson unveils dire New York State budget that includes new taxes, layoffs and cuts

ALBANY - Gov. Paterson released a $121 billion slash-and-burn budget Tuesday morning that slams New Yorkers with 88 new fees and taxes - even on their iPods.

Calling the budget the "greatest economic and fiscal challenge of our lifetimes," Paterson acknowledged his spending plan cuts deep.

But he said the pain must be shared to deal with the fallout from the Wall Street collapse.

The budget will cost the city an estimated $650 million in aid.
But it's the $4 billion in new fees and taxes that are sure to aggravate everyday New Yorkers, who would be paying more for a host of services:

An "iPod tax" that charges state and local sales tax for "digitally delivered entertainment services" - in other words, that new Beyonce song you download.

State sales tax at movie theaters, sporting events, taxis, buses, limousines and cable and satellite TV and radio.
Costlier driving with the repeal of the 8-cents-per-gallon sales tax cap on motor and diesel motor fuel, plus and increase in the auto rental tax.

Tuition increases at SUNY and CUNY, $620 and $600 a year respectively.

A 50 cent tax on cigars. The current tax is equal to 37% of the wholesale price, or 34 cents a cigar.

No more sales tax break on clothes and shoes worth $110 or less, except during two weeks a year.

Higher taxes on wine, beer and flavored malt beverages. He would also impose an 18% tax on non-nutritional drinks like soda.
The rich would pay more for luxury items through an additional 5% tax imposed on cars costing more than $60,000, aircraft costing more than $500,000, yachts costing at least $200,000 and jewelry and furs costing in excess of $20,000.

In addition, a host of a fees, including those related to motor vehicle licensing and registration, parks and auto insurance, would go up, as would various state-imposed fines.

Even with the cuts, the 2009-10 budget would increase a little more than 1%, the smallest hike since 1996-97.
Paterson said the state is facing a $51 billion shortfall over the next four years at a time when tax revenues are expected to drop 6.6% next year.
http://www.nydailynews.com/ny_local/200 ... _york.html

[Plantagenet]

Raising taxes in a recession isn't very smart, but the liberals in New York state all vote for this sort of thing, and now they're going to get a really good dose of what they voted for.

[gandolf]

LOL sure sucks to be a New Yorker...

I do however have a solution to the Ipod tax. It is called Limewire.