[Specop_007]

Makes me feel all warm and fuzzy inside....



Article

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')he Raptor in the Real World

By John A. Tirpak, Executive Editor


In little more than a year, the Air Force has transformed its newly operational F-22 into something remarkable—a weapon of true intimidation. The Raptor has proved itself time and time again in USAF’s toughest wargames. In live exercises, it has trounced the best “opponents” USAF can muster. It hits them at unprecedented speeds and altitudes—and with impunity.

The F-22 does this while in the hands of operators—not test pilots, but rank and file fighter pilots. They consider it to be nearly as reliable as mature F-15 and F-16 fighters. Moreover, the Raptor has shown capabilities that may vastly amplify the power of the rest of the force.

In short, the F-22 is delivering on even the most ambitious claims made for it.

[greenworm]

This is why boys should not play with GI Joes when they are younger.

[Grifter]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '2')41-to-two kill ratio.

[dinopello]

Too bad air supremacy hasn't been so decisive in recent conflicts. But, you certainly don't want the other guy to have it.

[Tyler_JC]

I'm glad my tax dollars are being spent wisely...

Now we can take down any Soviet aircraft that dares come our way!

[nemo]

One could probably make a pretty solid case that the F-22 is a ridiculously expensive white elephant without a proper role to fill in any forseeable conflict.
It is also without any shadow of a doubt a very impressive piece of kill-tech. Raptor rules the skies. The only obvious way to eventually make a better fighter is to remove the primate from the cockpit. Meat don't like G-forces.

[dinopello]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('nemo', ' ')The only obvious way to eventually make a better fighter is to remove the primate from the cockpit. Meat don't like G-forces.

[What2DO]

We already have one you just have'nt seen it yet but we will perhaps 5 to 10 years maybe sooner. The military is always ahead of what is currently being used. Take lasers you will see them as standard weapons in 5 years. How do I know a little birdy told me

[mekrob]

$120 million a piece. Worth it? I doubt it. We don't need fighters. If any air, we need bombers and transport (mainly)

[TITAN]

Plus, that damn airframe puts guys like me out of business. The amount of avionics maintenance troops for an F-22 is a rediculously small number. Jobs as federal technicians are one of the last strongholds for the middle class.

I'll be happy to stick with A-10s and F-15s, they break alot more often and require actual repair, not just swapping LRUs...

[Zardoz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mekrob', '$')120 million a piece. Worth it? I doubt it. We don't need fighters. If any air, we need bombers and transport (mainly)

[PolestaR]

The F-22 has a long way to go to beat the 767....

[frankthetank]

For my democracy fighting power, i'm sticking with these...



Hell of a lot cheaper, can fly them from anywhere in the world and you can be a lot more risky in your adventure, due to the fact you dont have to worry about losing a fighter pilot that has cost how many dollars to train/time.

That thing will see more time @ an airshow then in action.

[Dreamtwister]

Laptop computer - $1500
12" satellite dish - $80
A 13 year old hacker bringing down the latest $120 million "unbeatable" POS - PRICELESS!

[mekrob]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Zardoz', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mekrob', '$')120 million a piece. Worth it? I doubt it. We don't need fighters. If any air, we need bombers and transport (mainly)

[pedalling_faster]

"F-22. The most advanced fighter in the world."

that's what Lockheed would like you to think.

it does depend on the definition of advanced.

having spent many years working on it and systems very similar to it - i'm not much at liberty to comment !

[mekrob]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')
that's what Lockheed would like you to think.

[Zardoz]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mekrob', '[')Yes, air supremacy over al-Qa'ida and the Mahdi Army which count RPG's as their most technological weapon. Is this really a match-up that is worth $120 million?

Talk about overkill.

[Free]

Yes it's one damn fine machine, even with undocumented problems it's very likely that it's the best fighter that exists, and who knows, with PO there might never be a better one.

But with the cold look of rationality in the end it all comes down to the net return for the huge cost. Is it really better to have one superior fighter if you could get a hundred ok-fighters for the same money? It probably depends on the situation.

Read "Rise and Fall of the great powers" by Kennedy to see that throughout history it was always a very bad symptom if the military-economic system reached the stage of "overprized" military.
Or also the theory about diminishing net returns of increasing complexity.

Also I have the feeling that the aspect of air superiority changes - everything points into the direction of independent, flexible, mobile missile forces, for surface to surface, surface to air, anti-ship.

It's all about the revolution of microcontrollers, miniaturization and computing power.
And the remark about the g-forces is a very important one - the human element in airborne vehicles becomes more and more unimportant, it's the thinking of a past age. The Raptor is fighting the last war, not future wars.

It's too expensive to invest in unreliable humans, if for the same money you can get a network of a missile force which in it's single component is dumber and less effective than a Raptor, but as a whole superior. The result is greater than the sum of its parts.

I don't know how to articulate it, I hope it makes sense...

[mekrob]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')
Do the Russians exist? Do Vladimir Putin and his ilk have no desire to return their country to prominence as a world power?

Does China exist? Do they have a military, or is it a myth? Will the Chinese go quietly into the night when TSHTF? Will the Russians give up, lay down, and defer to us in all matters?