PeakOil is You
The End of Ingenuity
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The End of Ingenuity
by entropyfails » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 10:56:46
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'M')AYBE Malthus was on to something, after all.
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'B')ut in the larger sense, we really need to start thinking hard about how our societies — especially those that are already very rich — can maintain their social and political stability, and satisfy the aspirations of their citizens, when we can no longer count on endless economic growth.http://www.nytimes.com/2006/11/29/opini ... rdixon.htm
It sounds like someone has been reading about Peak Oil! *grin* The article actually defines EROI (It should be EROEI but we'll forgive him as he just forgot an E! *laugh*) It may only be an op-ed, but its an important step to get these terms printed in the Newspaper of Record. Take a look and let me know what you think!
EntropyFails
"Little prigs and three-quarter madmen may have the conceit that the laws of nature are constantly broken for their sakes." -- Friedrich Nietzsche
"Little prigs and three-quarter madmen may have the conceit that the laws of nature are constantly broken for their sakes." -- Friedrich Nietzsche
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entropyfails - Expert
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Re: The End of Ingenuity
by EnergyUnlimited » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 11:13:11
I had noticed that they are quoting EROEI 4 for Alberta tar sands...
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EnergyUnlimited - Light Sweet Crude
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Re: The End of Ingenuity
by Dreamtwister » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 11:18:00
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('EnergyUnlimited', 'I') had noticed that they are quoting EROEI 4 for Alberta tar sands...
And that's the future of energy?
I think I'm going to cry now.
The whole of human history is a refutation by experiment of the concept of "moral world order". - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Dreamtwister - Intermediate Crude
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Re: The End of Ingenuity
by Bas » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 13:28:34
what everybody always forgets is that EROI's are not fixed...the EROI for oil is actually going down as we are increasingly dependent on hard to get by oil on the bottom of the sea or smaller/deeper deposits on land.
At the same time the EROI of bio fuels can still rise considerably through economies of scale and to a lesser extend by using more energy efficient technologies. Also the fact that it can be produced locally contributes to the EROI of bio fuels.
Biofuels will never reach the average EROI of oil though, that much is clear, we're lucky if we get 25% of the EROI of oil. The advantage in this though is that bio fuel production will mean more jobs than the oil industry ever held or will hold.
At the same time the EROI of bio fuels can still rise considerably through economies of scale and to a lesser extend by using more energy efficient technologies. Also the fact that it can be produced locally contributes to the EROI of bio fuels.
Biofuels will never reach the average EROI of oil though, that much is clear, we're lucky if we get 25% of the EROI of oil. The advantage in this though is that bio fuel production will mean more jobs than the oil industry ever held or will hold.
- Bas
Re: The End of Ingenuity
by Dreamtwister » Wed 29 Nov 2006, 14:07:06
Never mind.
The whole of human history is a refutation by experiment of the concept of "moral world order". - Friedrich Nietzsche
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Dreamtwister - Intermediate Crude
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