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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Ferretlover » Sat 29 Mar 2008, 19:25:05

Welcome.
You look familiar... You related to Vision_Master?
"Open the gates of hell!" ~Morgan Freeman's character in the movie, Olympus Has Fallen.
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby steam_cannon » Sat 29 Mar 2008, 22:44:35

Welcome to the club, I hope you enjoy being schooled... :twisted:

Lesson 1 - Overpopulation

Image

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ferretlover', 'W')elcome.
You look familiar... You related to Vision_Master?
Yeah, probably the same yellow smile too! --> :lol:
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby steam_cannon » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 00:06:26

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GASMON', '4'). Curb aviation to long distance only - ban internal & short haul flights
- do as the Germans do & replace the plane by a train (Frankfurt to
Munich read Manchester to London)
Great idea, though I'm worried any such actions will accelerate
climate change. Would you like to guess what happened when
all the planes in the US were grounded after 9/11? Scroll down to
find out. :twisted:

Lesson 2 - Global Dimming

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')lobal dimming

The human being underestimated the speed in which the climate
changed and it may be too late to overcome to that. We call it
global dimming and it's different from global warming but
contributes to it. You can check the definition of global dimming on
wikipedia here :

"Global dimming is a term describing the gradual reduction in the
amount of sunlight observed reaching the Earth's surface since the
1950s. The effect varies by location but globally is of the order of a
5% reduction over the three decades 1960-1990; the trend has
reversed during the past decade. Global dimming creates a cooling
effect that may have led scientists to underestimate the effect of
greenhouse gases on global warming."

The tools used to measure sun's radiations are based on water
evaporation to measure if there has been a possible change with
incadescence of the light. In 40 years space there has been a
serious reduction sunlight from 20% all over the world but the
change of the light does not justify the global temperature (9%
Antartica, 10% USA, 15% in Europe, 30% in Russia): that's called global dimming.

http://politiquesusa.blogspot.com/2005/ ... mming.html

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('steam_cannon', 'P')resently the water droplets and soot from industry are blocking
10 - 30% of the sun over much of the planet...

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('BBC News', 'B')ut perhaps the most alarming aspect of global dimming is that it
may have led scientists to underestimate the true power of the
greenhouse effect.

They know how much extra energy is being trapped in the Earth's
atmosphere by the extra carbon dioxide we have placed there.

What has been surprising is that this extra energy has so far
resulted in a temperature rise of just 0.6 degree Celsius.

This has led many scientists to conclude that the present-day
climate is less sensitive to the effects of carbon dioxide than it was,
say, during the ice age, when a similar rise in CO2 led to a
temperature rise of six degrees Celsius.

But it now appears the warming from greenhouse gases has been
offset by a strong cooling effect from dimming - in effect two of our
pollutants have been canceling each other out.

This means that the climate may in fact be more sensitive to the
greenhouse effect than previously thought.

Link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/science/nature/4171591.stm

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('bbc.co.uk', '[')b]Global Dimming and the contrail discovery

"In the aftermath of 9/11 the entire US fleet was grounded..."

"DR David Travis suspected the grounding might make a small but
detectable change to the climate. But what he observed was
both immediate and dramatic.


We found that the change in temperature range during those three
days was just over one degrees C."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/sn/tvradio/program ... rans.shtml

Largest temperature spike in 30 years
Image
Video: http://www.metacafe.com/watch/200720/gl ... contrails/
In 2001 when all the planes and contrail clouds were removed from
the sky, that resulted in an immediate 1 degree Celsius jump in
average temperature. Closing other industries as well would have
had an even more dramatic effect.

Thread: Mass Migration of US Climate Refugees
http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic31398.html

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')b]Nice High Resolution Video about Global Dimming
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid ... 0743771382
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/nova/sun/dimm-nf.html


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

No offense, peakoil.com is a deep rabit-hole...

Image

But we'll show you around wherever you want to go.
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Heineken » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 00:23:21

Welcome, Gas.

I think you are somewhat too optimistic, but I'm sure we'll cure you of that in due course.

Steam_Cannon's lesson is illustrative.
"Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog

"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---I & my bro.
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby dunewalker » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 00:59:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('GASMON', 'B')ig problems looming soon, Oil, Gas, Coal, Nuclear all running out & when its gone, its gone. How long will stock last, with the rise of China & India, who knows, 40, 60, 100 years?. I'll be allright, my children will start to suffer later in life, their children will definetley suffer, and the generation after that ?????????????.

Solutions - VERY DIFFICULT

1. SORT OUT THE WORLDS POLITICIANS, they are NOT engineers, there thick, useless parasites, the lot of them.
2. (Somehow) Drastically cut the perpetual rise in the worlds population.
3. Rebuild immediatley the railway / tramway network, Britain & America once led the way, France, Germany & Japan now do.
4. Curb aviation to long distance only - ban internal & short haul flights - do as the Germans do & replace the plane by a train (Frankfurt to Munich read Manchester to London)
5. Wean ourselves off cars - say 10-20 years, cant be 100% but aim for 50% reduction in cities/large towns - THIS is the way forward. (once public transport is in place)
6. "Free" Electricity for Britain - YES REALLY, we are an island with numerous large river estuaries, we have the one of the worlds highest tidal ranges, build barrages, Morecambe bay, Severn, Solway Firth etc, (& SOD THE WILDLIFE - ITS THEM OR US)

We must ENGINEER our way out of the problems forthcoming, and to do this we need GREAT LEADERSHIP & GREAT ENGINEERS.

Are there any left in the world ?.


Some good ideas, GASMON. The last part of number 6 (&SOD THE WILDLIFE-IT'S THEM OR US) will be the method of attaining number 2 (Somehow, drastically cut the perpetual rise in the world's population. Disregarding the health of the biosphere guarantees starvation for humans---an example is the cod, which you USED to enjoy with your chips.
"Wilderness is another civilization apart from our own." - H.D. Thoreau
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Iaato » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 01:07:59

Welcome Gasmon.

You are dictating lots of things that you want to happen. You may need to loosen your grip on life a bit. I'm not sure all of those orders are going to happen.

“Humankind has not woven the web of life. We are but one thread within it. Whatever we do to the web, we do to ourselves.” (Chief Seattle) I'm with PStarr on that comment about sodding the wildlife. If you sod them, you sod us.

And I guess I'm more right-brained than I thought. I apparently relate through peoples' avatars more than their written names. I see your post and I think Visionmaster.

Engineers help us to use technology; I'm not seeing much out of them beyond full-speed ahead with using up fossil fuel supply in some way or other. I'm not sure engineers are the answer; at least not the way they are currently educated and brainwashed.
“Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value ---- zero.” --Voltaire
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby steam_cannon » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 01:16:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Iaato', 'E')ngineers help us to use technology; I'm not seeing much out of them
beyond full-speed ahead with using up fossil fuel supply in some way
or other. I'm not sure engineers are the answer; at least not the way
they are currently educated and brainwashed.
I'm an engineer kind of guy at heart, but I absolutely agree that most
engineer types are focused on the wrong problems.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dunewalker', 'a')n example is the cod, which you USED to enjoy with your chips.
Good example...

Speaking of fish, another interesting topic: "Ocean Acidification".

No fishing in an acid ocean! 2030 all fishs are dead? CO2+
http://www.peakoil.com/fortopic34941.html

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

But GASMON, there is good news here too. We aren't all doom and
gloom, like this uplifting thread on things small farmers can do
to deal with skyrocketing fertilizer prices...

An answer to rocketing fertilizer prices
http://peakoil.com/fortopic38114.html
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby BigTex » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 02:56:04

Welcome.

Ditto what everyone else said.

Loosen up your areas of certainty.

Get a new avatar.

You'll like it here.
:)
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby mmasters » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 03:11:06

I had the same sentiment early on, it's a problem to be solved. People need to wake up. Then I came to the conclusion some problems can't be solved and it's greed and human stupidity that's gotten us into this trap - in short, we're screwed (a common sentiment around here). Then after a lot of thought and research I came to a stronger but more left field conclusion, that we're a essentially a bunch of cattle for a weird species of people running the show from behind the scenes. I don't believe peak oil will be the end of us but rather it will become a huge controlling factor over the population in step with the emergence of world government. Before a significant dieoff happens we will have unexpected technology and solutions begin to emerge along with a big brother of the worst kind. That's what I see happening.
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Ferretlover » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 10:14:04

Everyone and everything that lives on this planet is in trouble.
Serious trouble.
Read, Learn and Prep!
"Open the gates of hell!" ~Morgan Freeman's character in the movie, Olympus Has Fallen.
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby vision-master » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 10:39:29

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ferretlover', 'W')elcome.
You look familiar... You related to Vision_Master?


Yeah, find another ativar. :twisted:
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Heineken » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 10:49:32

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mmasters', 'I') had the same sentiment early on, it's a problem to be solved. People need to wake up. Then I came to the conclusion some problems can't be solved and it's greed and human stupidity that's gotten us into this trap - in short, we're screwed (a common sentiment around here). Then after a lot of thought and research I came to a stronger but more left field conclusion, that we're a essentially a bunch of cattle for a weird species of people running the show from behind the scenes. I don't believe peak oil will be the end of us but rather it will become a huge controlling factor over the population in step with the emergence of world government. Before a significant dieoff happens we will have unexpected technology and solutions begin to emerge along with a big brother of the worst kind. That's what I see happening.


You are not the first highly intelligent, established member I've seen gradually moving toward the dark side.

I'm convinced that anyone with a reasonable dose of grey matter who studies this stuff with a truly open mind must move in that direction. It's a matter of logic.

Everyone else is in denial, to one degree or another, for one reason or another (often very understandable reasons, such as children).
"Actually, humans died out long ago."
---Abused, abandoned hunting dog

"Things have entered a stage where the only change that is possible is for things to get worse."
---I & my bro.
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby gnm » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 11:26:57

Welcome! Good to have another industry engineer on!

If you are in your early 50's as you seem to indicate I would not be so sure that declines will not affect you personally and I am fairly sure that your children will be heavily impacted.

-G
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby static66 » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 11:30:59

Sod the wildlife, it's them or us....

My guess is it's us. The wildlife are doing it right, we're the fuckin idiots here fucking everything up....

I am walking through a post-apocalyptic England, I come across a random piece of paper with the GASMON's initial entry to PO.com on it.... Sod the wildlife, it's them or us...... have to chuckle.

We've sealed the deal my new optimistic fellow poster..... We are the ones going down, not the wildlife....

Mom's coming round to put it back the way it outta be.....(Tool)
"The word statistics originated in the German STATISTIKS, "State Arithmetic."
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby BigTex » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 11:48:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mmasters', 'I') had the same sentiment early on, it's a problem to be solved. People need to wake up. Then I came to the conclusion some problems can't be solved and it's greed and human stupidity that's gotten us into this trap - in short, we're screwed (a common sentiment around here). Then after a lot of thought and research I came to a stronger but more left field conclusion, that we're a essentially a bunch of cattle for a weird species of people running the show from behind the scenes. I don't believe peak oil will be the end of us but rather it will become a huge controlling factor over the population in step with the emergence of world government. Before a significant dieoff happens we will have unexpected technology and solutions begin to emerge along with a big brother of the worst kind. That's what I see happening.


You are not the first highly intelligent, established member I've seen gradually moving toward the dark side.

I'm convinced that anyone with a reasonable dose of grey matter who studies this stuff with a truly open mind must move in that direction. It's a matter of logic.

Everyone else is in denial, to one degree or another, for one reason or another (often very understandable reasons, such as children).


I think mm may have fallen off the side of a dark cliff. It doesn't seem gradual to me.

And I'm not too far behind him.

I keep hoping some big-brained stud (or studette) will mosey in here and start making really good arguments for why the doomer case is wrong. I would be receptive to these arguments, and would like to be talked out of a few unpleasant ideas.

But so far it's all quiet except for the cornies.
:)
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby steam_cannon » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 12:17:31

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')ASMON
Posts: 1

Image

And that was the last we ever saw of GASMON... :lol:
Last edited by steam_cannon on Sun 30 Mar 2008, 12:24:36, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Homesteader » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 12:18:50

All you doomers obviously haven't read the right self-help-pop-pscho-babble books ($24.99 or less at bookstores near you)

Y'all ain't got the right attitude! :lol:
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby steam_cannon » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 12:45:57

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Homesteader', 'A')ll you doomers obviously haven't read the right self-help-pop-psycho-babble
books ($24.99 or less at bookstores near you)

Y'all ain't got the right attitude! :lol:
But I read I'm OK-You're OK...

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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby Bas » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 15:52:58

ah, fresh blood! :twisted:


j/k we can always use new members to challenge the entranched views/opinions. Be prepared to be flamed though and don't let it bother you too much either is my advice.
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Re: New Member with Attitude !!

Postby BigTex » Sun 30 Mar 2008, 16:18:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bas', 'a')h, fresh blood! :twisted:


j/k we can always use new members to challenge the entranched views/opinions. Be prepared to be flamed though and don't let it bother you too much either is my advice.


GASMON, nice new avatar. Haven't seen that one here.

Contrary to what Bas said above, you may find a lot less flaming here than on some other sites. There is more good sportsmanship here than you might think (there is some flaming too).

If you're interested in really bending your mind up, this is the place to do it. And I'm not kidding. There are some ideas floating around here that are so compelling and disturbing at the same time it will make you want to vomit brain matter out of your eye sockets.

We need all the non-U.S. people we can get as well. The non-U.S. perspective is always valuable.
:)
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