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A glass half full

Discussions related to the physiological and psychological effects of peak oil on our members and future generations.

A glass half full

Unread postby Vogelzang » Fri 04 Jul 2008, 17:49:29

A glass half full
A pessimist may see a half a glass of water as half empty and an optimist may see a half a glass of water as half full. When I took P. Chem. I remember that most people taking it just learn how to do the word problems without really understanding it. Later on, I started thinking about these things in a philosophical way. Entropy is a confusing concept. Its often looked at as a measure of disorder (increasing disorder). There is no absolute entropy level or reference point that you can compare other entropy levels to. You can only measure changes in entropy. I remember when my P. Chem. teacher mixed some chemicals in class, went around the room and let us touch the beaker to feel the cold produced by the reaction. This was supposed to demonstrate that not all spontaneous reactions are exothermic. This reaction was endothermic. So what made the reaction go? After some explanation and writing some equations on the board we discovered that it was Gibbs free energy (calculated from entropy, temperature in degrees Kelvin and enthalpy (change in heat)) that made it work. Chemical potential is Gibbs free energy per mole, useful to a chemist to find which way a reaction is going to go and where the equilibrium point is.

OK, entropy always increases in spontaneous (naturally occuring) reactions. Every process contributes to the increase in the entropy level of the universe. If entropy is decreased in one system, this can only be done by increasing the entropy in another system with a net effect of contributing to an increase in entropy of the universe. It was theorized that one day the entire universe would even out completely because of this and would enter a condition known as heat death where no more processes were possible. It would be the end of the universe. This is also based on the belief that our universe is finite and all matter and energy in it came from the Big Bang explosion that created our universe.

This may seem like a depressing idea, but if you consider the fact that without entropy no processes can occur then it is essential that there is entropy for us to be here. If it wasn't for entropy, you wouldn't be here.

I thought of this years ago. Recently, I thought of the idea that if it wasn't for the drive to reproduce we wouldn't be here. Many people are even conceived and born by accident. If you follow what economists and investors say in the media, CNBC, Wall Street Journal, etc. you can see they accept the boom and bust cycles of the economy. They often refer to a significant drop in the indices as a correction as if it was needed to shake out the excesses in the market. They talk about the greed and fear in the market and how it shifts over time. They are familiar with Malthusian principles, but no one knows for sure what's going to happen in the future.

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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby Vogelzang » Fri 04 Jul 2008, 18:33:22

One possibility discussed by cosmologists is that we live in an oscillating universe, ie. our universe will stop expanding one day and start contracting until everything ends up back together again, a singularity, massive black hole or what? And then the whole process starts over again.
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby Concerned » Fri 04 Jul 2008, 20:53:51

Of course in real life the glass is BOTH half full and half empty at the same time.
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby jlw61 » Fri 04 Jul 2008, 20:58:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Concerned', 'O')f course in real life the glass is BOTH half full and half empty at the same time.

And the burning question is "Does it need to be emptied or refilled?"
When somebody makes a statement you don't understand, don't tell him he's crazy. Ask him what he means. -- Otto Harkaman, Space Viking
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby Heineken » Fri 04 Jul 2008, 21:07:13

Of course, the true situation is that the glass is no longer half full and half empty. It's less than half full. Probably much less than half full. Now optimists can proclaim, "Hey, the glass is a tenth full! Look on the bright side!"
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby MathMurderer » Fri 04 Jul 2008, 22:22:58

Not only is the glass 40% full and 60% empty (numbers invented :wink: ), the glass is also 2.5 times as large as it should be...
So if the remaining content of the glass is the amount of energy left, the empty space is the energy already consumed and the glass itself is the world population, finding a smaller glass would be advantageous.
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby Concerned » Fri 04 Jul 2008, 22:58:45

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jlw61', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Concerned', 'O')f course in real life the glass is BOTH half full and half empty at the same time.
And the burning question is "Does it need to be emptied or refilled?"

Oh it will be emptied i've no doubt, we are in drinking from the toilet bowl (tar sands, CTL, Shale) might even break some of the glass and spill some while we are at it.

Perhaps it can get re-filled on a billion year time frame. So for an optimist it's all "blue sky" heck look at the hydrocarbons on Titan!! we'll mine the stars. LOL ;) God damn we are going to hit this brick wall HARD ain't we *sigh*
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby mos6507 » Sat 05 Jul 2008, 00:25:32

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Vogelzang', 'O')ne possibility discussed by cosmologists is that we live in an oscillating universe, ie. our universe will stop expanding one day and start contracting until everything ends up back together again, a singularity, massive black hole or what? And then the whole process starts over again.

I used to really be attracted to this theory for how it explains the big bang and provides for infinity. But it's a pretty unpopular theory these days because of the discovery that the universe's expansion is actually accelerating.
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby Vogelzang » Sun 06 Jul 2008, 20:37:16

For the open minded see link. Einstein and all of his followers are charlatans.
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby Ludi » Sun 06 Jul 2008, 21:09:32

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Vogelzang', 'E')instein and all of his followers are charlatans.

"All of his followers" - you mean, like, physicists and stuff. Scientists. Those guys? 8O
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby Homesteader » Sun 06 Jul 2008, 21:29:13

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Vogelzang', 'E')instein and all of his followers are charlatans.
"All of his followers" - you mean, like, physicists and stuff. Scientists. Those guys?

Gotta be, you know, like Stephen Hawking and the other "best minds of the past 75 years or so. Charlatans one and all.
<sarcasm off> just to be clear to everybody.
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby Vogelzang » Sun 13 Jul 2008, 09:32:58

See: link1 and link2 and link3

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')ews: Einstein — Genius or Plagiarist? - 5 Dec 04
Professor Friedwardt Winterberg has recently published a paper in German scientific journal Z. Naturforsch showing that Einstein may well have plagiarized David Hilbert's work in the development of General Relativity. A 1997 paper published by Corry, Renn and Stachel in Science had argued that Hilbert had amended his paper on seeing Einstein's finished work, but this has now been disproved. In fact, Einstein continued to put forward his incorrect derivation of General Relativity after Hilbert had derived the correct equations. But Einstein may have had some underhanded allies: Hibert's original proofs for his paper preceding Einstein's have been deliberately mutilated, with key sections cut out that have helped obscure this issue. Science is almost invariably a collaborative venture with each person building on another person's work. Einstein's name has been synonymous with genius because he had the knack of deriving highly original theories out of thin-air, with thought experiments. Now we may know where his "genius" came from. (For more information, read Christopher J. Bjerknes's book, Albert Einstein: The Incorrigible Plagiarist or visit his website.)
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Re: A glass half full

Unread postby eXpat » Sat 02 Aug 2008, 14:10:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GASMON', 'A')n electron, a proton, and neutron walk into a bar and order a couple of drinks. They finish their drinks and the bartender as them to pay their tab. He says to the electron "you owe me 10," to the proton "15" and he says to the neutron "for you no charge."

That would be THE joke in a geek soiree :)
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