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Specific suggestion: General strike

A forum for discussion of regional topics including oil depletion but also government, society, and the future.

Are you ready yet to make a difference?

Yes, let's do this!
9
No votes
Nah, won't make any difference. Besides, it might make me uncomfortable, and we wouldn't want [i]that[/i] now, would we?
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Total votes : 16

Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby TWilliam » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 18:23:09

Harper's Magazine

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')
Any strike, whether it happens in a factory, a nation, or a marriage, amounts to a reaffirmation of consent. The strikers remind their overlords—and, equally important, themselves—that the seemingly perpetual machinery of daily life has an off switch as well as an on. Camus said that the one serious question of philosophy is whether or not to commit suicide; the one serious question of political philosophy is whether or not to get out of bed. Silly as it may have seemed at the time, John and Yoko’s famous stunt was based on a profound observation. Instant karma is not so instant—we ratify it day by day.

The stream of commuters heading into the city, the caravan of tractor-trailers pulling out of the rest stop into the dawn’s early light, speak a deep-throated Yes to the sum total of what’s going on in our collective life. The poet Richard Wilbur writes of the “ripped mouse” that “cries Concordance” in the talons of the owl; we too cry our daily assent in the grip of the prevailing order— except in those notable instances when, like a donkey or a Buddha, we refuse to budge.

The question we need to ask ourselves at this moment is what further provocations we require to justify digging in our heels. To put the question more pointedly: Are we willing to wait until the next presidential election, or for some interim congressional conversion experience, knowing that if we do wait, hundreds of our sons and daughters will be needlessly destroyed? Another poet, Cesar Vallejo, framed the question like this:

A man shivers with cold, coughs, spits up blood.
Will it ever be fitting to allude to my inner soul? . . .
A cripple sleeps with one foot on his shoulder.
Shall I later on talk about Picasso, of all people?

A young man goes to Walter Reed without a face. Shall I make an appointment with my barber? A female prisoner is sodomized at Abu Ghraib. Shall I send a check to the Clinton campaign?

3.

You will recall that a major theme of the Bush Administration’s response to September 11 was that life should go on as usual. We should keep saying that broad consensual Yes as loudly as we dared. We could best express our patriotism by hitting the malls, by booking a flight to Disney World. At the time, the advice seemed prudent enough: avoid hysteria; defy the intimidations of murderers and fanatics.

In hindsight it’s hard not to see the roots of our predicament in the readiness with which we took that advice to heart. We did exactly as we were told, with a net result that is less an implicit defiance of terrorism than a tacit amen to the “war on terror,” including the war in Iraq. Granted, many of us have come to find both those wars unacceptable. But do we find them intolerable? Can you sleep? Yes, doctor, I can sleep. Can you work? Yes, doctor, I can work. Do you get out to the movies, enjoy a good restaurant? Actually, I have a reservation for tonight. Then I’d say you were doing okay, wouldn’t you? I’d say you were tolerating the treatment fairly well.

It is one thing to endure abuses and to carry on in spite of them. It is quite another thing to carry on to the point of abetting the abuse. We need to move the discussion of our nation’s health to the emergency room. We need to tell the doctors of the body politic that the treatment isn’t working—and that until it changes radically for the better, neither are we.


More at the link above...
"It means buckle your seatbelt, Dorothy, because Kansas? Is goin' bye-bye... "
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby roccman » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 18:36:47

It IS time to drive your picket pin in the ground.

It IS time to jump off the train.

It IS time to gather ourselves and build a boat.

We WILL NOT come this way again.

Rise up...the time is NOW!!!
"There must be a bogeyman; there always is, and it cannot be something as esoteric as "resource depletion." You can't go to war with that." Emersonbiggins
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby RdSnt » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 18:49:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TWilliam', '[')url=http://harpers.org/archive/2007/10/0081720]Harper's Magazine[/url]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')and that until it changes radically for the better, neither are we.


More at the link above...



What I want to ask is ,What does "better" mean? In the context of North American society what is going to convince the general population that there is something better.
Currently, the vast majority of US citizens are of the firm, even fanatical, belief that there is no better place, no better life, than in the US.
What is it that you can tell these people, who live very easy lives, who have most any comfort they wish, who are over fed, well entertained; that will convince them to give it up.
Even in the worst ghettos, among the most impoverished of Americans, they live a better life than the average Chinese, the average Indian, the average Iraqi. What's more, even they are convinced that the American dream exists. That just with a little luck they too can achieve the dream of American exceptionlism.
Gravity is not a force, it is a boundary layer.
Everything is coincident.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby TWilliam » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 19:11:10

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('RdSnt', 'W')hat I want to ask is ,What does "better" mean? In the context of North American society what is going to convince the general population that there is something better.
Currently, the vast majority of US citizens are of the firm, even fanatical, belief that there is no better place, no better life, than in the US.
What is it that you can tell these people, who live very easy lives, who have most any comfort they wish, who are over fed, well entertained; that will convince them to give it up.
Even in the worst ghettos, among the most impoverished of Americans, they live a better life than the average Chinese, the average Indian, the average Iraqi. What's more, even they are convinced that the American dream exists. That just with a little luck they too can achieve the dream of American exceptionlism.


(Unfortunately) valid points, one and all RdSnt. And also unfortunately, I have no answer for them, as you are of course correct. Until a large percentage - if not, indeed, the majority - become conscious not only of the ever-tightening bonds their "comfort" represents, but are able to at least dimly perceive where that bondage is ultimately leading them, I fear few will actually take action to impel change. In fact even with the elephant standing in the living room, as long as it hasn't destroyed their TV and isn't blocking the view or their ready access to the beer in the fridge, few people even pay much attention to the steaming piles it leaves all over the floor.

Be that as it may, I believe it's still necessary to continue beating the drums and sounding the bells...
"It means buckle your seatbelt, Dorothy, because Kansas? Is goin' bye-bye... "
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby Fishman » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 19:36:44

A "General Strike" for what? Make a difference about what? Peak oil? Bush? Your general problem that noone cares about your whining?
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby KillTheHumans » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 20:35:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Fishman', 'A') "General Strike" for what? Make a difference about what? Peak oil? Bush? Your general problem that noone cares about your whining?


Thats mean. :lol:

Around here, if you accidently flick past Fox News you get pasted.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby MattSavinar » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 21:25:40

Actually a general strike would be against the provisions of the patriot act and the defense authorization act that are geared for these sort of disturbances.

If you participate in one, you can look forward to a nice stay in Hotel Halliburton where somebody trained in the Jack Bauer school of reeducation gets to have his way with you. Have your strike so long as you like getting tazed and drugged before being sent out to your forced work brigade.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby RdSnt » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 21:30:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TWilliam', '
')
Be that as it may, I believe it's still necessary to continue beating the drums and sounding the bells...


I absolutely, 100% agree.
Gravity is not a force, it is a boundary layer.
Everything is coincident.
Love: the state of suspended anticipation.
To get any appreciable distance from the Earth in
a sensible amount of time, you must lie.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby KillTheHumans » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 22:03:53

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', 'A')ctually a general strike would be against the provisions of the patriot act and the defense authorization act that are geared for these sort of disturbances.

If you participate in one, you can look forward to a nice stay in Hotel Halliburton where somebody trained in the Jack Bauer school of reeducation gets to have his way with you. Have your strike so long as you like getting tazed and drugged before being sent out to your forced work brigade.


Beyond general nuclear war over high gasoline prices, is this your next best delusion? I seem to recall quite a few protests over the war in the past year, which aren't much different than a general strike, so why bring all this imaginary, la-la land BS to the table?
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby Fishman » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 22:11:07

So let me get this strait, a strike against an act of legislature? And if you strike you think you'll get arrested because of that legislature? It seems to me in a democracy, however poorly run it may be, your ideas about how poor this legislature is didn't pan out in the last election. Perhaps instead of striking you might consider taking some political science courses, or perhaps learn to debate a subject without calling people names (see Petrais ad). Perhaps, just perhaps, in a free market of ideas, either you can't sell your idea, or it's a dude.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby JPL » Thu 27 Sep 2007, 22:43:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('roccman', 'I')t IS time to drive your picket pin in the ground.

It IS time to jump off the train.

It IS time to gather ourselves and build a boat.

We WILL NOT come this way again.

Rise up...the time is NOW!!!


Silly roccman, there is light-tyned, pointed tool - available to all - called a 'pitchfork', it has two traditional uses:

1. For arranging dried grass into bundles.
2. For holding close into the face of your opressors and saying 'What next??

Always worked in the past (grin).

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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby SILENTTODD » Fri 28 Sep 2007, 02:14:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', 'A')ctually a general strike would be against the provisions of the patriot act and the defense authorization act that are geared for these sort of disturbances.

If you participate in one, you can look forward to a nice stay in Hotel Halliburton where somebody trained in the Jack Bauer school of reeducation gets to have his way with you. Have your strike so long as you like getting tazed and drugged before being sent out to your forced work brigade.


You’re forgetting the 2nd amendment Matt. There are still many citizens out there who are very well armed. Subduing the populace and their weapons in this country would make Iraq look like a walk in the park.

And the Iraqis have shown us how to do it. Beware Hillary.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby Concerned » Fri 28 Sep 2007, 06:25:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SILENTTODD', '
')And the Iraqis have shown us how to do it. Beware Hillary.


Americans rising up?

And why Hillary? Whats wrong with rising against Bush?

I think Simmons $200 barrel oil might cause a stir but phone taps, illegal wars, torture, et el.. who cares if it's not affecting me right?

Best thing about Capitalism and controlling people is the selfish me oriented society.

When the turning point comes it will be terrible.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby KillTheHumans » Fri 28 Sep 2007, 20:39:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('SILENTTODD', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', 'A')ctually a general strike would be against the provisions of the patriot act and the defense authorization act that are geared for these sort of disturbances.



You’re forgetting the 2nd amendment Matt.


You are assuming that any lawyer in this country who can't find a job actually LEARNED it in the first place.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby Ferretlover » Fri 28 Sep 2007, 20:58:55

D.C. Asks Supreme Court to Back Gun Ban
By Robert Barnes and David Nakamura
Washington Post Staff Writers Tuesday, September 4, 2007;
The District today asked the Supreme Court to uphold the city's ban on private ownership of handguns, saying the appeals court decision that overturned the law "drastically departs from the mainstream of American jurisprudence."
Most legal experts believe the court will accept the case, which could lead to a historic decision next year on whether the ambiguously worded Second Amendment to the Constitution protects private gun ownership or only imparts a civic right related to maintaining state militias. …
No guns for you, Bucko?
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby KillTheHumans » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 04:03:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ferretlover', 'D').C. Asks Supreme Court to Back Gun Ban
By Robert Barnes and David Nakamura
Washington Post Staff Writers Tuesday, September 4, 2007;
The District today asked the Supreme Court to uphold the city's ban on private ownership of handguns, saying the appeals court decision that overturned the law "drastically departs from the mainstream of American jurisprudence."
Most legal experts believe the court will accept the case, which could lead to a historic decision next year on whether the ambiguously worded Second Amendment to the Constitution protects private gun ownership or only imparts a civic right related to maintaining state militias. …
No guns for you, Bucko?


Guns had already been banned in DC for what...a few decades? They are just now trying to GET them, and TPTB are pretty cheesed about it. The NRA has been kicking their butts all over the country with CC laws.
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby TWilliam » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 13:08:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Fishman', 'A') "General Strike" for what? Make a difference about what? Peak oil? Bush? Your general problem that noone cares about your whining?


You apparently didn't read the entire article. A general strike against "business as usual" in all it's forms, against the general problem that no one cares that we're rapidly driving toward the extinction of our species, and finally against the brain-dead attitude illustrated in your post that's a primary driver of that process.
"It means buckle your seatbelt, Dorothy, because Kansas? Is goin' bye-bye... "
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby KillTheHumans » Sat 29 Sep 2007, 16:34:06

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TWilliam', ' ')A general strike against "business as usual" in all it's forms,


Do you think its even possible to agree on what ITS forms are? For example, lets say someone wants to strike because of poor nutrition in fast food restaurants, and you want to strike against the evils of the modern banking.

Do you both strike, just for different things? Or does the health nut object to be lumped in with some obese slug who wants to end his free ATM usage and checking account?

To me, both of these are "business as usual", but to others? Maybe not.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TWilliam', ' ')

the general problem that no one cares that we're rapidly driving toward the extinction of our species,


You might need some evidence that the modern world is, in fact, doing this, to convince your friends and neighbors of the need to act.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TWilliam', ' ')
and finally against the brain-dead attitude illustrated in your post that's a primary driver of that process.


So...someone disagrees with your version of "business as usual" and suddenly, they are brain dead? And you wonder why its so hard to convince people, when ALL of them happen to be braindead, if only because they don't see business as usual the same way as you do?
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Re: Specific suggestion: General strike

Unread postby Fishman » Mon 01 Oct 2007, 11:18:48

TWilliam, you gave three reasons in your own post for a strike. None are concrete, none are easy to correct ('cept maybe my braindead attitude". ) And you broke a cardinal rule in politics that the left seems to keep forgetting, name calling. It invigorates your opponents, drives out the moderates, and generally keeps you from getting elected. (even 2006 election got mostly moderate Democrats elected.). Since you can't get your folks elected you scream louder, scream about conspiracies, and get more frustrated.
Good luck on your strike.
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