[rogerhb]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gego', '"')LAST week’s warnings from <occupation> operating in <location> that their operations could be hit by power disruptions highlighted increasing power shortages across <region>, as growing economies grapple with inadequate planning and higher energy costs."

[mekrob]

Ethanol to save the day!!!

[gg3]

For NZ: a couple of nuclear reactors would make much sense, seeing as Aus has the uranium with which to fuel them. Meanwhile, Aus should build a breeder reactor and start a commercial waste-to-fuel reprocessing service.

Rogerhb: Yeah, good one there.

When I was a kid we used the term "underdeveloped." Then it became "less developed." Then "developing." I understand that before "underdeveloped," words such as "backward" were common.

Now modern military theory talks about "collapsed states" and "failed states." Those phrases seem more realistic than all of the terms for relative degrees of "development."

I've always thought the term "pre-industrial" was kind of nasty. I prefer "non-industrial" because it does not presuppose a uniform timeline by which all cultures are judged: some cultures just won't go there if left to themselves, and that's their right. And I say this as an "eco-industrial" who has worked in and promoted technology all my life.

[Free]

Haha, guess what, not only in Africa.

Yesterday I read an article that there are looming electricity shortages in Austria in the winter since we a) don't have enough domestically produced power and b) the grid isn't designed to handle a higher import load.

Meanwhile I don't even pay that much attention anymore to such stories about energy which seem to confirm the greatest fears. It's like:"Clusterfuck? Everything going according to plan..."

[SchroedingersCat]

*Bump*

US accused of covert operations in Somalia

[rwwff]

I'd be insulted if we weren't running covert ops in Somalia, Niger, Sudan, and every other lame, disorganized oil producing country. Sheesh. What planet do these British press guys think they live on.

[MrMambo]

The German "Federal Ministry for the Environment, Nature Conservation and Nuclear Safety" has suggested a very down to earth an practical solution to meet all of Europes electricity needs from renewable energy. It is also a plan to provide a lot more desalinated drinking water.
Check out their english language repport on:
http://www.trec-uk.org.uk/reports/TRANS ... _Final.pdf

This report is related to the suggestions of the "The Trans-Mediterranean Renewable Energy Cooperation:" http://www.trecers.net/

The main idea is to use High Voltage Direct Current (HVDC) wich is now 97% effective over 1000 Kilometers to transport energy from Consentrating Solar Thermal Power (CSTP) in African and Middle eastern desert regions. It is about mirrors focusing light on something making it extreemly hot and then running a more or less conventional heat power plant on that.

The main reason theese are realistic plans is that CSTP is already producing power at a price of about 50$ a barrel of oil equivalent energy according to the estimate. Also note that large scale industrial deployment and further improvements on technology will probably lead to prices in the range of 20$ a barrel of oil equivalent

I shouldn't have to remind you that electicity is energy in its most usable form with engines easily performing at over 95% efficiency. Copuled with electric batteries at over 90% efficiency you get easilly about 85% total efficiency for an electric car compared to the below 30% efficiency of a gasoline based car. So PLEEEAASE don't pull out that irreplacability of liquid fuel bullshit!!!!!!

For a short summary read this article:
http://business.guardian.co.uk/story/0,,1957692,00.html
In addition to energy from the sun we have a lot more potencial energy from renewables. In norway we could easilly double our onshore electricity production adding more wind + smallscale hydropower. Adding the potencial of offshore wind and wave power we could technically quadruple our energy production. The only question for the offshore alternative is the higher relative cost than the solar alternative in Africa+Middle East. But if energy security is an issue... well then maybe we should build in an oversupply of renewable energy from the northern regions of Europe .. just in case Africa decided to cut the cables to the spoiled infidel europeans, and consume the energy for themselves.

[waegari]

This scheme may be great for electricity production, but will make hardly any difference for oil.

I seem to recall that in the EU some 60% of all oil consumption is by car traffic alone...

So it would only affect car traffic through a vast, massive and overwhelming restructuring of car technology (having them run on batteries) to be put in place right along with it, or better still: right now. Which in itself would vastly increase the amount of solar energy needed...
Not to mention the unfathomable costs to such restructuring of the EU automotive fuel system.

[MrMambo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('waegari', 'T')his scheme may be great for electricity production, but will make hardly any difference for oil.

I seem to recall that in the EU some 60% of all oil consumption is by car traffic alone...

So it would only affect car traffic through a vast, massive and overwhelming restructuring of car technology (having them run on batteries) to be put in place right along with it, or better still: right now. Which in itself would vastly increase the amount of solar energy needed...
Not to mention the unfathomable costs to such restructuring of the EU automotive fuel system.

[miraculix]

do not get ahead of yourself there Mambo!

First you have to look at the energy required to manufacture and maintain electric vs. internal combustion motored vehicles.

I do not have any numbers to fall back on in regards to this correlation, but my gut feeling is, that the batteries are putting you in the red for the electric car.

Overall there certainly will be an overall net energy gain on a per mile basis for electric over gasoline.

Also, I do concur that electrification of transport will result in a prolonged sustainibility of our current modus operandi.

Schemes like the sun-to-steam power genration and the new generation of "mini" nuke-power plants, like the Chinese are planning, seem viable as alternative sources of electricity.

The key is diversification of generation and upgrading and expanding existing power grids.

It all appears possible - if only we had the time to do it.

[JRP3]

A couple of points. The batteries available that give EV's reasonable performance are very expensive, which makes the cost of EV's relatively high. See Tesla, Electrum, Phoenix, Tango, etc. Yes this will come down with time, but it will take some years to do so. People driving $15-20K cars now will not replace them with $35-45K cars antime soon.

As for petrol stations changing out battery packs, all EV's have batteries totalling hundreds of pounds buried in the vehicle with many connections, it's not a quick swap and it's unlikely there will be any kind of standard pack that could be swapped out. More likely petrol stations would be fitted with fast chargers allowing 5- 10 min. recharge, which is not much longer than what you spend now filling up.

[MrMambo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JRP3', ' ')As for petrol stations changing out battery packs, all EV's have batteries totalling hundreds of pounds buried in the vehicle with many connections, it's not a quick swap and it's unlikely there will be any kind of standard pack that could be swapped out. More likely petrol stations would be fitted with fast chargers allowing 5- 10 min. recharge, which is not much longer than what you spend now filling up.

[MrMambo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JRP3', 'A') couple of points. The batteries available that give EV's reasonable performance are very expensive, which makes the cost of EV's relatively high. See Tesla, Electrum, Phoenix, Tango, etc. Yes this will come down with time, but it will take some years to do so. People driving $15-20K cars now will not replace them with $35-45K cars antime soon.

[MrMambo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('miraculix', 'F')irst you have to look at the energy required to manufacture and maintain electric vs. internal combustion motored vehicles.

[lateStarter]

When I saw this article last week, the first thing that came to mind was: who would invest the huge sums of money involved to build and maintain such a project in Africa? It could all be gone in the blink of an eye. In case you haven't noticed MrMambo, Africa is not the most stable of places (not that anyplace else really is either). Sure, energy hungry countries outside of Africa will continue to suck/drain/mine the place to ruin, but those are more of a hit and run type of operation. When the resource runs low or gets too expensive to obtain, or it gets too dangerous, they just move on to the next place.

What you are talking about is a long-term comittment. Even though being in the desert may offer some protection from the wandering, restless masses, the electricity produced has to be carried by cable(s) to Europe. I'm assuming the desalinated water is a 'gift' for the local people. Where would the water come from? Oh! They need a pipeline to bring it in...

On paper (in some Ivory tower in Germany) this looks like a great concept. Of course, those folks in the tower won't be on the ground in Africa building or maintaining (guarding) it. In short, the geography is great, the political and social instability not so promising.

[JRP3]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MrMambo', '
')
As for the price: In norway we have a manufacturer making $15-20K cars for city use.

http://www.think.no/

They are definately not SUV's but still they are not luxury cars for the filthy rich either (Like the Teslas).

With real mass production you could easilly make improved versions of the think (4 seaters) in the same price range.

[MrMambo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('JRP3', ' ')These cars are what has always been wrong with EV's. Sure they may be fine vehicles and all most people really need, but they will not gain widespread acceptance. People will not go from their $20-30K Camry to a $20K mini car with a 50-100 mile range. They might go from their Camry to a $25-35K EV Corrolla equivalent with 150-200 mile range. That car does not exist and probably won't at that price range for 5 or more years unless there is some truly breakthrough battery technology.

[MrMambo]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lateStarter', 'O')n paper (in some Ivory tower in Germany) this looks like a great concept. Of course, those folks in the tower won't be on the ground in Africa building or maintaining (guarding) it. In short, the geography is great, the political and social instability not so promising.

[chris-h]

we have to "LIBERATE" these africans coutries !!!!!
We "MUST SPREAD DEMOCRAZY" there !!!!
Operation "DEZERT FREEDOM" must proceed at once !!!!
Cheney make plans !!!!
to the public
THEY HAVE NEW VOODOO tech !!!!
They are a threat !!!! They can VOODOO us in 5 minutes !!!!

[Armageddon]

http://www.slate.com/id/2163389/entry/2163395?nav=tap3

good read