[RIPSmithianEconomics]

I think a big problem for guys my age (teenagers) is lack of decent role-models, and not only that, but good standards to live up to. One the one side, we get the "lad" culture, which tells us to view women as sex objects, drink heavily, behave violently and to indulge in general hedonism. On the other side, we get feminists who either believe we are inherently flawed or talk about our "feminine side", as if they have any experience whatsover about how we are made up.

[RIPSmithianEconomics]

But here's a nice little set of complementary things about men and women by a woman called Lindsay Claxton-

WOMEN

Physically adapted to childbirth

Nurturing

Love expressed verbally and by attention to detail

Multi-tasking

Practical

Demonstrative

Intuitive

MEN

Physically Stronger

Protective

Love expressed by action

Focused

Inventive

Stoical

Logical

SHARED

Able to Feel

Capable of Empathy

Need for Love

Need for intimacy

Need for Touching

"And it should be accepted that those listed under the shared characteristics are not the exclusive province of women."

Obviously there are lots of cross-overs, but it is nice to recognise the positive general characteristics of men and women, while stressing general.

[uNkNowN ElEmEnt]

I have a pre-teen son and know how difficult it is for young men to find decent role models. Like a lot of people there are so many different expectations that finding your direction can be extremely difficult.

Once you decide who you want to be and how you want to be, it might be easier to find someone who exemplifies the characteristics you admire. Abraham Lincoln is an easy and good one. I really think its a shame there isn't more mentoring now-a-days. If you had a mentor do you think that would be good or indifferent?

[0mar]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('uNkNowN ElEmEnt', 'I') have a pre-teen son and know how difficult it is for young men to find decent role models. Like a lot of people there are so many different expectations that finding your direction can be extremely difficult.

Once you decide who you want to be and how you want to be, it might be easier to find someone who exemplifies the characteristics you admire. Abraham Lincoln is an easy and good one. I really think its a shame there isn't more mentoring now-a-days. If you had a mentor do you think that would be good or indifferent?

[ubercynicmeister]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('RIPSmithianEconomics', 'I') think a big problem for guys my age (teenagers) is lack of decent role-models, and not only that, but good standards to live up to.

[PenultimateManStanding]

ubercynic, how about telling us some of the guys message? As for role models, when I was a kid I wanted to be like Jimmy Stewart, Humphrey Bogart, Steve McQueen, James Garner and that scientist guy who invented the Time Machine (his name escapes me at the moment) Cary Grant was way too polished for me. James Coburn was too slick. Charles Bronson too tough (I was a sensitive kid, somewhat, though I got in my fair share of fights). Threadbear, Unknown Element you're about my age (well, almost) who did you ladies look up to on the silver screen? Betty Davis, Kate Hepburn, Faye Dunaway? Did they influence you?

[cube]

I never had any good role-models while growing up but I think I turned out normal.....I've only killed 10 people and sold off twice that number into slavery.

Anyways I used to watch lots of cartoons so if I did have any role models it would probably be characters from the show He-man, Gi Joe, Thunder Cats, Robotech, and the Transformers. Looking back now I guess the female characters fall into 1 of 2 roles:
1. cute girls that kick ass
2. cute girls that are submissive

Which do I prefure?

[PenultimateManStanding]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', '
')1. cute girls that kick ass
2. cute girls that are submissive

Which do I prefure?

[threadbear]

Penultimate, There's no woman specifically, I'd want to really emulate except for my friend "E" --Cadbury heiress, psychic sensitive and physically disabled--the most astonishing person I've ever met and under the strangest circumstances--- and my mother. Both of these women put everyone before themselves, in a heroic rather than a submissive martyr type way. This is the kind of thing I admire. ANYONE can be a corporate CEO, like Karly Fiorini, very few can attain real beauty and purity of spirit. The elf queen, Kate Blanchett played in Lord of the Rings--that's who I want to be like. She projects these qualities. We need to reawaken the hero and heroine archetypes.

Ripsmithian The world is so messed up right now. We're so so far from what we could be. And it IS worse than it was many decades ago.

To be a "lad" isn't noble. To be a feminist idealogue isn't noble either. Men and women's roles should be like a dance of reciprocity, not an awkward jig--all elbows and attitude tripping each other up. This makes me despair. People will toss out cynicism, radical feminism, and all the other isms and seize the moment, when they realize they're actors duped into living out useless , outdated political scripts, completely ill suited for the times and the spirit. Until then, be brave.

[somethingtosay]

I found my role modes in books and fiction. Asimov's Robot and Foundation Stores are fantastic as they are full of hope and honorable characters; Robert Bolts depiction of Sir Thomas Moore in the play "A Man for all Seasons" has the most infuence on me now in my Adult Life; Another one would be CS Friedman novel "In Conquest Born"; CS Lewis "Cronicles of Narnia" left a favorable impression on me when I was young.

[PenultimateManStanding]

My mentioning of moviestar influences refer mainly to my pre-adolescence years. Maybe you will laugh, I don't know. But by the time I was thirteen the biggest influence on me came from the music of the 60s. Beatles, hippies and psychedelic music. That crap had a hold of me and wouldn't let go until I was 19-20 years old and gave away all my records and renounced popular culture for a decade at least.

[PenultimateManStanding]

Since the topic is role-models and influences on young people trying to establish their identities, I should mention that many young people can fall under the influence of charismatic leaders of one kind or another. In my case it was the radio spiritual teacher Roy Masters. He was doing his radio teaching going back to the 60s (and is still going by the way though I haven't listened to his programs since the 70s) There has been controversy over whether he is a cult leader. I don't think so, myself. Now that guy has a great deal to say about male-female relations. He's the one who turned Bob Dylan into a Christian.

[Terran]

If you look at the majority of the youth today, you don't really see much hope. I know I'm still in high school, and you don't really see much hope or use. We're all influenced into the idea of consumerism, getting the most expensive or top brand clothing or shoes would bring you status, and popularity. This is deemed "cool" but it's all perpetuated by advertising, and marketing this creates this so called cultural standard. This is one of the reasons why alot of them have no respect what so ever towards other people. They're brought up with the impression that it's okay to treat women like objects, and girls also buy into this as well. Look at my generation today, many of members of my fellow age worship hip-hop, rap music, and MTV like they're life is based on it. Then there are the one's who try to act like gangster, something I don't want to get into. The problem is they're unwilling to think for themselves, so marketing does it for them by creating the so called "trends" and many of those sad souls seem to follow.
At least for me, I don't buy into any of these things, it's just extra profits to be made by those corporations. I don't care what those so called trend followers think about me, I'm able to think for myself, and I'm free in all the ways they're not. See what's wrong with my generation?

[threadbear]

Terran, Good for you. You're a strong person, unfortunately your schoolmates probably aren't. Don't you think it's amazing that these corporations manage to herd the flock towards retail outlets, with advertising that targets their unique, independant selves? This is such a twisted cosmic joke.

[KiddieKorral]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('threadbear', 'T')erran, Good for you. You're a strong person, unfortunately your schoolmates probably aren't. Don't you think it's amazing that these corporations manage to herd the flock towards retail outlets, with advertising that targets their unique, independant selves? This is such a twisted cosmic joke.

[ubercynicmeister]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('PenultimateManStanding', 'u')bercynic, how about telling us some of the guys message?

[Phil]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'O')verall, women control consumer spending by a wide margin in vitually every consumer category. With spending power comes other forms of power.

[lotrfan55345]

You know whats weird, I've never had a role model, ever. Even when i was like 4. Is that really weird?

[PenultimateManStanding]

Lotrfan everybody has role models of some sort. If you had grown in another environment you would be different than you are. You know about the old Nature vs. Nuture debate. Its a debate because both sides have some truth. The biggest influences are the adults who looked after you when you were an infant, toddler, then little kid. If you are like most of us, you'll be taking a closer look at who you are in the coming years and know that at lot of stuff is there in you because 'they' put it there.

[threadbear]

Ubercynicmeister, Good quotes, though the dude who's now voting republican---I don't know. Voting against one form of weirdness in support of another?

Radical feminists's ipolitical view, that the patriarchy was oppressive, had merit. In the last 40 years, using guilt as leverage, an equally oppressive matriarchy has almost replaced it. This is what feminists have to look at. I'm extremely suspicious of feminist deconstructionists who are able to deconstruct every ideology and mind-set but their own. I've lost women friends over this. My favorite quote from someone who had been a pretty good friend:

" I don't know if we can be friends. You just refuse to look back on your life through the lens of male domination and oppression and it's getting in the way."

My brother says it best--"Men are the new women"

Cynic, Keep holding your head high, and try not to hold individuals accountable for the new systemic social insanity, replacing the old systemic insanity. It's going to change and hopefully for the better. Corporations just love isms that drive wedges between individuals.. More single owner homes and apartments, equals more stuff to sell. So much of this crap is corporate driven.