[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JPL', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', 'I')f gas rationing comes to your town, be prepared for the worst; it can and will get ugly.

[MrBill]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MrBill', 'M')onteQuest.
An SPR in a 'importing country' does not add to demand in the long-term.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MrBill', ' ') I seem to remember the SPR was about 55-57 days of useage. Bush wants to double that. This link from Wiki confirms 57-days.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MrBill', 'Y')ou're right. Petroleum product imports were brought in from Europe and Asia following Katerina/Rita. But some supplies were also released from the SPR. Not sold, but loaned out and then replaced by commercial users.

[hi-fiver]

How about the NPRA - National petroleum reserves Alaska - Oil doesn't have to be produced then stored to be considered as reserves. Although, we have been producing out of the NPRA via the Alpine field since 2001. In the 25 years that I have worked in the Alaska oil fields (Cook Inlet, Prudhoe Bay,Kuparuk) I have never seen producers produce other than flat out - Unless in the early days of Prudhoe where there were pipeline restrictions to the amount of crude that could be shipped. I have asked my supervisors at different times, especially recently, why worry about production losses (Usually mechanical problems) when we know the value of the oil will probably only increase? The simple buisness answer is that the oil produced today,and the profit that is invested today from that oil, at the expected rate of return from said investments, is worth more over time than the money you would have gained by defering that production at a later date and a suspected higher price per barrel. I have never heard of any producers cutting back on oil production because it may be worth more at a future date- The old bird in the hand theory. That doesn't mean in the future that we may see this type of behavior, but it would deffinately go against normal business practice.

[cube]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', '.')..
And where did you get the idea that there was no actual shortage?

Refineries and transport lines were down while a huge segment of gas and oil was shut -in. Some still is.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', '.').. And where did you get the idea that there was no actual shortage?
Refineries and transport lines were down while a huge segment of gas and oil was shut -in. Some still is.

[JPL]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', '
')I'm approaching 56, so this is all first hand that I write.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JPL', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', '
')I'm approaching 56, so this is all first hand that I write.

[mmasters]

Bah, at least some of you oldies got to live through the good ol days!

I'm just starting out, not even in my prime yet @ 27

Not quite sure what it'll all look like in 20 years, bet it will be ugly though!

[JPL]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mmasters', 'I')'m just starting out, not even in my prime yet @ 27
Not quite sure what it'll all look like in 20 years, bet it will be ugly though!

[DantesPeak]

SPR reserves are 60% heavy/sour, plus they are all located along the general area of Louisiana & Texas. While there are major oil transportation pipelines and ports in that area, that doesn’t guarantee that all the oil needed could be efficiently distributed across the country. In addition, we have the problem of too much heavy/sour crude for available refining capacity.

So in the event of a total OPEC cutoff, for example, gasoline production would fall substantially if only the SPR oil was used. The SPR appears to work best if it is only used sparingly. However the impression given by the Energy Department promotes the idea that the SPR will be more helpful in a crisis than it will truly be.

Having said that, I do agree having a reserve with heavy/sour crude in one general area is much better than having none in an emergency.

[MrBill]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DantesPeak', 'S')PR reserves are 60% heavy/sour, plus they are all located along the general area of Louisiana & Texas. While there are major oil transportation pipelines and ports in that area, that doesn’t guarantee that all the oil needed could be efficiently distributed across the country. In addition, we have the problem of too much heavy/sour crude for available refining capacity.
So in the event of a total OPEC cutoff, for example, gasoline production would fall substantially if only the SPR oil was used. The SPR appears to work best if it is only used sparingly. However the impression given by the Energy Department promotes the idea that the SPR will be more helpful in a crisis than it will truly be.
Having said that, I do agree having a reserve with heavy/sour crude in one general area is much better than having none in an emergency.

[kevincarter]

[topic merged}
I bet many people on this site could remember gas shortages they have seen, even if it was long ago.
In Spain in the 90's the truck drivers union got pissed at the government because of a rise in the gas price, wanting to draw attention they organized their members in such a way as to block all gas trucks leaving the port areas all over the country. Those trucks are the ones who supply gas stations. Man, did they draw attention!
4 days after there were infinite gas lines, policemen in gas stations trying to put order with little success. Radio, TV and newspapers calling for calm, people fighting on the lines, military troops escorting gas trucks, the president on national TV announcing gas rationing, empty supermarkets, worry faces, people nervous and pissed wanting it all back to normal here and now. And it was just a dumb strike.
I would like to know about those that have seen the gas lines in the 70's or any other interesting stuff.

[Leanan]

I'm not old enough to remember the '70s gas shortages myself, but one of my coworkers does, and has told me stories.
Distribution was very uneven in the '70s energy crisis. Some places had plenty of gas, others had shortages. My coworker was living in Florida at the time, and they had shortages.
He was working as a cable TV installer, so he used a lot of gas and needed it to do his job. Gas stations were not open 24 hours back then. So he would go and park his van in front of the pumps at about 10:30pm, when the gas station was closed. Then he'd go to sleep in the vehicle.
When he woke up the next morning, the line for gas would be blocks long. And he'd be at the front of it.

[AZpeaker]

I was very young in the early 70s but I do remember having to put anti-syphoning gadgets just inside the fuel filler hose of our cars because people were syphoning gas in the middle of the night.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('kevincarter', ' ')I would like to know about those that have seen the gas lines in the 70's or any other interesting stuff.

[MonteQuest]

Tom Whipple brought up a good point recently.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Whipple', 'T')he American system of driving currently is based on a smooth flow of about 9.5 million barrels a day of gasoline wending its way from the oil fields, through the refineries, to the gas tanks in our cars. Suppose for a minute the word goes out that shortages are nigh and that 210+ million cars and trucks immediately are driven to the gas stations so that their owners will not be caught short. A quick calculation suggests that collectively we Americans have about 50 million barrels worth of empty storage space in our 210 million gas tanks. Given that the useable gasoline stockpile in the US is not much more than 20 or 30 million barrels, if only half of us decided it was time to start keeping our tanks topped off, it is going to be tough to find a gas station open.

[firestarter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', 'M')any people I talk to are starting to top off a half or 3/4 now. It may be one of the key reasons why demand has shot up even with the rise of gas prices.

[kpeavey]

Every country that can develop their own SPR will do so given enough time. I expect a slow crash to produce more SPRs worldwide. A fast crash will not leave time for some countries to develop their plans.
Extending the thought to corporate SPRs:
Say the supply of oil and natural gas gets tight. It is the fiduciary duty of corporations to ensure the continued profitability of their companies. Where production is critically dependent on an energy source, electric utilities for example, having an emergency supply of that energy source would be prudent. A shortage of a resource would thus result in a spike in demand for that resource as companies attempt to hoard sufficient supplies to get them through a crisis.
With the number of electrical utilities generating power with oil and natural gas, it should only require the threat of a shortage to incite this type of hoarding response. If a utility should actually run out of fuel and shut down production, every utility out there would respond with increased demand for fuel, lest they run out and shut down production. As the supply got tighter, increasing the fuel reserve would be the next step. More demand, tighter market, higher prices. A feedback loop develops.

The larger the entity, the earlier the SPR is developed and the larger it will be. Start with national SPR in large countries, the notion will spread to smaller countries, then corporations, finally individuals will pick up a spare gas can to keep in the shed.
Hoarding begets hoarding.
Does this logic make sense or am I just wearing out my keyboard?