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Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Discussions of conventional and alternative energy production technologies.

Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby Judgie » Sat 10 Nov 2007, 21:19:01

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lorenzo', 'S')olar boats are fun for tourism.

But for big ocean-going container ships and tankers we use the SkySail.

Tests on small ships successful, big funds (EU money too) and first trials on huge ships from early 2008 onwards.

Image

Image

http://www.skysails.info/

Reduces fuel consumption by up to 50%.


This post reminds me of the scene from Costner's "Water World" where the pirates are attempting to row the Exxon Valdez.

Last time I saw one of those being used anywhere, it was as a test run on ocean maxi yacht AAPT. They dumped the concept soon after. Expensive, easily destroyed and difficult to control. Conventional rigs, and their modern equivalents such as the Dynarig (in commercial operation on the Maltese Falcon, and a option on new Perini yachts) are much more cost and physically effective.

Image

http://www.yachtingworld.com/yw/supersail/falcon.html
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby lorenzo » Sun 11 Nov 2007, 11:56:46

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Judgie', '
')Last time I saw one of those being used anywhere, it was as a test run on ocean maxi yacht AAPT. They dumped the concept soon after. Expensive, easily destroyed and difficult to control. Conventional rigs, and their modern equivalents such as the Dynarig (in commercial operation on the Maltese Falcon, and a option on new Perini yachts) are much more cost and physically effective.


I'm not a nautical architect, but apparently the SkySails people would disagree.

Winds at high altitudes are much stronger than surface winds, and they are far more stable too. Moreover, the kite is entirely computer controlled and it doesn't cause any heel.

Check out the technology:
http://www.skysails.info/index.php?id=45&L=1

Seems like the SkySail beats conventional rigs hands down.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby theozarker » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 00:50:36

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('eastbay', '[')i]Right now I'm building some box lid type passive solar convection heaters out of fiberboard and 1 x 2s to fit over the bottom halves of my south and west windows. It won't furnish all my heat for the winter, but it will help transition away from my gas heater as gas gets more expensive until I can figure out the next step. The idea came from an illustration of passive solar principles in an article for big passive solar ideas that I don't have the money to build.


No. I'm not joking.

Q: Is this contraption more efficient than just opening the curtains when the sun is shining? It's November 9th and we have yet to ignite the home heater using this simple old-school method and it's been in the low 30's many mornings. Rarely has it moved past the high 50's outside since late OCT.

Inside it's always in the low 60's, certainly nice enough for anyone who owns a sweater and a pair of socks.

Just wondering.



LOL, not sure because it's been in the upper 60s and low 70s here since I put it up, so I haven't opened the intake holes yet. But it's supposed to be highs in the 40s and 50s and lows in the 20s by Thanksgiving, and cloudy :x But cold and sunny by the weekend, so I should have a chance to find out by then. Will let you know how it works. Until then, I'm glad the gas is still available :)

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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby eastbay » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 01:04:57

Well how about this. No sooner do I brag about us not using the house heater and the weather decides to turn cloudy, cool, and rainy on us.

So we decide to 'test' the home heater burning a few minutes/ day of precious non- replenishable NAT GAS in the process. Still, we waited quite deep into the fall before we hit the switch. Nov 12th. Pretty late for Portland.

Starting tomorrow we're looking at a sunny low 30's to high 40's and we'll just open up the curtains, smile, and let the sun shine in with our old-school heating system. :)
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby eastbay » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 01:05:19

Solar ships... uh, lol...

... maybe they can heat the cabins by opening the curtains. That's about the most use out of solar power we'll ever get for ships. In other words, it'll never [s]fly[/s] sail dude.

In other, other words, that's one boat that won't float.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby Jester » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 13:47:38

Double double
post post
Last edited by Jester on Tue 20 Nov 2007, 13:56:32, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby Jester » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 13:48:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Graeme', '
')Thank you, Drifter. Many of the "technological wonders" you speak of are still under development. I have confidence that all of the problems remaining will be resolved by many researchers working on them throughout the world. Otherwise, this is a brilliant reply!


Do you really feel thats a realistic view ?

How often do "all problems" get resolved ? Have the researchers resolved a diabetics need for insulin ? How many important things have had tons of researchers working on the problems for decades and have yet to "resolve all the problems" ?

Yes, by all means have hope. I'm no doomer, I'm a realist. And realistically, the chances of everything miraculously getting resolved just because you hope for it. I remember 25 years ago, Ballard making headlines for it's fuel cell which would change everything. I bought into the hype then. Here I am 25 years later, and still no fuel cell vehicles that can change anything... And now it looks like Ballard wants out of the fuel cell for cars dealio... Nice.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby Twilight » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 17:37:59

Solar powered ships? That reminds me of a digital pendulum clock I once saw in a catalogue.

Introducing at great expense a working but unnecessary technology to another one which gets the job done on its own already.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby Dezakin » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 17:53:33

Or you could just use a small reactor. It seems to work for the navy.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby Twilight » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 18:21:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Dezakin', 'O')r you could just use a small reactor. It seems to work for the navy.

Yes, because they do not have to make a profit.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby fecteau » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 21:44:47

Drifter wrote:
$this->bbcode_second_pass_code('', 'I do think a lot of the technological things you post are workable, though on a smaller scale. Large scale, I'm not so sure.')

I remember an article about how the gasoline engine would never replace the horse for transportation. It was claimed to be workable on a smaller scale but what where you to do on larger scale when you need a mechanic to follow every car on the road to fix them as they fail to perform.

Greame, Keep on the good work.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby Dezakin » Tue 20 Nov 2007, 22:11:34

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Twilight', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Dezakin', 'O')r you could just use a small reactor. It seems to work for the navy.

Yes, because they do not have to make a profit.

The unprofitability of nuclear merchant shipping is far from assured. Its been tried twice decades ago in showboat ships not designed for economic competition in an era of extremely cheap oil. Not only would a nuclear ship save on fuel, but could go about twice as fast, delivering twice as much value per unit of capital.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby IslandCrow » Wed 21 Nov 2007, 04:43:20

Thinking of the narrow boats of the English canals:- are solar systems effective enough to power one of these boats? That would be better than reverting back to having horses draw the boats along.
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby Starvid » Wed 21 Nov 2007, 06:19:03

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('EnergyUnlimited', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Eli', 'I') hear scientists are now working on a solar powered Sun too.

...and after many years of research and $ few trillions worth of budget spent they will find out that this is impossible.

They will learn that Sun can be only nuclear powered and that no amount of technology or human ingenuity can change it.

:-D
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Re: Solar Ships coming out in 2009

Unread postby TheDude » Wed 21 Nov 2007, 07:34:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Eli', 'I') hear scientists are now working on a solar powered Sun too.


NIMBY!

Nuclear powered commercial ships described here.

I enjoy Graeme's stuff a lot. It's a relief from the bleak norm, and he simply posts these stories without grinding his ax.
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