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THE Chrysler Thread (merged)

What's on your mind?
General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.

Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby Ferretlover » Thu 01 Nov 2007, 11:36:33

Chrysler to Drop Four Models, Cut Up to 10,000 More Plant Jobs
Nov. 1 (Bloomberg) -- Chrysler LLC, the third-largest U.S. automaker, said it will eliminate four vehicles and cut as many as 10,000 additional hourly jobs to reduce expenses.
The Auburn Hills, Michigan-based company made the announcement today in a statement on PR Newswire.
Chrysler said in February it would cut 11,000 hourly and 2,000 salaried jobs in February over three years. That announcement came before it was bought by private-equity firm Cerberus Capital Management LP.
10,000 more jobs to be eliminated
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby Novus » Thu 01 Nov 2007, 13:07:33

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('nero', 'H')ow about a "Green-er" car. It would be nice if their was sign they were moving in that direction. Afterall we aren't going to be replacing our housing stock in the next 10 years.
*sigh*


Is that like the so called "Safe-er" cigarette.
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby whereagles » Thu 01 Nov 2007, 13:21:01

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('IslandCrow', 'I') know that many Europeans have gone to using diesel, but are there any plans by the European car makers to go electric or hybrid?


All of them are developing hybrid models. Even gas-guzzling manufacturer Porsche. Most hybrids are diesel too. City mileages of 3-4 litres/100 km expected (~60-70 mpg) and CO2 in the 80-100 g/km region.

Some companies are into plug-in hybrids and claim combined city/road mileages of 2,5 litres/100 km (~80 mpg) on E85 blends.

Companies aren't into full electric vehicle mode, though. Only a few prototype companies are doing it. That I know, no major is on to it.
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby lawnchair » Thu 01 Nov 2007, 13:40:29

Ah, Chrysler.

My family has been pretty much all Mopar for generations. My whole hometown largely drove Mopars, due to a much nicer dealer.

Fuel economy kills them. If I walked onto a Dodge/Chrysler dealership today, the most fuel efficient car they could sell me (Caliber) would be less fuel efficient than my not-really-tuned-up 11 year old Corolla, and would be about the same as the Aries K-car we had 25 years ago. Meanwhile, a new Corolla gets 10 miles more to the gallon, and the Toyota Avalon, a largish V6, will get about the same as that Caliber.

The problem is, 10 years ago the DCX merger anticipated that they'd be importing SmartCars and Chinese Chery models into the US by now, so there was no in-house engineering done on building a new efficient car. That decision has doomed Chrysler to be the first of the Big Three to disappear completely.
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby strider3700 » Thu 01 Nov 2007, 13:43:12

Oil prices are not the reasoning behind the 4 models being dropped

They are dropping
-PT cruiser convertable (poor sales)
-Pacifica SUV (It's more minivan then SUV and ugly as hell so poor sales)
- crossfire (cost the same as a BMW Z4 so which would you choose...)
- magnum wagon ( I've never seen one on the road so I'm assuming poor sales.

They are adding two new cars to the line up
dodge challenger (pure muscle car so screw fuel economy)
dodge journey ( another crossover SUV...)

of course they also have to throw in the blurb about putting together hybrid versions of the Aspen and durango Two huge gas guzzling SUV's.

If they cared at all about the price of gas and wanted to try competing they would release a hybrid neon to give the prius some form of competition.
shame on us, doomed from the start
god have mercy on our dirty little hearts
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby Slowpoke » Thu 01 Nov 2007, 17:08:15

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('whereagles', '
')Companies aren't into full electric vehicle mode, though. Only a few prototype companies are doing it. That I know, no major is on to it.

According to the official website, Dassault-Heuliez are going to sell the Cleanova II (based on the Renault Kangoo chassis) in two versions (all-electric, PHEV) starting next year.
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby whereagles » Fri 02 Nov 2007, 06:56:26

Interesting. But it still a heavy vehicle. We should be doing stuff in the vicinity of 500 kg, not 1000 kg.
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby Mesuge » Fri 02 Nov 2007, 07:34:22

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('IslandCrow', '
')
I know that many Europeans have gone to using diesel, but are there any plans by the European car makers to go electric or hybrid?


Short answer, in meaningfull - massproduced way NO!
We have the same bastards as well, Mr. Shell and Mrs. BP and others sucking bln. EUR of subsidies from public funds for promoting CNG and fuelcell scam'o'cars and the mighty pump infrustructure..

Technicaly speaking it's not a problem to build 450-600Kg yet safe platform car with .2 drag which would take only sub 5kWh energy per 100km at the wheels, 1/10 - 1/20 of your big fossil car. Also you can power it by various ICE - infernal systems or by full batt. electricity. This could have been in mass production since the late 70s or earlier..

Now, where is the greater margin for the big manuf. to sell 2t SUV crap (and take gov. tax subsidies) or 500kg aerodynamic car with no aftermarket sales for spare parts, ie full electric contraption?
The answer to the question is obvious..

The message should be clear and loud, f. off the auto industry, just get some light and teasy managable older platform like from Fiat 600-126 or Ford Ka and convert it to electric on your own or hire a shop to do it for you.

For you US folk get the mexican made VW Golf - pickup from the early '90 to haul some cargo. Get 3-5kWp solar panels on your roof as well.. And you are independent for the lifetime of your batt. max. 12-15 yrs. depending on technology, and electricity independent for the rest of your days..
Last edited by Mesuge on Fri 02 Nov 2007, 07:57:52, edited 2 times in total.
DOOMerotron: at all-time high [8.3] out of 10..
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby Slowpoke » Fri 02 Nov 2007, 07:40:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('whereagles', 'I')nteresting. But it still a heavy vehicle. We should be doing stuff in the vicinity of 500 kg, not 1000 kg.

Doesn't really matter. It isn't supposed to be a private car; it's a Light Utility Vehicle (panel van). The relevant variables in its case are carry capacity and costs (purchase and operational).
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby whereagles » Fri 02 Nov 2007, 07:59:26

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Mesuge', 'G')et 3-5kWp solar panels on your roof as well..


These days people put cars in garages. It's gonna be funny to see people battling to put their cars in the sun to recharge :)
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby Mesuge » Fri 02 Nov 2007, 08:04:49

? This is obviously meant to be as stationary rooftop on your house or garden shack! :twisted: There is no way you put 4kWp panels on any ordinary passanger car..
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby mos6507 » Sat 03 Nov 2007, 04:21:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('whereagles', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('IslandCrow', 'I') know that many Europeans have gone to using diesel, but are there any plans by the European car makers to go electric or hybrid?


All of them are developing hybrid models. Even gas-guzzling manufacturer Porsche. Most hybrids are diesel too. City mileages of 3-4 litres/100 km expected (~60-70 mpg) and CO2 in the 80-100 g/km region.

Some companies are into plug-in hybrids and claim combined city/road mileages of 2,5 litres/100 km (~80 mpg) on E85 blends.

Companies aren't into full electric vehicle mode, though. Only a few prototype companies are doing it. That I know, no major is on to it.


Th!nk just dumped $200 mil onto Enderdel. That's the biggest EV news from europe.
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby joe1347 » Sun 04 Nov 2007, 21:35:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TommyJefferson', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('KevO', 'B')ut is shows the car companies true colours. They have no belief and no intention of EVER going Green so in short sell all your shares i Ford, GM and Daimler/Chrysler coz all them guys are going down the pan!! and good riddance to


Why the heck would they "go green"? Out of the goodness of their hearts? So their mistress will like them more? To store up treasure in heaven?

They build cars in an attempt to realize profits. That's their job.

If their customers demand "green" cars and they can make a profit meeting that demand, they will do it
.


They will???? I guess I'll go run over today to my local GM dealer and buy a 50mpg car. Oh wait, GM doesn't make a 50mpg car So I guess I'll run over to the Toyota dealer instead - like everybody else in America unfortunately.

http://priuschat.com/October-2007-sales-t40421.html

Americans want cars with high fuel efficiency today and Detroit is not delivering.
"Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true." Homer Simpson
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Re: Chrysler economist on 'quasi-hysterical Europeans'

Postby ohanian » Sun 04 Nov 2007, 21:42:36

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('joe1347', '
')Americans want cars with high fuel efficiency today and Detroit is not delivering.


Here is where ya are WRONG!!!

The stuff that people really really really want by definition must have a high price tag.

The stuff that people have less desire for, have a low price tag.

So we Americans really really want SUV and we DO NOT want fuel efficient cars because fuel efficient cars are cheap.

So do not go around telling lies about Americans want cars with high fuel efficiency. The only fuel efficiency car that Americans want is the Toyota Prius because it has a high price tag.
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Chrysler to guarantee gas at $2.99 a gallon! For three years

Postby Ferretlover » Mon 05 May 2008, 21:57:31

5 May 2008--Who needs an 18-cent a gallon gas tax holiday from pandering politicians when you have Chrysler on your side! With gas prices rapidly approaching and exceeding $4 a gallon across the nation, Chrysler is offering up a deal that just might make people averse to the looks of cars like the Chrysler Sebring and Jeep Compass think twice. Between now and June 2, anyone who buys any new Chrysler, Dodge or Jeep vehicle will be able to register for a "Let's Refuel America" card. Once the customer registers a credit card with the program, they will receive a new card that they can use the card at participating gas stations to fuel up their new car or truck. When the card is used, the credit card the owner has on file will be billed $2.99 a gallon for either regular gas, E85 or diesel fuel. Chrysler will pay the difference. The best part is the price is locked in for THREE years. Now that's real savings. There are of course limitations on the deal. Get more details on the deal and Chrysler's full press release after the jump. …
Just in time for those stimulus checks

U.S. automakers see cheap gas as history
30 Aug 2006U.S. automakers, which depend heavily on sales of pickup trucks and sport utility vehicles, have said the gas prices will remain high, and maybe at 3 to 4 dollars a gallon for the rest of this decade, The New York Times reported on Tuesday.
When asked whether gasoline prices had peaked on Monday, Thomas W. LaSorda, Chrysler's chief executive answered: "I would hope so . .. but we're planning internally as if it is 3 to 4 dollars a gallon."
He said Chrysler had prepared a business model based on the assumption that gas prices would remain in that range for the next three to four years. That is about the period of time it takes for an automaker to develop a new vehicle.
"We are looking at it as if it's going to be much higher, rather than hoping it comes down," LaSorda said. He added " hopefully we can fight back." …
Guess they've known for a while
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Re: Chrysler to guarantee gas at $2.99 a gallon! For three y

Postby Denny » Tue 06 May 2008, 03:31:59

Certainly a desperate move by Chrysler, but for the sake of the new owners, let's hope that Chrysler has locked in this pricing with oil futures. Otherwise, all the new vehicle owners will have to show for their calculations and decisions will be a piece of paper, lowly ranked among many others, in the Chrysler Chapter 11 saga.
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Re: Chrysler to guarantee gas at $2.99 a gallon! For three y

Postby Ivan_M » Tue 06 May 2008, 03:47:00

oh boy. 3 more years of consume consume consume.

THAT will sure help.
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Re: Chrysler to guarantee gas at $2.99 a gallon! For three y

Postby pup55 » Tue 06 May 2008, 08:21:00

The lesson of this is that gas is still not very expensive in the grand scheme of things.

10,000 miles per year, 20 miles per gallon, that's a fuel consumption of 500 gallons. These jerks can basically give away a year's fuel rather than offer a $1500 rebate, which is pretty common in the new car business when the going gets tough.

They think they have run the calculation, and know what the fuel price is likely to be in three years. They probably hired some consulting firm like CERA to tell them what the oil price will do, and they said "it's going to steadily decline, like the EIA says".

At $10 per gallon, though, it becomes a disaster for them, if it is not already.
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Re: Chrysler to guarantee gas at $2.99 a gallon! For three y

Postby dinopello » Tue 06 May 2008, 09:21:22

This takes advantage of irrational consumer behavior. The way people feel about fuel prices and their cars they rather have $1500 in gas than $1500 in cash. The blog also states:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')his is one hell of a deal, if it doesn't drive Chrysler into bankruptcy, which is a distinct possibility. Because there is no way of knowing what fuel costs will be over the next three years, Chrysler can't estimate the cost. However, Steven Landry, Executive Vice President - North American Sales said the company is doing some hedging to protect themselves.


So, the hedge is probably Chrysler making investments in stuff that would rise as the cost of gas rises, making this promotion a wash financially but it probably will help them move cars. I wonder if others will follow suit.
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Re: Chrysler to guarantee gas at $2.99 a gallon! For three y

Postby seahorse » Tue 06 May 2008, 09:47:51

I have to say this is pretty tempting to a POiler like myself. $2.99 for 3 years? My only concern is Chrysler may not be here in 3 years and that their gas card and guarantee will eventually be worth as mush as a Sharper Image credit card.
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