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Maximum Wage

Unread postby cynicalheretic » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 21:00:24

Can anyone here give me a decent reason why a maximum wage should not be instituted.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby NEOPO » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 21:14:06

Excellent idea.
While we are at it let's make all companies employee owned!
Reset the pieces comrade and lets play again! 8)
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby gego » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 21:40:39

Reason? Theft is immoral.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby Loki » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 22:33:09

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gego', 'R')eason? Theft is immoral.

True. But how to define theft?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n 2004, the ratio of average CEO pay to the average pay of a production (i.e., non-management) worker was 431-to-1, up from 301-to-1 in 2003, according to "Executive Excess," an annual report released Tuesday by the liberal research groups United for a Fair Economy and the Institute for Policy Studies. That's not the highest ever. In 2001, the ratio of CEO-to-worker pay hit a peak of 525-to-1.

Still, it's quite a leap year over year, and it ranks on the high end historically. In 1990, for instance, CEOs made about 107 times more than the average worker, while in 1982, the average CEO made only 42 times more.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/08/26/news/economy/ceo_pay/

Just because someone is rich and powerful, that makes everything they do "moral"? No matter how much it screws other people?

I don't have much use for socialist redistribution schemes, but neither do I have much use for capitalist redistribution schemes. Both seem immoral to me.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby 128shot » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 23:39:42

horrid Idea. A maximum wage...can't see the point. why cap something? you know when you cap something you create shortages.


people who are paid these wages, that DESERVE these wages, will not preform up to their most duty if they cannot reap the fruits of their labor.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby Tanada » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 23:43:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cynicalheretic', 'C')an anyone here give me a decent reason why a maximum wage should not be instituted.


Why would I work honestly to get ahead if somebody else had the option of deciding I made too much and could take it away at a whim?

By the same token, why should I care if I get my work done if I know my employer needs workers and he has to pay me a mandated minimum just as a worker reguardless of the effort I put out for him?
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To strive, to seek, to find, and not to yield.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby Specop_007 » Sat 20 Jan 2007, 23:49:17

Why dont you give us a decent reason why there should be, and we'll go from there.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby Armageddon » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 00:25:15

The minimum wage increase will result in the owners of the companies raising the price of goods and services to recoup the increase in wages. In the long run, this will hurt everyone, and hurt the minimum wage earner the most since he makes the least.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby TITAN » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 04:55:21

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Tanada', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cynicalheretic', 'C')an anyone here give me a decent reason why a maximum wage should not be instituted.


Why would I work honestly to get ahead if somebody else had the option of deciding I made too much and could take it away at a whim?

By the same token, why should I care if I get my work done if I know my employer needs workers and he has to pay me a mandated minimum just as a worker reguardless of the effort I put out for him?



Maybe people might learn that the accumulation of masses of wealth is absolutely not the point of life...

Even if there were a cap on wages, I gaurantee greedy humans would still fight and claw their way to that maximum wage...

The reason for no cap on wages? Control. The people at the top truly believe that power is everything, and, thankfully they all die unhappy...
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby gego » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 07:32:10

Remember the movie, "Logan's Run". They took the idea of the group deciding what one person was entitled to, except instead of imposing a maximum wage, they imposed a maximum age. It really is the same thinking whether you chose to steal wealth earned by another, or murder him if he reaches 30; the same immorality.

There seems to be an assumption in the suggestion of a maximum income, that somehow if a person earns over a certain amount he must be evil or that he must have cheated somehow to accomplish that.

My view is this is the politics of envy, right along with progressive taxation.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby frankthetank » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 12:28:27

It would be interesting to compare the level of happiness (whatever the hell that is) in homeless bums and successful business men.

I wonder which one has a larger ecological footprint?

I doubt anyone on this board will ever have a problem related to this question! :)
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby Bas » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 13:08:23

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cynicalheretic', 'C')an anyone here give me a decent reason why a maximum wage should not be instituted.


that would make the owners of capital alot richer, lots of european countries have quite hefty taxes for everything made over 50,000 though, and high minimum wages 8)
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby Bas » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 13:22:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('armegeddon', 'T')he minimum wage increase will result in the owners of the companies raising the price of goods and services to recoup the increase in wages. In the long run, this will hurt everyone, and hurt the minimum wage earner the most since he makes the least.


I disagree, first of all, labour has to compete with machines (capital) and a higher minimum wage therefor increases innovation.

For the samer reason (because minimum wage is only a part of cost of any production), the people on minimum wage will always be better off than with a lower wage. (though raising the minimum wage might have an adverse effect on inflation when RAISING it, but this is only a temporary effect)

A high minimum wage is good for the economy and for personal well being, as the poor are likely to spend the extra money on necessities while the rich might spend it on ineffecient produced stuff they don't use anyway.

The only disadvantage to a high minimum wage is possible unemployment (for instance because you have to compete with China), therefor raising it usually happens when the labour market is already tight.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby Kingcoal » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 13:48:18

While we are at it, why not a maximum penis size? Or a maximum breast size? Or a maximum shoe size?
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby threadbear » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 14:42:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Kingcoal', 'W')hile we are at it, why not a maximum penis size? Or a maximum breast size? Or a maximum shoe size?


That would create an uneven playing field for you.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby gego » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 14:45:27

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bas', '
')
A high minimum wage is good for the economy and for personal well being, as the poor are likely to spend the extra money on necessities while the rich might spend it on ineffecient produced stuff they don't use anyway.


This is the shortsightedness of collectivist thinking. If we all had equal incomes, then almost all of that would be consumed currently. Where would the machines then come from to then enhance our productive capabilities. If a farmer ate his seed corn, then where would next years crop come from?

It is only because income is not distributed equally that some have excess to invest in productive assets, which in turn result in further future greater production.

The idea that goods other than necessities are inefficient production is absurd. It sounds to me like envy that would drive such a value judgment. Maybe someone with a lesser standard of living than you should evaluate your spending to see what he thinks is unnecessary and place a limit on your income.

Collectivism will add to the coming shrinking of the economic and expand human suffering, not mitigate it.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby threadbear » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 14:50:32

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Loki', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gego', 'R')eason? Theft is immoral.

True. But how to define theft?

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n 2004, the ratio of average CEO pay to the average pay of a production (i.e., non-management) worker was 431-to-1, up from 301-to-1 in 2003, according to "Executive Excess," an annual report released Tuesday by the liberal research groups United for a Fair Economy and the Institute for Policy Studies. That's not the highest ever. In 2001, the ratio of CEO-to-worker pay hit a peak of 525-to-1.

Still, it's quite a leap year over year, and it ranks on the high end historically. In 1990, for instance, CEOs made about 107 times more than the average worker, while in 1982, the average CEO made only 42 times more.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/08/26/news/economy/ceo_pay/

Just because someone is rich and powerful, that makes everything they do "moral"? No matter how much it screws other people?

I don't have much use for socialist redistribution schemes, but neither do I have much use for capitalist redistribution schemes. Both seem immoral to me.


Hey, hey. Bingo! Why is it considered a wise economic move to shave the income of the working poor to the bone, but seriously flawed market dynamics to cap the income of the corporate elite? Like someone who is making a couple of million a year is going to seriously miss a few hundred thousand bucks? This cap would crush the incentive for potential entrepreneurs?

Here's another reason a maximum wage cap is a good idea. Noone should ever make such an exorbitant income that they can afford an entire suite of lawyers to ennable them to evade income tax.
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Re: Maximum Wage

Unread postby Bas » Sun 21 Jan 2007, 16:26:05

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gego', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Bas', '
')
A high minimum wage is good for the economy and for personal well being, as the poor are likely to spend the extra money on necessities while the rich might spend it on ineffecient produced stuff they don't use anyway.


This is the shortsightedness of collectivist thinking. If we all had equal incomes, then almost all of that would be consumed currently. Where would the machines then come from to then enhance our productive capabilities. If a farmer ate his seed corn, then where would next years crop come from?

It is only because income is not distributed equally that some have excess to invest in productive assets, which in turn result in further future greater production.

The idea that goods other than necessities are inefficient production is absurd. It sounds to me like envy that would drive such a value judgment. Maybe someone with a lesser standard of living than you should evaluate your spending to see what he thinks is unnecessary and place a limit on your income.

Collectivism will add to the coming shrinking of the economic and expand human suffering, not mitigate it.


I'm not proposing anything collectivist, I don't know where you get the idea, besides the return on capital goes up when it's in relative short supply; if someone reasons without taking the market into account, it's you.
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