[ThinkGeek]

Hello, I am a newbie to this entire topic, having just read an article on Peak Oil in Rolling Stone. I am fully aware of the ideas involving other resources for energy, but there is one question that I still have. Is it possible to make plastics without oil? Also, is there a certian country which it would be easiest to live in without oil? I was thinking something like a Danish island in the North Sea, which gets all of its energy from burning straw...etc...

Thx.

ThinkGeek

[UIUCstudent01]

Plastics from Orange peels:
Plastics from Orange Peels and Greenhouse Gas
Another Article on the above

Edit: But note that agriculture right now is dependant on oil and natural gas. So, yeah, you won't see this on a massive scale in the future (unless biotech industry becomes the grand savior of us all by making plants with no need of pesticides, but that doesn't seem likely because I believe there was alot of trouble with the proteins being created by potatoes becoming poisonous Here)

I just have a thing to say about your want to go to an island and away from wherever you are. Everyone seems to be in the thought that they should steel themselves away when Peak Oil hits.. I suggest you look into permaculture and intentional communities before you decide to jump to an island you've never been to. Although, I am apprehensive about the thought of preparing for a hard crash (it seems crazy when everybody else isn't?), there has been advice to look into gardening and reorganizing your investments (if you have any) first is viable advice.

[nocar]

Where do you live? If you do not live in the EU I think you have a very small chance to immigrate to Denmark. Or to Sweden. I am not sure about Norway, but I do not think they let anybody immigrate, either. (I am Swedish living in Sweden). Try changing your home neighborhood instead. Get rid of you car and show people it is possible to live without.
Nocar

[Licho]

You can create plastics for example from synthetic oil made from coal. Replacing oil as a feedstock for chemical production is easier than replacing it as a mobile energy source..

[pup55]

No problem producing plastics if you can produce the feedstock (propylene, ethylene, vinyl choride, styrene).

The question is, with increasingly expensive fossil petroleum, can plastics still be so copiously abundant and cheap they can still be used for "disposable" items? If the PO theory holds, plastic forks and disposable diapers may go by the wayside.

[ThinkGeek]

In my personal opinion, it would be no biggie if we lost things like plastic "sporks" and stupid little conviences, what I am worried about is the use of plastics for more important things, just so much of what we use today is made out of plastic.

[MarkR]

Manufacture of pastics and chemical feedstocks is a very minor use of oil, when compared to personal transportation.

Very cheap oil has given us very cheap plastic - so cheap that it has replaced most other materials in many situations - plastic now replaces paper and card in packaging, wood in furniture, and metal in tools.

Peak oil doesn't mean no oil, and therefore doesn't mean no plastic - it just means plastic would be more expensive - so less will be used where alternatives exist - e.g. more wood or wood derivatives would be used.

Oil is also not the only source of feedstock for plastics and chemicals. Natural gas is at least as important. Many of the feedstocks can be produced from coal, but at a higher price. Indeed, provided you have sufficient energy, then you could actually produce many of them from CO2 in the air.

[Doly]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MarkR', '
')Oil is also not the only source of feedstock for plastics and chemicals. Natural gas is at least as important.

[ProdigalMoon]

How much plastic is already out there in landfills that could be reclaimed and recylcled in the future if we ran out of sources of new plastic? It seems like, even if we run out of new sources, there's still so much out there already that we could reuse (given the energy required to recycle it).