"Why were there no riots in 1994, when the country was practially ripe, but simply a large win for the Repubilicans at the polls? The people have a vote and the only way to influence anything is through division. Only a fool would try to overturn a landslide vote."
“Nations have no permanent friends or allies, they only have permanent interests.”
Lord Palmerston
I'm sure there is no homogenous ruling class. Different families or groups [like the mafia] all vie for power to get "their man" into the seat. But don't let the left right paradigm fool you. While the ruling families may vie for the power of owning the sitting president, they do have permanent interests. In reality whoever gets in is bought a thousand times over to make sure that the ruling class keeps ruling. One of Clinton’s mentors Carroll Quigley [Ph.D. G. U. Professor of History Georgetown University] wrote a book called “Tragedy and Hope”: {the ruling class is the hope the mass is the tragedy}
“The National parties and their presidential candidates, with the Eastern Establishment assiduously fostering the process behind the scenes, moved closer together and nearly met in the center with almost identical candidates and platforms, although the process was concealed as much as possible, by the revival of obsolescent or meaningless war cries and slogans (often going back to the Civil War). … The argument that the two parties should represent opposed ideals and policies, one, perhaps, of the Right and the other of the Left, is a foolish idea acceptable only to the doctrinaire and academic thinkers. Instead, the two parties should be almost identical, so that the American people can “throw the rascals out” at any election without leading to any profound or extreme shifts in policy. … Either party in office becomes in time corrupt, tired, unenterprising, and vigorless. Then it should be possible to replace it, every four years if necessary, by the other party, which will be none of these things but will still pursue, with new vigor, approximately the same basic policies.”
~Carroll Quigley, Tragedy and Hope: A History of the World in Our Time (New York: Macmillan, 1966), pp. 1247-1248.]
He also commented on the central banks that had gained control around the world:
"[T]he powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country, and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion, by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements, arrived at in frequent private meetings and conferences.
The apex of the system was the Bank for International Settlements in Basle, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks, which were themselves, private corporations. The growth of financial capitalism made possible a centralization of world economic control, and use of this power for the direct benefit of financiers and the indirect injury of all other economic groups."
~Carroll Quigley, Tragedy and Hope: A History of the World in Our Time (New York: Macmillan, 1966) p.324
==AC
PeakOil is You
V takes on fear of death
Re: V takes on fear of death
by Angry_Chimp » Fri 14 Mar 2008, 23:49:53
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Angry_Chimp - Lignite
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Re: V takes on fear of death
by TWilliam » Sat 15 Mar 2008, 03:12:15
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mos6507', 'W')ere you cheering on 911 like the Palestinians did?
I was neither cheering nor cursing. You seem to have completely missed my point. I was simply indicating the irony that we seem to love the lone-wolf anti-hero in film, the one who bucks The System, yet when people actually attempt to buck The System in real life, or even better actually try to fight back, they're labeled 'terrorist' and denounced as criminals.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Angry_Chimp', '"')[T]he powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country, and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion, by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements, arrived at in frequent private meetings and conferences.
The apex of the system was the Bank for International Settlements in Basle, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks, which were themselves, private corporations. The growth of financial capitalism made possible a centralization of world economic control, and use of this power for the direct benefit of financiers and the indirect injury of all other economic groups."
~Carroll Quigley, Tragedy and Hope: A History of the World in Our Time (New York: Macmillan, 1966) p.324
John Perkins confirms the truth of this passage in his Confessions of an Economic Hit Man:
"That is what we EHMs [Economic Hit Men] do best: we build a global empire. We are an elite group of men and women who utilize international financial organizations to foment conditions that make other nations subservient to the corporatocracy running our biggest corporations, our government, and our banks. Like our counterparts in the Mafia, EHMs provide favors. These take the form of loans to develop infrastructure —electric generating plants, highways, ports, airports, or industrial parks. A condition of such loans is that engineering and construction companies from our own country must build all these projects. In essence, most of the money never leaves the United States; it is simply transferred from banking offices in Washington to engineering offices in New York, Houston, or San Francisco.
Despite the fact that the money is returned almost immediately to corporations that are members of the corporatocracy (the creditor), the recipient country is required to pay it all back, principal plus interest. If an EHM is completely successful, the loans are so large that the debtor is forced to default on its payments after a few years. When this happens, then like the Mafia we demand our pound of flesh. This often includes one or more of the following: control over United Nations votes, the installation of military bases, or access to precious resources such as oil or the Panama Canal. Of course, the debtor still owes us the money—and another country is added to our global empire."
...
"The subtlety of this modern empire building puts the Roman centurions, the Spanish conquistadors, and the eighteenth- and nineteenth-century European colonial powers to shame. We EHMs are crafty; we learned from history. Today we do not carry swords. We do not wear armor or clothes that set us apart. In countries like Ecuador, Nigeria, and Indonesia, we dress like local schoolteachers and shop owners. In Washington and Paris, we look like government bureaucrats and bankers. We appear humble, normal. We visit project sites and stroll through impoverished villages. We profess altruism, talk with local papers about the wonderful humanitarian things we are doing. We cover the conference tables of government committees with our spreadsheets and financial projections, and we lecture at the Harvard Business School about the miracles of macroeconomics. We are on the record, in the open. Or so we portray ourselves and so are we accepted. It is how the system works. We seldom resort to anything illegal because the system itself is built on subterfuge, and the system is by definition legitimate.
However—and this is a very large caveat—if we fail, an even more sinister breed steps in, ones we EHMs refer to as the jackals, men who trace their heritage directly to those earlier empires. The jackals are always there, lurking in the shadows. When they emerge, heads of state are overthrown or die in violent “accidents.” And if by chance the jackals fail, as they failed in Afghanistan and Iraq, then the old models resurface. When the jackals fail, young Americans are sent in to kill and to die." ~ from the introduction
If you haven't read John's book I highly recommend it. You will gain a clear understanding of how events such as 9/11 and the current unrest in various Central and South American (and Middle Eastern) countries is a direct result of U.S. foreign policies that have been in place for decades.
"It means buckle your seatbelt, Dorothy, because Kansas? Is goin' bye-bye... "
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Re: V takes on fear of death
by jboogy » Sat 15 Mar 2008, 03:12:40
jlw61 wrote
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he "...promote the general welfare..." interpretation was one time I wished Hamilton would have kept his trap securely shut.
Well, I guess you can wish all you want, doesn't erase the words.$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he "...promote the general welfare..." interpretation was one time I wished Hamilton would have kept his trap securely shut.
and
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') would strongly argue that this does not mean provide for a welfare state.
I'm going to have to side with the founders words over yours in this instance, no offense.
and
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hey didn't have our concept of welfare back then!
The breakdown in caring for those less able to fend for themselves is a bellweather of a society in terminal decline.
Maybe you derive some sense of satisfaction in seeing the poor, shuffling about Downtown, picking up cigarette butts and begging for change, or maybe you just don't care, I don't know.
I argue the defense industry is socialism, or even communism, but the recipients aren't the poor, they're the rich. Tax dollars being used to support something that couldn't survive without them.
and
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', ' ')The seeming unlimited growth of the "war on poverty" and the abject failure of same is proof that government does not belong in the "welfare" business.
and
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') am also saying that uncontrolled and improper spending is the problem.
and
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hus I am happy to be taxed (through one form or another) for authorized spending
The idea that fiat money needs to represent debt is a little tricky to grasp, it's fundamental money by its nature represents an obligation to the bearer, yet a non-fiat currency, say gold (actual gold - certificates are obviously a debt marker!) has intrinsic value (that is, there is a demand for the gold itself outside of its function as currency) and does not itself represent a debt (except for the energy expended to mine and process). So is it possible to issue currency without issueing debt?
