This sounds more like a "wish list."
It would certainly be MY wish list.
Unfortunately, this list assumes we have a good idea what's about to happen.
We don't.
And no one's doin' nuthin.
PeakOil is You
Ten Ways to Prepare for a Post-Oil Society
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Re: Ten Ways to Prepare for a Post-Oil Society
by killJOY » Mon 14 Apr 2008, 15:55:59
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Re: Ten Ways to Prepare for a Post-Oil Society
by Iaato » Mon 14 Apr 2008, 16:15:32
It's a nice list, Gasmon. JHK is a good writer, and he gets it. Thanks for dredging it back up.
I wonder if Kunstler's Year 2000 apocalypse misdirection was based on intuitive recognition of peak oil changes without the right target? Whatever. He's got it now.
I wonder if Kunstler's Year 2000 apocalypse misdirection was based on intuitive recognition of peak oil changes without the right target? Whatever. He's got it now.
“Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value ---- zero.” --Voltaire
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Re: Ten Ways to Prepare for a Post-Oil Society
by Tyler_JC » Mon 14 Apr 2008, 16:15:58
Kunstler is a loon and I disagree with most of his points.
But I do agree that a transition to rail/sea transportation is a necessity. And it will happen as a result of increased oil prices. I don't see that as a cause for alarm. Unless you're a truck driver.
The modern electric grid is going to be fine because electricity is easy to produce. Fuel is a much trickier game. I don't understand why people say "oil is going to run out" and then start talking about the need to live in a post-electric society.
If anything, we are going to ramp up electricity consumption to compensate for the lack of transport fuel.
But I do agree that a transition to rail/sea transportation is a necessity. And it will happen as a result of increased oil prices. I don't see that as a cause for alarm. Unless you're a truck driver.
The modern electric grid is going to be fine because electricity is easy to produce. Fuel is a much trickier game. I don't understand why people say "oil is going to run out" and then start talking about the need to live in a post-electric society.
If anything, we are going to ramp up electricity consumption to compensate for the lack of transport fuel.
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Re: Ten Ways to Prepare for a Post-Oil Society
by jlw61 » Mon 14 Apr 2008, 16:41:12
In reply to the article you posted.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '1'). Expand your view ...
… trying to salvage the entire Happy Motoring system by shifting it from gasoline to other fuels will only make things much worse.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '1'). Expand your view ...
… trying to salvage the entire Happy Motoring system by shifting it from gasoline to other fuels will only make things much worse.
Absolutely correct. However, I do not propose to ban cars, but to simply remove all of the subsidies and incentives to use one.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '2'). We have to produce food differently...
It also presents huge problems in land-use reform, not to mention the fact that the knowledge and skill for doing these things has to be painstakingly retrieved from the dumpster of history. Get busy.
That's not even the beginning. We've more than doubled our population and concentrated a huge number of people into the cities because of the current farming system. At the very least, everyone will need to plant victory gardens wherever possible. And I'm not sure that will prevent disaster in places like New York, Las Vegas, and Phoenix.
Also, laws have to change or even better, repealed. We're hypersensitive over food quality and a farmer of the 60's would never be allowed to sell his products on the market. Further, the corporations have had laws passed that makes it nearly impossible for small farmers to exist in some states.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '3'). We have to inhabit the terrain differently...
The faculties will have to be overthrown. Our attitudes about land use will have to change dramatically. The building codes and zoning laws will eventually be abandoned and will have to be replaced with vernacular wisdom. Get busy.
The graduate schools of architecture are still tragically preoccupied with teaching Narcissism.
Yeah, right. Right after the die-off. Good luck on this.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '4'). We have to move things and people differently...
Let’s start with railroads, and let’s make sure we electrify them so they will run on things other than fossil fuel or, if we have to run them partly on coal-fired power plants, at least scrub the emissions and sequester the CO2 at as few source-points as possible... Put down your iPod and get busy.
I'm getting tired of the "get busy" line. Yes, and this means massive changes in laws, redirecting taxes and moving a mountain to create a molehill. This sounds simple on the surface but we're talking massive changes in POLITICAL thinking and tax law. Simply stating this does nothing. It's obvious to anyone who sits down for 10 minutes to think things through.
You need to forward some ways to implement this... Get busy.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '5'). We have to transform retail trade...
Internet shopping is totally dependent now on cheap delivery, and delivery will no longer be cheap.
So now you are admitting the rail and water thing won't work? If we have electrified rail with lots of electric generation, then the transportation is cheaper, not more expensive. So which is it?
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '6'). We will have to make things again in America. However, we are going to make less stuff...The truth is, we don’t know yet how we’re going to make anything. This is something that the younger generations can put their minds and muscles into.
We will have fewer things to buy, fewer choices of things.
Now we're talking an economic collapse. How will we make anything???? I'm sorry, but we'll make it like we used to make it. Sure, there will be fewer choices for many things, but the local mills can and will come back if we maintain and expand our electric generation capabilities. If we don't, it won't matter because the few people left after the riots and die-off will be using left overs for a generation.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '7'). The age of canned entertainment is coming to an end. It was fun for a while. We liked “Citizen Kane” and the Beatles. But we’re going to have to make our own music and our own drama down the road. We’re going to need playhouses and live performance halls...The Internet is not going to save canned entertainment. The Internet will not work so well if the electricity is on the fritz half the time (or more).
OK, so electric rail is out... we're talking die-off scenario here. Either we have electric rail and a decent grid or we don't, take your pick.
BTW, I live in a city of about 200,000 and we have LOTS of theaters, singers, musicians, and artists of every type. Much of it is easily within the beer (or at least the inexpensive wine) budget.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '8'). We’ll have to reorganize the education system. The centralized secondary school systems based on the yellow school bus fleets will not survive the coming decades.
