[legit]

Communism is a society based on 'from each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs'. Before 1921 ( the crushing of Kronstadt ) the revolution was very progressive. Then worker control of factories was taken away and Soviets we taken under state control. This was the beginning of state capitalism.

'Here in Kronstadt we are making the third revolution'

[doufus]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Specop_007', '[')url=http://www.zombietime.com/red-color_news_soldier/]Red Color News Soldier[/url]

Whats interesting is that at an event held by someone WHO WAS THERE and saw the horros of Communism, there were still Berkley idiots* who would promote those beliefs!

*This is not to say all of Berkley people are idiots. But a good majority are flaming Communists or liberals.

[Jake_old]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'C')ommunism is a society based on 'from each according to his abilities, to each according to his needs'. Before 1921 ( the crushing of Kronstadt ) the revolution was very progressive. Then worker control of factories was taken away and Soviets we taken under state control. This was the beginning of state capitalism.

[legit]

The thing that rules it out from being communist was that the workers weren't in control of the means of production. The state was, thus the USSR was State capitalist.

[Jake_old]

Ahem

erm.......

It seems I have to do a rather embarrassing turnaround here. It would appear that communism requires the abolishment of the state.(private property and communism, translation 1957)

It seems to me that the industrialisation of Russia (called electrification) would require the state to sieze control of the means of production. That however doesn't help my argument at all, as it meant a movement away from communism.

This means that

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')his is sort of an interesting example of the 1920's through 1980's American propaganda motif of Communism and freedom as juxtaposed concepts. There are of course just as many totalitarian oppressive right wing regimes as there are totalitarian oppressive left wing regimes, but by couching it as communism vs. freedom, it's easy to distract people from the more fundamental issues at play.

[rogerhb]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('RedJake', 'I')t would appear that communism requires the abolishment of the state.

[NEOPO]

What if the Neocons were actually Communists?

What if the communists were actually something much older?

What if this much older group helped build and then systematically infiltrated every aspect of the global economy and politics and thereby virtually controlled everything?

If they had everything but total control what else would they want?
right.........

Before anyone tries to easily dismiss these thoughts from their minds just have a look back at the 20th century with a big picture kinda view.
I know that basically every conflict was some sort of manipulation.
I see how they have split and then pit the world against itself repeatedly and its on every level macro to micro.

I know that America was a huge help to hitler and I bet if we knew Russian history better and could dig in those records we would find the other clue as to how a broken and bruised Germany managed to rise to power and do what it did in such a short time.
Don't follow the money as much as follow the power.
We basically split europe down the middle.

Yes I bet there is much much more to this.

I wonder if any peakers can maybe help shed some light on this and subjects related to it........

[skiwi]

Anything you haven't viewed on this page

Or torrent better versions of them and other perspectives at conspiracycentral

Ah well back to pottering around in the greenhouse now the rains eased off.
So many holes in the roof I even get wet in there when it rains.

[mmasters]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NEOPO', 'W')hat if the Neocons were actually Communists?

What if the communists were actually something much older?

What if this much older group helped build and then systematically infiltrated every aspect of the global economy and politics and thereby virtually controlled everything?

[Ludi]

Naw. They're just your common or garden Authoritarians, been around for years. Probably won't be able to successfully stage a coup, because currently the military isn't too thrilled with them. But they get their way eventually, if we let them, which we certainly have, in general.

[Loki]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'N')aw. They're just your common or garden Authoritarians, been around for years. Probably won't be able to successfully stage a coup, because currently the military isn't too thrilled with them. But they get their way eventually, if we let them, which we certainly have, in general.

[Zardoz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Loki', '.')..But the neo-cons have fucked up pretty much everything they've touched...

[Novus]

NEOPO, if you continue down your train of thought you will eventually discover the Illuminati who are the proxy rulers of the world. Dividing the world into feuding sides has been part of their mission since their founding. So goes an Illuminati proverb: "A sail that splits the wind is free move against the wind." Divide the world and you conquer the world. Their power is ultimate and their knowledge of everything is damn near close. They organized and funded the Club of Rome. They discussed the very topics we discuss of this forum only they were doing it 40 years ago. The world that we now see on the brink is a world of their creation.

[xerces]

On election night, I was hanging out with a group of friends. And we were basically discussing some of the wealth re-distribution plans that Obama was proposing. I strongly disapprove of such methods and very quickly found out that nearly all of my friends were for it. In short, almost all of a group of educated mid-20s people were supporting a government that would give them money that they didn't earn.

Being a little perplexed by all of this, I gave my old man a call and we talked about this obsession with socializing other people's wealth. My father mentioned that when he was my age, he believed it as well. He believed as a young man that people should willingly give up their wealth and material possessions for the greater good. That a society should take all that a person is capable of producing and give to those that needs it. He also mentioned that it was all government bullsh*t, just propaganda designed to get young people to do stupid things for a political party. He told me that during the cultural revolution in China, a generation of young people sacrificed their youth and energy for the corrupt goals of handful of political power-brokers. In the end those people woke up in their 30s with no money, no skills, and was totally abandoned by their own government. And that was why he stopped believing that communism could work.

I'm interested in hearing everyone's opinion on this matter?

[coyote]

Read the Communist Manifesto through once. Then you'll know what to criticize. Obama is not a communist.

[xerces]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('coyote', 'R')ead the Communist Manifesto through once. Then you'll know what to criticize. Obama is not a communist.

[eastbay]

Here it is, if anyone wants to become familiar with it (for academic purposes, of course).

[kokoda]

Obama isn't a communist.

Redistribution of wealth would however solve a lot of the problems the US currently has.

Ask yourself one simple question ... why did so many people who received sub-prime loans default?

Simple answer ... they didn't have enough money to make the repayments.

For capitalism to survive and prosper you need consumers. To have consumers you need to have people who are willing ... and able to spend cash.

At the moment you have a situation in the US where 1% of the population hoard approximately 33% of the wealth. You have CEOs earning more in a year than a lot of ordinary workers can earn in a lifetime.

This wealth imbalance is what I believe is at the heart of America's current economic meltdown.

It is what has caused the current debt problem as people in the lower economic group tend to borrow heavily only to find that they cannot ever earn enough to repay those loans.

Borrowing is fine if you can service the debt ... however if you can't it is the recipe for economic disaster.

[VMarcHart]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('xerces', '.')..the wealth re-distribution plans Obama was proposing...

[kokoda]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('xerces', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('coyote', 'R')ead the Communist Manifesto through once. Then you'll know what to criticize. Obama is not a communist.