[Bas]

Cynical people make for lousy human beings.

I can't blame anyone who studies peak oil for becoming cynical on occasion; I get like that myself on occasion but I never surrender to it like some on this forum seem to have surrendered to it.

To me cynical people seem to have stopped thinking; having become slaves of some sort of negative dogma about the world. They don't seem to have many original thoughts or interest in anything; they take cheap shots whenever they can at anyone who expresses an opinion that doesn't fit their dogma, often without provocation. They don't really contribute to debate and they express their opinions as if it were fact when in reality it's nothing more than, at most, partially based on fact.

Cynicism is for a big part apathy to the world and the future; it doesn't help changing it or planning for it; it's a form of depression in which people stopped fighting trying to intellectually improve on themselves.

What bothers me the most is that being cynical seems to be contagious and spreading on this board; I don't see any sense of humor anymore and I seem to be infected myself of late. Needless to say I don't like it.

Are we (becoming) a group of old grumpy men?


/cynicism

[Ibon]

Part of the problem is to have the awareness of peak oil and the understanding that solutions require a re-engineering of our whole political economic system to one of maintanance and sustainability while we are stuck in the current paradigm of consumption.

Change happens instantly in the head with the realization of peak oil. Translating this to the culture at large takes decades and is a slow process that looks on the surface to be intractable.

This creates cynicism and dispair. All the while having to wake up every morning and watch the problem getting exponentially worse.

The solution to this cinicism? Oddly it is to follow the advice of all your loved ones who claim that you are overly obsessed with this issue and that you need to go get a life. You know, as hard as it is to accept this they are in a way correct.

[dinopello]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bas', '[')b]Cynical people make for lousy human beings.

[Bas]

There's a difference between being a pessimist and a cynicist; for my part, I try to have some patience and respect for the people and world around me and try to keep my sense of humor but both things have become harder lately so maybe this thread is born mostly out of a change of my own way of looking at things. I do feel the need to resist against being cynical; it's a psychological trap and a destructive one. Though I'm not a psychology expert, this seems quite obvious to me.

It's true we have alot to be pessimistic about; I wouldn't be on this board if didn't think things looked very serious indeed. I won't resign to a single future scenario though; there are simply too many variables at work to be able to know what will transpire in the decades ahead. But that inability to know the future in itself leads to cynicism again; when confronted with overwhelming variables most people will be inclined to start thinking in worst case scenarios.

Anyway, I guess what I'm trying to say is that things look bad enough and that allowing cynicism to take you completely over doesn't help anyone, least of all, yourself.

[mmasters]

IMO striving to make the best out of the situation is as good as anyone with a real awareness of the possibilities coming can do.

The negative potential is ridiculous though, hard to blame anyone for having their cynical moments.

[eastbay]

Generally, it seems as though future prospects don't support optimism. Future trends can be predicted with some degree of certainty and, in view of everything discussed on this board, this leads to a deeper sense of gloominess.

There's no need to list the elements leading to this general sense of despair because we all know what they are, but maybe if we periodically focus on a few bright spots and crack a few jokes it might help mitigate the sharpness of the broadening cynicism and help extinguish despair.

Apathy can lead to surrender and, although despair peeks through now and then, we don't see much of that here considering general future prospects. What we read here are countless discussions on how to win as bright of a spot as possible among the list of survivors.

Yes, we all periodically slide into unhappiness as we emotionally struggle over how we'll manage things for ourselves and our loved ones five, 10 and 20 years from now. Some days are better than others. On the other hand, we smile as we see flowers bloom on our fruit trees and celebrate as new home-grown crop of vegetables sprouts. We can be happy we made it through another winter and with increased efficiency prepare for the next.

There's much to be happy about. Maybe we could all try a bit harder to point this out.

Edit for typo...

[Bas]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ibon', 'P')art of the problem is to have the awareness of peak oil and the understanding that solutions require a re-engineering of our whole political economic system to one of maintanance and sustainability while we are stuck in the current paradigm of consumption.

Change happens instantly in the head with the realization of peak oil. Translating this to the culture at large takes decades and is a slow process that looks on the surface to be intractable.

This creates cynicism and dispair. All the while having to wake up every morning and watch the problem getting exponentially worse.

[Coolman]

I am actually rather excited about seeing consumerism end.

The whole death and destruction thing has got me worried though.

[Grifter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bas', 'y')up; I should go out and find a girlfriend and peak oil doesn't make for a good pick-up line though it's again pretty much the only thing on my mind lately.

[Aaron]

People tend to be at their best, when times are at their worst.

So does the corollary apply?

Are people at their worst when times are good?

It would seem so.

We have sown the seeds of our own discontent, in the fertile soil of our prosperity.

Happens all the time... in waves which sweep the planet. Much of human history is an illustration of this concept. Cycles of prosperity & decline which feed one another, birthing the next iteration of change.

The problem is that the stakes get bigger & bigger, with each successive generation of change. As our capability to dominate the physical world has grown, so have the consequences of these cycles... both good & bad.

We can no more escape this cycle, than we can stop being human.

Only this time it's no simple famine or plague or war we face.

And we have never been more capable of destruction to one another, & our planet, than we are today.

A simple boycott of oil exports crushed the US economy for years.

Another earlier boycott precipitated WWII.

So...

Planetary Oil Boycott which never ends + Vast Military Assets * Entitlement Attitude = Cluster-fuck.

Huh... I really do know it all... who woulda guessed?

[Bas]

Pretty amazing that "cluster-fuck" kunstler hasn't fallen in the trap of cynicism, or has he?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'S')o...

Planetary Oil Boycott which never ends + Vast Military Assets * Entitlement Attitude = Cluster-fuck.

Huh... I really do know it all... who woulda guessed?

[Baldwin]

I have always equated cynicism with the truth that is, but is preferred to be kept under the rug.

Cynicism connotes all the negatives in this thread because it is diametrically opposed to today's feel good at any price society. If you are a regular on this board, you probably recognize the feel good aspect that pervades society.

I try and use cynicism frequently, but correctly. How to describe that? When used to convey a necessary truth, then fine. However, modern use of cynicism is just to put people down or make generalizations. As an example, in a discussion about teenagers, someone will make some pseudo-witticism about teenagers are all destructive, sex crazed, or generally no good. While it is "cynical" it is really just a generalization that isn't true.

[dinopello]

quotes about cynics

My fav on this page:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'A') cynic is a man who, when he smells flowers, looks around for a coffin.
H. L. Mencken (1880 - 1956)

[NEOPO]

I think the mod formerly known as Bas has been snatched!

Bas - you know how we sometimes do when things are not going our way, we whine and pout and otherwise show disdain.
Thats kinda how I see the real pissers acting.
Savinar is a good example and people like him wont stop until he is 100% convinced that biker zombies wont be eating his beaf cake buttocks for lunch anytime soon

Heres a lame yet still quite valid example : do you stop cheering for your favorite team once they have an insurmountable lead on the opposition? nope.

So these "cheerleaders" of doom will also not cease until the game is over.
All the worlds a stage and each plays their part.

Baldwins post reminded me of the ancient greek philosophers complaining about how "crazy" the children were in their day not listening to their parents, showing disrespect etc etc and wow doesnt that sound just like the old men of today?

[Bas]

NEOPO, as annoying as you may be from time to time, I must say you never came across as something that I would classify as cynical, but maybe your vague posts are just your way of fighting it.

[NEOPO]

"but which one wins grandfather?"
"the one you feed grandson"

Hmmm might it have occurred to you that people do not like to be annoyed and or woken up yet that is perhaps exactly what they need?

Naw I am just gonna come on here spend alot of my time kissin ass and saying what everyone wants to here.

Oil is going to peak and then run out and we're all screwed but we will be okay if we mitigate now.
Is that better? did that annoy you?

This is a good thread that provoked me to post.
You have had your share of jibber jabber my friend.
Heck you still believe in the current political system.
Europeans - go figure!

Why be vague? because they will hate us even more if we are straight to the point saying things like:

You/me/us/we our collective way of life is murder.
By doing nothing we condone all that is done.
By saying nothing we condone all that is said.
We cannot make a move in this reality without somehow someway supporting TPTB and the status quo.
We allow ourselves to be ensnared in a world where oil is everything and thus we send the signal to TPTB to keep on keeping on.
And like Aaron points out, food = fuel = a crime.

The hard part is how to break this off in peoples minds...GENTLY?

All I know is that I hope this thread annoyed someone, gave em alittle nudge in either direction as it is quite clear our current direction is unsustainable.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'S')ynonyms 1, 3. Cynical, pessimistic, sarcastic, satirical imply holding a low opinion of humanity. Cynical suggests a disbelief in the sincerity of human motives: cynical about honesty. Pessimistic implies a more or less habitual disposition to look on the dark side of things, and to believe that the worst will happen: pessimistic as to the future. Sarcastic refers to sneering or making cutting jibes: sarcastic about a profession of faith. Satirical suggests expressing scorn or ridicule by saying the opposite of what one means: a satirical attack on his political promises.
—Antonyms 1, 3. optimistic.

[syrac818]

Great Topic, and great job by the originally poster. I really can't say much more except...

Doomers bore the fuck out of me. The entire gloom overload on here has gone from shocking, to upsetting, to frustrating, to shut the fuck up and enjoy the blessed life you have!

[americandream]

What does a marxist like me want to cheer up this skewed system for.

Only thing I'll be doing is assisting this mess on its exit out the door.

No pep talk here mate.

[keehah]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '[')b]Modern cynicism

Typically, the modern cynic is greatly skeptical of social norms, especially those of a purpose more ritualistic than practical, and tend to question the validity of much popular belief, morality, and wisdom. They prefer awareness of social and world matters to a frivolous, care-free attitude to life. Cynics center on the ideals of human nature: inevitable patterns of behaviour and thought, placing oneself first, stereotypes, and intolerance.

Despite the mainstream society's negative portrayal of cynics, some philosophers argue that they are people who “refuse to look through rose-colored glasses”, and do not fear openly criticising society's typical behaviours.

Extreme cynicism in a person may lead cynics to view themselves as de-personalized, self-serving inhabitants of a meaningless, fictitious, shallow world.

In modern Greek slang, Starhidismos is the word describing a cynical attitude to life and one's relation to the State and society.

[Bas]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'E')xtreme cynicism in a person may lead cynics to view themselves as de-personalized, self-serving inhabitants of a meaningless, fictitious, shallow world.