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PeakOil is You

PeakOil is You

Is this the "worst case"?

General discussions of the systemic, societal and civilisational effects of depletion.

Re: Is this the "worst case"?

Unread postby Northern_Pike » Fri 31 Oct 2008, 10:24:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vtsnowedin', 'W')e spend a lot of time contemplating conditions here in North America post peak oil but imagine for a minute if you will KSA after the last barrel is pumped. That last barrel will probably sell for $1000 but who will be running the pump and where will it get shipped? Will the country revert to a pile of sand crisscrossed with rusting plumbing? Wonder what their plan to keep the oil wealth is?


I doubt the KSA has a viable post oil depletion plan. I saw an interview a while back in which a Saudi official said that the Kingdom was investing heavily into R&D of alternative energies for the day when oil production depletes. However, I personally doubt they will find a solution usable to the rest of the world. Of course, there is plentiful, bright solar energy available in the desert. But, how do they transfer that energy product to the rest of the world in any usable form? Maybe they will come up with some miracle energy source; I won’t delay my preparations in anticipation of that eventuality.

As for “crisscrossed with rusting plumbing”: I think all that oil drenched steel, in that hot dry environment, polished by endless blowing sand, might be the world’s largest and easiest supply of recoverable and recyclable steel. After all, Saudi steel, it is just sitting out there on top of the ground, not covered, or buried behind and under concrete and brick.

Once the other nations of the world get their technology back up to the level of sail-powered clipper ships, and can come get the steel to transport back home, the wandering nomad tribes of the desert might be able to profit by trading that steel to the sailing merchants. That is if the nomads can defend the resource well enough to retain rights and claim to the steel. Otherwise, raiding marauders will just take it from them without compensation.

Once oil is gone, local Saudis should develop a means to recycle and convert half the steel into plows, of the sort animals pull, to be used for trade to other nations. And, the remaining half of steel should be converted into weapons capable of defending the trade half. They need to keep the weapon tech to themselves and trade away only the plows. Perhaps future steel smelting furnaces can be run on residual oil, or some sort of solar powered configuration.

Knowing well the ancient ways of desert living, and the number of camels and tents, as well as, possibly the amount of steel a future Saudi nomad can recover, hide, and defend, may all combine to determine the wealth of the future individual desert dweller. Needless to say, it won’t be measured in oil.

- Pike
Matthew 24:1- 24:51
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Re: Is this the "worst case"?

Unread postby rockdoc123 » Fri 31 Oct 2008, 10:40:11

I think there are some misconceptions hanging around. $100/bbl oil did not change consumer behavior. You could argue $140/bbl certainly did. A price for oil anywhere from $70- $90 is not going to destroy world economies. The reason everything is in the toilet right now is almost all to do with the credit crisis. One could argue that if the credit crisis had not happened we would still be sitting near $100/bbl. This would especially be true if the hedge funds hadn't been forced into liquidating their oil positions. The flee to the $US dollar as a percieved means of safety (although I understand why this happens I can't help shaking my head as to why anyone would look at the US economy as having any safety in it anywhere) has also had it's impact by pushing oil price lower.

When it is all said and done oil and pretty much every commodity and for that matter equity is more controlled by investor sentiment than it is by demand/supply realities. The business press exacerbates the situation by turning everything into "a sure sign that economic end times are near". Panic currently is rife, no amount of real information regarding the lack of new oil coming on stream, the fact that major projects are being shelved, that small natural gas players are going out of business or being forced to merge has any impact, but if the press announces layoffs of a hundred people at a pillow factory it most certainly will result in a wave of panic selling. Such is the current market mentality. No one actually knows for sure that this is going to be a very bad recession...it is pretty much guess work at this point in time. But if you want to believe it, well it will come true by your own making.

I've said it a number of times recently and in the past as well ..... an artificially low oil price when the world is already consuming higher cost oil and we are not finding new cheap reserves is the absolute worst thing that can happen. If the price drops below $60 for any length of time all of the subsurface heavy oil projects will end up being shelved, offshore Brazil will get shelved, the UK North Sea will go strictly to blow down with no new investment to lengthen field life, Russia developments will tank. Cheap fuel will encourage people to consume more and we will end up in a slingshot effect.....increasing demand with a lot of oil which could have been available now taken off the market. Saudi Arabia saw this coming I think....this is why they have ploughed forward with developing their spare capacity irrespective of oil price. In a slingshot demand/price scenario they are set to increase their market share considerably.
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Re: Is this the "worst case"?

Unread postby Plantagenet » Fri 31 Oct 2008, 11:39:47

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Northern_Pike', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('vtsnowedin', 'W')e spend a lot of time contemplating conditions here in North America post peak oil but imagine for a minute if you will KSA after the last barrel is pumped. That last barrel will probably sell for $1000 but who will be running the pump and where will it get shipped? Will the country revert to a pile of sand crisscrossed with rusting plumbing? Wonder what their plan to keep the oil wealth is?


I doubt the KSA has a viable post oil depletion plan.


They are planning for the time when the oil runs out. The Saudis have used a portion of their oil income to create a 365 billion dollar "sovereign wealth fund."

World's largest sovereign wealth funds

Norway, KSA, and most of the other oil producing states also have very large sovereign wealth funds that they plan to tap when their oil is depleted.
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