This article mentions Peak Oil, though seems to have a slightly more optimistic outlook than a lot of what i read on this board. It's quite well sourced. Thought it might provide a few interesting points for argument. link
If it's old hat feel free to delete this post, no point in clogging the schedule with repeats!
PeakOil is You
THE Rainforest Thread (merged)
THE Rainforest Thread (merged)
by Rickenbacker » Sun 09 Jan 2005, 18:20:40
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by Zapata » Mon 10 Jan 2005, 02:23:00
This is a 1998 report. Add to the figures the recent Chinese and Indian increases and I suspect that there is some revision to be done which takes off the rosy edge (in terms of resource reserves).
Really can't understand these dumb greenies. It is in their interest to promote the declining resource picture, even if its a myth (and really, with international audit standards being what they are in all areas of commerce, who do you trust). After, the whole flaming system runs on myth (I refer you to Enron and Worldcom). But oh no, these boneheads are above that! Fucking idiots.
Really can't understand these dumb greenies. It is in their interest to promote the declining resource picture, even if its a myth (and really, with international audit standards being what they are in all areas of commerce, who do you trust). After, the whole flaming system runs on myth (I refer you to Enron and Worldcom). But oh no, these boneheads are above that! Fucking idiots.
- Zapata
Re: Bye, bye rainforest.
by Tanada » Sun 06 May 2007, 17:37:14
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cyrus', '[')url=http://i-newswire.com/pr42191.html]Damn it[/url]
(I-Newswire) - ntists have noted warming at higher latitudes that already appears to be causing some flowers to bloom earlier than usual and seems to be altering some wildlife migration and hibernation patterns.
"You see this and you think the higher latitudes are really being hammered by climate change. We are arguing that this might not be true," said Joshua Tewksbury, a UW assistant professor of biology. "To predict the impact of climate change, we need to know the amount of change and how organisms are able to tolerate that change. Previous research has focused on change alone and ignored tolerance."
The more dramatic impact could actually be in the moist tropics, despite modeling that indicates temperatures there will warm just 2 or 3 degrees by 2100 compared with 6 degrees or more at higher latitudes, Tewksbury said. That is because organisms in the tropics normally do not experience much temperature variation because there is very little seasonality, so even small temperature shifts can have a much larger impact than similar shifts in regions with more seasonal climates.
"Temperatures in the tropics don't fluctuate that much, so the relatively small temperature shifts predicted by climate change models will be very large in relation to what organisms are adapted to tolerate," he said. "It's only going to be perhaps a 2-degree change, but in many tropical areas organisms have never experienced a 2-degree change."
By contrast, higher latitudes can have vast temperature fluctuations from hot summers to cold winters, and so plants and animals already are adapted to a wide range of temperatures. For example, it is not unusual for temperatures in Alaska's interior to reach far below zero in the winter and into the mid-70s during the summer. Flowers that bloom earlier and animals that change their hibernation or migration patterns in response to warming temperatures could be an illustration of the adaptability of life at higher latitudes.
Tewksbury's group collected studies that examined several closely related populations of plants, animals and insects to determine how the populations tolerated changing temperatures. Then they developed models based on the average between a region's highest temperature in the warmest month of the year and lowest temperature in the coldest month and programmed the region's expected temperature changes because of climate warming.
"What we find is that organisms in the tropics have very low tolerance," he said. "The evidence suggests that the range of temperatures an organism experiences dictates its tolerance to changing climate, or defines the temperature envelope in which it can live."
Tewksbury will present the findings Friday at the Ecological Society of America's annual meeting in Montreal. Collaborators include Raymond Huey, a UW biology professor, and UW biology doctoral students David Haak, Paul Martin and Kimberly Sheldon, who is lead author for the work.
Tewksbury noted that while direct estimates of tolerance are not available for all organisms or for all regions of the globe, there is good information on the degree of seasonal temperature fluctuation worldwide. That seasonality, he said, can be used to predict how well organisms will tolerate climate change.
The findings also imply that warming could forever alter life on Earth because the vast majority of species live in the tropics and many could be driven to extinction because of their inability to adapt.
"Evolution only happens if you don't go extinct. From an evolutionary standpoint, a model of the climate change impact reflects a race between adaptation and extinction," Tewksbury said.
"Climate models project 6 degree temperature shifts in temperate zones during the next 90 years and 2 to 3 degrees in equatorial climates. That is such a rapid change that longer-lived organisms such as trees will have very little opportunity for adaptation - survival might be a matter of tolerance alone. In contrast, for an insect that has three generations a year the evolution of tolerance might play a larger role.
"It's kind of a bleak outlook for tropical organisms, and it shows how the lack of seasonal temperature variation can magnify the impact of climate warming."
For more information, contact Tewksbury at ( 206 ) 616-2129 or tewksjj@u.washington.edu
Vince Stricherz
vinces@u.washington.edu
206-543-2580
University of Washington
http://www.uwnews.org
[quote]
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Alfred Tennyson', 'W')e are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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Re: Bye, bye rainforest.
by eric_b » Sun 06 May 2007, 18:10:17
Hmmm, possibly more bad news. That article does make a good point. Most models predict the majority of global warming will take place close to poles. However animals (& plants) in the extratropical and polar regions are already adapted to temperature extremes -- much more so than species in the tropics, which seldom experience temperature extremes. So while the tropics may not experience as much of a temperature rise, it may still prove deadly as many organisms have never had to cope with even modest temperature variations.
Considering most of the species (know & unknown) live in the tropics it would be a great loss.
Considering most of the species (know & unknown) live in the tropics it would be a great loss.
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Re: Bye, bye rainforest.
by Cyrus » Sun 06 May 2007, 18:30:52
Hmmm... Why don't I remember posting that?
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Cyrus - Tar Sands
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Re: Bye, bye rainforest.
by joewp » Sun 06 May 2007, 19:34:21
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Cyrus', 'H')mmm... Why don't I remember posting that?
Maybe because it was over a year and a half ago?
Joe P. joeparente.com
"Only when the last tree is cut; only when the last river is polluted; only when the last fish is caught; only then will they realize that you cannot eat money." - Cree Indian Proverb
"Only when the last tree is cut; only when the last river is polluted; only when the last fish is caught; only then will they realize that you cannot eat money." - Cree Indian Proverb
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Re: Bye, bye rainforest.
by Tanada » Mon 07 May 2007, 07:00:37
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('eric_b', 'H')mmm, possibly more bad news. That article does make a good point. Most models predict the majority of global warming will take place close to poles. However animals (& plants) in the extratropical and polar regions are already adapted to temperature extremes -- much more so than species in the tropics, which seldom experience temperature extremes. So while the tropics may not experience as much of a temperature rise, it may still prove deadly as many organisms have never had to cope with even modest temperature variations.
Considering most of the species (know & unknown) live in the tropics it would be a great loss.
Considering most of the species (know & unknown) live in the tropics it would be a great loss.
On the other hand those temperature variations really are modest. The difference between 110 and 115, when you are adapted to it are minor compared to the difference between 30 and 35. I think we will all be dead before we have to worry about radical temperature effects changing the tropics very much, but the Arctic, Sub-arctic and High Temperate area's will be undergoing radical change. I would be a lot more worried about Brazil turning the TRF into Soybean fields to fill the niche where America turns Soyabeans into Corn for ethanl production. One of the projections in the local paper flat out stated that Brazil was going to be the replacement for world Soyabean production, on lands that used to be rain forest.
Michigan Ethanol news
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'H')e said recent heavy rains have made the ground crusty, and a quarter-inch of rain might help soften that up and aid recently planted corn and soybeans.
Some growers are shifting their acres from soybeans to corn to capitalize on the higher prices. That may hurt soybean production in the future if South American farmers who compete annually with the United States pick up the slack in soybeans.
Tom Woelmer noted that some producers are ripping up their wheat fields and converting them to corn. He believes the surge in ethanol production will keep more money in the state.
"It's all competition," he said. "There's no reason for soybean prices to be so high all winter. It's because they're afraid (growers) will switch over from beans to corn. They don't want all the acres to leave" beans and wheat.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Alfred Tennyson', 'W')e are not now that strength which in old days
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
Moved earth and heaven, that which we are, we are;
One equal temper of heroic hearts,
Made weak by time and fate, but strong in will
To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
![[smilie=5opera.gif]](https://udev.peakoil.com/forums/images/smilies/5opera.gif "5opera")
![[smilie=new_popcornsmiley.gif]](https://udev.peakoil.com/forums/images/smilies/new_popcornsmiley.gif "new_popcornsmiley")
