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Math experts I need help

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Math experts I need help

Unread postby jasonraymondson » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 18:19:08

Find the closest curve point of x^2 + y^2 =1 to the point (2,0)

Is this right?

y = (1 - x^2)^1/2
(2 - x)^2 + ((1 - x^2)^1/2)^2 = d^2
5 - 4x = d^2


Any other suggestions for this?
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby PrairieMule » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 18:57:22

"Instead of having "answers" on a math test, they should just call them "impressions," and if you got a different "impression," so what, can't we all be brothers?”-Jack Handey
If you give a man a fish you will have kept him from hunger for a day. If you teach a man to fish he will sit in a boat and drink beer all day.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby pup55 » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 19:39:37

I believe y is undefined for X>1

The curve passes through 1,0. The point of interest is 2,0

Therefore d=1
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby Carlhole » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 20:16:06

Forgive me, but it's been so long...

Isn't that an equation for a unit circle whose origin lies on (0,0)?

If so, then a point on the circumference lies on (1,0) which is of distance 1 away from (2,0).

No?
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby jasonraymondson » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 21:24:42

I am just trying to figure it out, first time I have picked a math text in 12 years
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby Bas » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 21:33:56

curve? I think for x^2+y^2=1 you end up with a circle around (0,0) with a radius of 1. (1,0) would be the closest point on this circle to (2,0)
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby Carlhole » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 21:37:45

I'm pretty sure that equation describes a circle of radius 1 whose center is on the orgin.

You can think of it as a pythagorean right triangle of hypotenuse 1 which swings around 360 degrees to describe a circle.

X and Y vary because they represent the legs of the right triangle as the circle travels around the circumference. It's the approach they usually take teaching Trigonometry.

So the shortest distance to the circle from (2,0) is to (1,0) where the circle crosses the X-axis.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 21:42:57

I just want to erase this. What happened on Monday was particularly painful. I care about my brother
Last edited by PenultimateManStanding on Sat 27 Oct 2007, 21:58:24, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby Carlhole » Sat 27 Oct 2007, 21:54:03

You can't solve for X or Y (to plot the graph) without encountering imaginary numbers (square root of -1).

I think if you try to solve y = ((1 - x^2))^1/2 , you'll plot a hyperbola instead of a circle.

I just googled "equation of a circle" and got this:
http://www.analyzemath.com/CircleEq/CircleEq.html

...so, yes, you have a circle where h and k are both zero and r = 1.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby jboogy » Sun 28 Oct 2007, 13:36:25

I'm not sure of the answer but I did fart while reading the OP if that helps .

PMS what happened to your brother ?
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Sun 28 Oct 2007, 14:09:12

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jboogy', '
')PMS what happened to your brother ?
He was required to evacuate his home. I had been getting a nice foolish buzz when he called to ask to come to my place as the hotels were completely booked up. Of course I said sure, come on over. But when he and his wife and cat got here he promptly left. His wife was kind and sympathetic and I don't know how the cat felt. Though my brother's distress was completely understandable considering that there was a really close chance that his house would burn down, we have a difficult history. He's 3 years older than me and was abusive. So when I was a teen, I put my fist in his face to get even. The real problem was jealousy. I was favored. This event has reopened old problems. Last year, I and my family had a wonderful time at his house. I fear that may be the end of it. I've got my mom and daughter both trying to patch things up but he's very obstinate. His medicine is anti-anxiety pills, mine is well known here.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby jboogy » Sun 28 Oct 2007, 14:59:51

Wow , sounds messy , the anti-anxiety meds mean he may have trouble resolving his issues with you the way people without psychological problems may. Seems he should have been able to bury the hatchet by now ,... assuming you have tried to reconcile, and from what I know of you I'm sure you've given it your all . The alcohol might be a good tool for you to maybe open a dialogue , I can tell your not an angry or mean drinker so it wouldn't be an impediment , probably the opposite . I'm guessing he's been reticent about opening old wounds in order to get at the infection ?I think if it were you who went to him with a need for help it would be easier for you to instigate a rapprochement , as you said , him coming to you in need just reminds him of the resentment he feels .My sister was visiting all last week to help me redo my kitchen , bought me cabinets and tile to build a big island , I wanted to build a little arched alcove in a narrow wall we left standing and she gave me a hard time about it , saying I wouldn't finish and all that shit , I took it in stride and laughed it off telling her I was going to do it regardless of how she felt about it , then the wife came in and agreed with her after previousely saying she liked my idea and wanted it done , I flipped , said a couple F-words and kicked a hole in one of the cabinets before storming out and driving around for four hours . It took me another whole day before I would talk to or look at my sister but by the time she left we were back to normal and the incident was forgotten . Bottom line you guys are adults now and he needs to get past this , I've learned family is EVERYTHING over the years and he should have realized this by now.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby PenultimateManStanding » Sun 28 Oct 2007, 15:49:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jboogy', 'W')ow , sounds messy , the anti-anxiety meds mean he may have trouble resolving his issues with you the way people without psychological problems may. Seems he should have been able to bury the hatchet by now
I wish my oldest brother didn't live in Texas. He was kind to me when I was a kid. He's got his problems, too. He was hit by polio. But right now, I'm missing him. That other brother may be gone to me. I've got my issues with him too and was thinking this morning that he can stay gone. It's not a pretty picture and I feel like driving for four hours too.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby jasonraymondson » Sun 28 Oct 2007, 16:35:55

PMS, your the math teacher, can we get some help with this problem?
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby Carlhole » Sun 28 Oct 2007, 17:33:25

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('jasonraymondson', 'P')MS, your the math teacher, can we get some help with this problem?


You still need help? Dude! Put the math book down and slowly back away!

Image

You've heard of the Pythagorean Theorem, right?

a^2 + b^2 = c^2

...look at the right triangle in the above diagram. (Instead of sin t, substitute Y. Instead of cos t, substitute X).

The hypotenuse of the triangle is always equal to 1.

So according to the Pythagorean Theorem, x^2 + y^2 = 1 (your original equation).

Now imagine the point where the triangle interesects the circle travels around a full revolution. The x and y legs of the right triangle vary but, of course, the hypotenuse always remains constant at 1.

So the equation, x^2 + y^2 = 1, defines a unit circle (circle with hypotenuse of length 1) whose center lies on the origin.

The link in my previous post shows the general equation for circles whose centers are located at point (h,k) and whose radius is r. And there is a graph there where you can plug in different values. In your case, h and k are both zero and r = 1.

The circle defined by your equation passes through point (1,0) on the X-axis. That is the closest point to (2,0).

Problem solved.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby Carlhole » Sun 28 Oct 2007, 19:40:57

[align=center]Image[/align]

I suppose I should post the Pythagorean Theorem here too in case you forgot it.

But I was mistaken about solving for Y. You don't get a hyperbola; it's still a unit circle equation, but for the first quadrant only. (Sorry, it's been years and years).

...which intersects the X axis at (1,0) which is the closest it ever gets to (2,0).

There is a graph of it here:
Unit Circle Equation
Last edited by Carlhole on Sun 28 Oct 2007, 20:52:43, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Math experts I need help

Unread postby Madpaddy » Sun 28 Oct 2007, 20:13:55

My maths teacher had a quote he used regale us with when he was stressed out if that is any help.

"shite and onions" he would say.

I don't know what it means but it sounds awful.
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