[threadbear]

It's far more convoluted than that, and there are many different ways that a contract can be structured with many different players involved. Why wouldn't you sell your contract for more than you purchased it for to another party, and so on, up the chain? It doesn't mean you think the value of the contract is going down.

[smallpoxgirl]

NYMEX futures are not convoluted at all. You put down $8000 in starting margin and sell a contract. The contract is for 1000 barrels of oil. If the price goes down a dollar, the value of your contract goes up $1000. If the price goes up a dollar, your contract goes down in value by $1000 and you may have to deposit additional margin. At any time you can choose to cover your short position by buying a contract back from the market. If you choose not to cover, then within a specified time after expiration, you deliver 42,000 gallons of light sweet crude to Cushing, Oklahoma. In return you receive the final trading price X 1000 as payment. In no conceivable way do you make money by taking a short position when the price is going up.

[Cashmere]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SmallPoxGirl', 'I')t looks to me like what's going on is that they've decided that there is entirely too much money to be made in this oil gig and they don't want anyone except the oil barons cutting in on the action. They're absolutely not talking about killing the futures market. They're talking about limiting it to people in the oil business. Guess what, those are the very people most likely to be in a position to manipulate the market.

[Homesteader]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilFinder2', 'S')orry, no "huge run up" today. Down $2.45.

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'N')YMEX futures are not convoluted at all. .

[smallpoxgirl]

Well...it wasn't super clear to me what you were talking about, that's why I referred to NYMEX in my response. Maybe you could give examples of what you are talking about. The NYMEX price is what's used as a basis for other transactions. Your argument then is that traders are manipulating other oil future's markets and that's impacting NYMEX?

Futures markets are still a zero sum game. The only way for one person to make money is if somebody else loses it. In equity markets, the price of stock can rise and there can be more winners than losers. In futures and options, the only way you can make money is if somebody else loses.

[threadbear]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'W')ell...it wasn't super clear to me what you were talking about, that's why I referred to NYMEX in my response. Maybe you could give examples of what you are talking about. The NYMEX price is what's used as a basis for other transactions. Your argument then is that traders are manipulating other oil future's markets and that's impacting NYMEX?

[Homesteader]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Homesteader', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilFinder2', 'S')orry, no "huge run up" today. Down $2.45.

[Arsenal]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilFinder2', 'S')orry, no "huge run up" today. Down $2.45.

[Niagara]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', 'I')n futures and options, the only way you can make money is if somebody else loses.

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Niagara', 'I') make $1 gain on the stock plus $1 premium for a total profit of $200
You make $5 on the stock less the $1 premium for a total of profit of $400

[copious.abundance]

Well, with the $5.09 runup in the price today, the net increase for the week stands at $3.94. If it goes up $6.06 or more tomorrow, cashmere gets a lolipop for an accurate prediction, and we can see if all hell breaks loose in congress.

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilFinder2', 'w')e can see if all hell breaks loose in congress.

[DantesPeak]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('smallpoxgirl', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('OilFinder2', 'w')e can see if all hell breaks loose in congress.