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THE Precious Metals Thread (merged)

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Wed 19 Sep 2007, 22:25:16

STOP COMPARING PEAK OIL TO HURRICANE KATRINA.
Sorry, I had to.
I get rather tired of people comparing a general decline in the availability of inexpensive liquid transport fuel...to a hurricane.
By the way, do you live in a massive crime ridden corrupt city like New Orleans? If not, your local police are going to stick around, enforcing the law.

Why? Because every single civilization in the history of the world has had local law enforcement. They might be nothing more than hired guns as employed by the mayor, but they will still exist.
Again, why should town governments collapse?
No one has ever provided an adequate explanation for that one...
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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby max_power29 » Thu 20 Sep 2007, 07:21:07

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ferrelgiraffe', 'T')hey will come to your door and take your guns and your gold and anything else they like, maybe your house if it is too nice. They will take your wife and your daughter, whatever they want. And you must smile when they do so.
count on it.

F**k that! Take at least two of them with you and let the survivors take it from your cold dead hands.
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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby Kylon » Thu 20 Sep 2007, 13:35:51

Things which it's not cost effective to confiscate, but are highly valuable-
Seeds and plants
Books, CDs, stored valuable information.
Ground water cooling/heating system/power source.
Basic tools.
And in order to avoid them stealing stuff from you, if you have valuables such as gold, why not simply stash your money/gold in a foreign account?
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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby Tyler_JC » Thu 20 Sep 2007, 14:30:48

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('max_power29', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ferrelgiraffe', '
')They will come to your door and take your guns and your gold and anything else they like, maybe your house if it is too nice. They will take your wife and your daughter, whatever they want. And you must smile when they do so.
count on it.

F**k that! Take at least two of them with you and let the survivors take it from your cold dead hands.

First off, why should civil society break down?
We had a functioning judicial system in the oil free 1700s, why couldn't we have one in the oil free 2100s?
Population density makes the need for strong judicial rule even more crucial.
Those of you entertaining thoughts of becoming roving marauders are sadly mistaken. You are highly likely to end up in a state prison/factory.
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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby Heineken » Thu 20 Sep 2007, 16:31:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kylon', 't')o avoid them stealing stuff from you, if you have valuables such as gold, why not simply stash your money/gold in a foreign account?

Because when TSHTF you may not be able to gain access to your gold or other valuables. Those foreign accounts could simply evaporate, or could be frozen for any of many possible reasons.
If you own gold you should have direct control over it, and no one should know that you have it except people you'd trust with your life. Francisco Gomez at the Second Tex-Mex Bank does not qualify.
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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby simontay78 » Fri 21 Sep 2007, 01:57:22

Maybe in the old days gold will be valuable to me as the new generation people....but now if the SHTF and civil chaos starts...with little or no control of the high inflationary nature of pricing....we might have a serious problem.
Let's be very simple minded.
How the new generation people including me estimate the value of a gold coin and how much can in exchange in real life...like for food, water, accommodation...and for how long for a single gold coin...gold bar or etc.

If the dollar collapsed and everything hyper inflated in cost then we can be priced $200 per Macdonald Happy Meal $300 for a Taxi ride to safety $1 million for escape to other shitty country and just maybe 20 million for a tank of gas or water...or one shiny gold coin...that might be fake...hmmm
Let's make some heavy metal plated with alloyed with gold?
The problem is when someone throw me gold to make a generator for them ....compare to a farmer to throw me a safe supply of potatoes...for the generator...I will still choose the farmer.
Gold cannot be that valuable anymore once the "material wealth" can no longer buy luxury......

I see what is more valuable is SKILL, KNOWLEDGE and COMMUNITY SPIRIT.
Isolation will not make a good survival technique. 8O
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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby Heineken » Fri 21 Sep 2007, 10:26:09

Gold has proved its mettle for thousands of years. Case closed.

Skills matter too, but that's a separate issue. This isn't an either/or proposition.
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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby Twilight » Fri 21 Sep 2007, 13:48:26

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', 'G')old has proved its mettle for thousands of years. Case closed.
Yeah, being dug up out of the ruins. Oh look, someone hid some gold in a clay jar two thousand years ago. I wonder what happened to them.
I'll grant this, it still means a lot in the East, to the cultures of the Indian subcontinent where jewellery can act as a reserve of family wealth. You can see it in Europe too, the Asian urban areas and the concentration of such shops you often find. But there is a cultural framework out there, one that has been kept alive. If you had one, you lost it. Your common American or European wouldn't have the first clue what to do with gold, any more than they would know about setting themselves up in the furniture-making business. Sorry, but avarice is not a structure.

Possession itself means nothing. It's a straightforward enough matter to deprive an individual of it, especially if they are clueless (take note, not necessarily careless), and especially considering there is nothing else out there which will do a faster job of bringing out the nasty in people.
Gold appears to have held its value through the ages because at the end of the day we are apes drawn to shiny things, who would kill for a shiny thing rare enough. We cannot avoid that heritage, we must deal with it. But maybe it has not held its value continuously? Maybe it is unique in repeatedly regaining its value? With easily imaginable interludes where it may not only have had no value to a man, but presented him with an unnecessary burden and additional dangers?

Speaking generally (not attacking you, Heineken), people here need to drop the gold bug mindset for a moment and ask themselves whether they would be better off spending today's money on items of everyday utility than taking a gamble on something which may not develop the market they envisage within their lifetime. You don't want to be a wise Roman burying gold and silver coins under your house for someone to dig up centuries later.
It is a tempting reflex though, which should raise a flag of caution.
I do not regard precious metals highly as an investment, it fails the test of practicality for me.
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Gold could surpass US$1000 in "new cycle," Citigro

Unread postby Ferretlover » Fri 21 Sep 2007, 15:16:41

With gold having broken the US$730 per ounce market to reach a 28-year high, Citigroup analyst John Hill says the metal appears to be entering a new investment-driven phase and has re-asserted itself as a safe haven. He thinks gold will be one of the top beneficiary of the “Re-flationary Rescue,” which should bode well for hard assets and basic materials.
As for gold stocks, they “anticipated the move, and have fully, finally participated,” he told clients in a note.
The resurgence of gold conveniently coincides with the seasonal strength that typically comes with Western holidays, Indian festivals and the Chinese New Year. However, this could set up a correction early in 2008, Mr. Hill said.
However, Citigroup continues to be bullish on bullion, expected the multi-year bull market to continue and prices to average US$750 in 2008 and 2009.
Mr. Hill says he would not be surprised if gold were to break its all-time high of US$850, or even US$1000 or higher in a “new cycle of global credit creation and competitive currency devaluations." ...

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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby topcat » Fri 21 Sep 2007, 17:42:18

IMO, you can only buy so many 'everyday utility' items. Two shovels, two picks, two sledges, two axes, and then there is paper money left over.
After BB's 50bp cut in the suggested rate, the FRN's are becoming toilet paper.
PM's aren't the only answer, but they play their part in a well-rounded approach to long-term preservation.
Kinda like insurance, you buy and pay for it, hoping you will never have to use it.
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Re: Gold Confiscation: Will it happen again?

Unread postby Heineken » Fri 21 Sep 2007, 23:22:40

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Twilight', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Heineken', 'G')old has proved its mettle for thousands of years. Case closed.

Yeah, being dug up out of the ruins. Oh look, someone hid some gold in a clay jar two thousand years ago. I wonder what happened to them.
I'll grant this, it still means a lot in the East, to the cultures of the Indian subcontinent where jewellery can act as a reserve of family wealth. You can see it in Europe too, the Asian urban areas and the concentration of such shops you often find. But there is a cultural framework out there, one that has been kept alive. If you had one, you lost it. Your common American or European wouldn't have the first clue what to do with gold, any more than they would know about setting themselves up in the furniture-making business. Sorry, but avarice is not a structure. ...
I do not regard precious metals highly as an investment, it fails the test of practicality for me.

Well, sooner or later everything ends up in the ground, including one's own bones. I don't see the point of your argument about someone else digging up one's gold centuries later. After all, I'm not claiming that gold confers eternal life.
I do agree that there are better things to invest in than gold: primarily, the infrastructure for survival---land, water, housing, guns, etc.
But once those requirements have been met, what do you see as a better investment than gold for one's excess cash, given current directions? Stocks, bonds, cash? That's all paper and promises that will blow away with the wind. It won't even be around to be dug up someday.
It all comes down to one's means, Twilight. Topcat said it well.
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Denver Gold Forum

Unread postby mattduke » Fri 28 Sep 2007, 10:19:44

The Denver Gold Forum is going on. Follow the link to hear some of your favorite mining companies discuss their projects.

OnlineBroadcasting
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US Mint Halts Sales of Gold Buffalos

Unread postby mattduke » Fri 12 Oct 2007, 20:17:40

First it was the "W" Eagles. The date they announced for resuming sales has come and gone. Now it's the Buffalos turn. Whatever the real cause, the stated reason of "price adjustment" holds no water: USMint

This guy reports on a "mini surge" in sales before the halt: Numismaster
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Re: US Mint Halts Sales of Gold Buffalos

Unread postby mattduke » Fri 12 Oct 2007, 20:21:50

In other news central banks have reduced their gold sales. I mean, you can't just keep selling gold forever, right?

Reuters
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Gold and currencies... What statistics should I follow?

Unread postby LaLaLand » Thu 08 Nov 2007, 11:21:59

I do not want to hold my short term savings in dollars anymore. Washington has shown it cannot maintain a stable currency. I have a feeling the petrol states will soon trade in Euros; we all know what that means.
What currencies look promising over the course of the next 6 months - year?
When is a good time to buy gold (as in favorable 24 hour market conditions)? There was a price jump a month ago because of all the Wall St credit scares. I think the credit crisis will not subside for at least 10 more months. Does that make gold look more favorable in the near term?

Simply put. How should I hold my short term savings (6months – 1 year) when economic times look bad for working people such as myself?
I would never buy gold from someone I don't know. How can someone buy gold locally? Do banks sell standardized quantities of gold over the counter at the current NYSE market price?
What gold markets should I watch?
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Re: Gold and currencies... What statistics should I follow?

Unread postby sittinguy » Thu 08 Nov 2007, 16:29:25

I have been getting small gold coins on Ebay, most coin shops will deal with you and have alot of silver on hand, start with some silver for now.
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THE Precious Metals Thread (merged)

Unread postby Jellric » Tue 04 Dec 2007, 03:20:28

I have several 1/10 oz. Gold American Eagles 2006 I'd like to sell online. I also have some 1 oz. Silver American Eagles as well. Is there a reputable place online anyone knows of where I can sell without a minimum order?
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Re: Best place to sell bullion coins online?

Unread postby Heineken » Tue 04 Dec 2007, 10:30:54

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Re: Best place to sell bullion coins online?

Unread postby Jellric » Tue 04 Dec 2007, 15:17:54

Ok, thanks. I will check both of those places out today.
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