[Coolman]

Thanks everyone for your excellent posts. Dvanharn, some of the things you said remind me of myself.

I can barely stand being with family members, friends, and co-works. (Its no wonder I don't have a girl friend, I can't stand all the girls, they are so blind!, and that goes for guys too, they are blind too, so in that effect it is hard to find new friends.) I just can't take the optimistic attitude anymore. I just want to scream in their face, YOU NEED TO JUST SHUT UP!!! THIS FUTURE, YOU THINK OF, IT IS NOT GOING TO HAPPEN, FOR THE REST OF YOUR LIFE YOU WILL LIVE A LIKE OF POVERTY AND THERE NOTHING ON EARTH YOU CAN DO ABOUT IT!!! People always ask me what I am going to do in the future and I don't know what to say, I just make up some bull shit, because if I told them I am preparing to live in a post oil world they would think I am nuts. I just hope no one every asks me to write one of those "Where do you see yourself in 10 years papers" The resulting paper would probably make them shit their pants.

But I must say, I wish I had more courage when it came to telling people about Peak Oil. I am afriad of what they will say or what they will do. Learning that life will never be the same can seriously destroy a person. I don't want to lose the friends I already have, I don't want my family to think I am a nutcase.

I thought I was a rare breed before. I am a person, who does not believe in cars, I don't own one, don't have a drivers license or a prement. I ride my bike everywere. And you can bet what kind of remarks I get for just that. But, since I discovered Peak Oil I know I am even more rare then bofore and that is hard, really, really hard. But, I can not give up, I must fight the good fight, people are going to need me in the future, they will need to look up to me, because I am informed and they are going to need a leader. I think all of us on this form have the chance to be leaders in the future. We are rare people here and know about something that many do not. When Peak Oil comes people are going to be mad and confused and we can help them.

[Guest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('J0EW', '
')Let's face it. No one wants to hear about the price of oil, or its implications on the future. I have tried talking to my wife, my parents, my brothers, and many of my friends about the implications of peak oil. Here are the responses I got:
Wife: I don't like to think about that stuff.

[k_semler]

I have found that drinking copious amounts of alcohol does help deal with the knowledge of peak oil. After I get home from work, I crack open a beer, and start drinking. I find that 4-6 beers every day does make me not think about the consequences so heavily. It doesn't really help with the knowledge that I do have about the upcoming situation, but it does help with not being able to think about it for too long. Basically, when I am not at work, and if it is after 0:00, (I work the third shift), I will start drinking, and not stop until I go to bed. I do this every day. Since once I get home, I do not leave until the next evening, I see no problem with it. The only person I am endangering is myself. If I die of alcohol poisoning, it is not a big deal. I will die someday anyhow.

As far as telling other persons about the coming situation, I figure that if they are interested in the topic, then they would do some research. I am no man's private tutor when it comes to peak oil education. I discovered all I know about peak oil with no help, others can do the same if they desire.

I have also noticed that the more information I find out about peak oil, the more hopeless I see my personal future. I have steadily become more pessimistic about life in general, and I am now to the point of wondering why I even bother with the corporate bull shit when it will not matter in the least bit anyhow after the oil age. No matter whose ass I kiss, it will not help my situation in any aspect with regards to surviving the downfall of the industrial era, The only person I trust is myself, since I have found that usually persons who show "respect" to me are usually trying to take advantage of me or my finances somehow.

Also, I am not willing to get involved with a woman, or seek friends primarily three reasons. The first reason is that this would weaken my chances of survival, by becoming emotionally involved in their well-being. The second reason is because by becoming emotionally attached to a person, I would be devastated when they perished from collapse related situations. Severe emotional distress impairs the ability to make rational decisions, and hence, reduces your chances of survival. The third reason is very subjective, but a viewpoint that I sincerely believe, this opinion is: who the hell would want to hang out with me? I am about the most reclusive person that I know of, and nobody would be interested in me since I have basically told the sheeple to shove off.

[Ayoob]

Yeah, it's funny trying to talk to people who are totally committed to a growing economy and the continued economic development of resources for the consumer market. Growth is the undercurrent of so much in our culture. Competition, struggle, advancement, increasing wealth, optimism, lack of critical thinking, physical pleasures, group identity... I think these are the characteristics that the Peak Oil group are arguing against. These values are embedded very deeply in US culture.

When we say that there is a limited resource out there and that there are actually limits to our growth and achievement, it takes the wind out of people's sails. The American dream is built on everyone having the chance to be Donald Trump, or at least the dentist with the Benz and a nice house in the burbs. What happens when you take that away from the American people? They get upset. We spend so much time working and so little time socializing that our mindsets are very much aligned with the dream of success that capitalism provides.

Not that they actually enjoy the benefits of capitalism. Capitalism concentrates wealth in the hands of the few rather than distributing the wealth of the nation among the many. By its nature, capitalism takes from the many and gives to the few. Why is this a good thing for the many? It's a mindset I don't understand. Why would young workers care whether the Dow Jones goes up? They get much more of their wealth from the labor they provide, yet they're anti-union because unions give workers some degree of negotiating power. Why would I care whether Bill Gates makes an extra billion or two? I'd think that programmers would form unions and collectively bargain with the relatively few places that provide them with employment. They don't want to possibly because they see themselves rising up from the masses to own their own company some day and they want unfettered freedom to grow. Maybe they don't see that today is the day to enjoy life and be rewarded for work, not twenty years down the road. Who knows what life will bring over the next twenty years?

My girlfriend's company makes 5% of its profits from the sale of landmines. When I found this out, I emailed her the document and she showed it to her boss. He got really upset. I don't think he likes to consider the ramifications of his actions.

Oh, a little side note. The UPS guy just delivered a package to me and I gave him a copy of End of Suburbia. I wonder if he'll watch it.

Anyway, it's difficult to overcome these obstacles when talking to somebody about what we're all doing. It's the very definition of counterculture. I think there's a certain percentage of the population that is predisposed to counterculture and a much larger percentage that is not going to listen under almost any circumstances. People sacrafice their personal lives, their time, their energy, their very days on this planet in order to achieve material success. How do you tell someone who has worked for forty years to climb their way up to their house in the suburbs, their bass boat, their SUV, their community's movie theaters and stores, their roads and bridges... how do you tell them it's all going to unravel and there's nothing they can do about it?

I've been a salesman for the last ten years. I'll tell you from personal experience that if you want people to agree with your point of view, it's much easier to get them to look at a positive and happy experience than it is to simply dump gloom on their heads. "Everything's going to get worse!" Well, all that does is stimulate the spot on people's lizard brain that says there is danger coming from that person and I need to get away from them.

So, how do we make the post-carbon life look attractive to people? I've been struggling with this for quite some time. One thing I came up with was to make a list of the things I want. At the top of the list were clean air and clean water. Without those, it's more difficult to be healthy. Obviously, if you are immersed in a toxic atmosphere, it's going to affect you in some way. Asthma is one possible effect of our current lifestyle that many people have. Most people at least know somebody who has asthma. Wouldn't it be great if that person didn't have to suffer while breathing? Sometimes asthma is caused by pollution. How would you like to live in a place where you could walk out your back door and be able to fish in a stream? I think that would be pretty cool. Not that I'd want to HAVE to do that every day for my sustenance, but it would be a good thing to have that resource available if I wanted to utilize it. How could fishing be a bad thing? Try to connect pollution with someone they know and care about. Let them know that if we change our lifestyles a little that person would suffer less. Let them know the decision is in their hands every time they decide to drive across town to rent a movie or go to Burger King instead of making something healthy at home.

I've noticed that people are more and more aware of peak oil. I don't sound like a total lunatic anymore when I talk about this with people. Even the guy at the gas station knows what's up. This is a big change

Another problem we face is the stark reality that we consume 30% of the world's oil with 5% of the population. We'd have to get down to 1/6th of our petroleum usage just to be average. Driving 1/6th of the miles we currently drive, importing products from 1/6th the distance, running 1/6th of the appliances. Nobody wants to hear about that. How about presenting it from another angle? China and India's population combined is ten times our population. No matter how much we conserve, no matter how much we would like to defend "our" access to petroleum, if China and India double their use of petroleum, it has ten times the impact that we would have in conserving on a per capita basis. The future of oil distribution is no longer completely in our hands. There are other forces at work.

Since our military, the strongest on the planet, cannot subdue a devastated third-world country like Iraq, what do you think the likelihood is of defeating an enemy like Iran? They're much stronger than Iraq and their people will rise up like the insurgents in Iraq against us. Well, maybe attacking Iran isn't such a good idea. Now consider China and Russia. Nobody in the history of the world has beaten China in a war. The Mongols gave the Chinese a solid run for their money once, but China came back. They have five thousand continuous years of military success. The US has 250 years of military success (debatable) and a lot of good luck on our side as far as resources, alliances, and technology. Maybe using the military to ensure our future and success isn't the best plan. What else could we do?

What would happen if we invested $200 billion in auto efficiency, windmills and solar panels, construction of smaller communities that wouldn't need so much dependance on resources we don't even have, better schools, improvements in public transportation infrastructure, parks and police in our cities instead of patrolling the Middle East in aircraft carriers? Which one would you rather have? I think the average citizen would rather have a really nice electric tram in their towns rather than an increasing gas price.

There is a bright side to Peak Oil. Smaller, cleaner communities where some degree of economic planning and resource allocation would make people's lives better. I don't think anyone really likes commuting 45 minutes each way on the highways. Wouldn't it be nice to have a ten minute commute on a light rail system to go to work? I think so.

The Jewish neighborhood in West Hollywood has it pretty good. Since they all have to walk to Temple on the Sabbath, they pretty much have to live in a concentrated area. They support their local businesses run by local people. There's the butcher, the leather repair shop, the bookstore, the Jewish community center, the Hebrew schools, and other things. Koreatown in LA is similar. They have local entertainment, local businesses, and a community that has an identity. Lots of Koreans live there because they have a culture to identify with. East LA has a similar situation with the Mexican, Argentinian, Ecuadorian, etc communities providing things locally that their populations like. In Chicago, we used to have Polish neighborhoods, German neighborhoods and so forth that provided certain things locally.

We've degenerated to Wal*Mart.

No more local diversity.

Anybody really like Wal*Mart? I don't. I know, it's cheap, and you can get more pickles than you ever wanted for $2.69. But what's the price we pay for that? We give up so much for that jar of pickles. We get to choose from Vlasic, Vlasic, or Vlasic for our pickles. I used to love the pickled tomatoes from this Jewish deli a couple miles from home in Chicago. It's getting increasingly difficult to locate places that have something other than the same stuff we have everywhere. I have to drive an hour and a half round trip to get pickled tomatoes today.

A couple years ago I drove from Chicago to San Francisco to LA to Tijuana and back up through the Four Corners to Chicago. I was expecting to see all kinds of different things in the different places. I figured I'd see a good place to pick up a pair of cowboy boots somewhere along the way. They were all made by the same manufacturers, though. You could get the same ones in Chicago for the same price. McDonalds was everywhere. Barnes and Noble in one city was the same as it was in another. Togo's. Subway. Motel 6. Shell gasoline. Ford. Chevy. Kmart. Baskin Robins. The amount of diversity has decreased. My latest trip from LA to Ft Collins, CO was even worse. Wal*Mart had choked off diversity even further. In a lot of places, I found warehouse stores offering the exact same goods everywhere. The malls all had the same shops in one place that they had in another. What a yawn. I might as well have just stayed home.

Wouldn't it be nice to travel from place to place and find local businesses and local specialties? It would make travel worthwhile.

So, this is my message to activists on the topic of Peak Oil. The brighter future we can work towards is that of local communities run by local people. As we diversify ourselves across the land, we'll have more individual choices about how we would like to live. Maybe in Texas, people will want to go to church and eat beef. Maybe in Northern California people will walk around in locally made sandals and eat Tofu. Maybe people in NYC will have greatly concentrated populations with a mix of different cultures for those that like the buffet that comes from that lifestyle. Maybe people in LA will still have fake tits and porn and whatnot, but that will be their choice. We could have it good, you know?

There is a dark side to consider. It will be colder in winter and hotter in summer. We son't have easy access to every last goddamn thing under the sun. We won't have as many things, but maybe we'll have a better connection to the things we have. All things considered, if we take a realistic look at our situation and take useful actions, we'll still have it good. The poor bastards in Haiti are screwed beyond belief. Same thing in the Philipines, certain parts of Africa and Asia, the frozen wastelands of Russia and parts of Canada... and the list goes on. We'll have food, we'll have water, we'll have a diverse culture, we'll have forests and lakes and wilderness. Give the earth a couple of decades to clear itself of the crap we pour out all over it and our great grandchildren could have it better than we have today.

Or, we could go to war to defend the profits of BP and Shell, and to continue to work harder and harder for less and less of the share of the things that our world has to offer us.

[Sencha]

Wow, I have to say I'm glad I started this thread. There have been some pretty moving posts, from Ayoob, K_semler, Dvanharn and others. I'm also glad to know I'm not the only one that's struggling from this kind of thing.

The remarks about Capitalism make me almost wish for peak oil. I am a pretty big critic of the system myself. Helps if you hate your minimum wage, part-time job.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') have found that drinking copious amounts of alcohol does help deal with the knowledge of peak oil. After I get home from work, I crack open a beer, and start drinking. I find that 4-6 beers every day does make me not think about the consequences so heavily.

[TheSupplyGuy]

I get really frustrated sometimes, but I tend to take the more optimistic outcome of it(due to my personality), and I basically talk more about economic implications with people. They tend to believe that much more easily. Besides, even if I haven't gotten my friends to believe me, they are much more aware of oil in general now.

[smallpoxgirl]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Sencha', 'I') probably shouldn't be saying this, but damn I so have to drink more beer. ^_^ (especially while it lasts.)

[Sencha]

I looked a little into microbrewing, can't really get into it right now. But hey, if the crash occurs and I mange to hold on to some sort of stability, I'm sure I'll have all the time in the world to perfect the art of home brewing. (provided surving doesn't take too much of it.)

[Josephus]

I've learned to only broach the subject when it's applicable to the conversation and not delve into it too deeply. That's when peoples faces usually go blank or they roll their eyes. Or worse they say something to the effect of "That's horrible, something should be done" but then don't want to actually hear anymore. Like others have said in this thread, if people are genuinely interested or concerned they will ask.

On another note, Ayoob, I like the idea of the old-fashioned downtown centered communities each with it's individual flavor. Let's just pray/meditate/hope/plan for a gradual conversion without the hard landing. Actually, even after a hard landing and all that entails I think people would go back to that way of living after the dust settles. We're a communal species and even if the doomsayers turn out to be right, it won't stay that way forever unless of course we wipe ourselves right of the planet.

[MrHubbert]

Time makes more converts than reason.
--Thomas Paine

There are some great posts here ... full of angst. I feel for all you guys. Ever since I was very young (maybe 10) in the 1960's I knew something like this was coming. I wasn't sure what was going to get us first, but I read and believed Limits to Growth when it came out. In that sense, I've been (emotionally) where a lot of you (younger) guys are now, only I was there 30+ years ago.

I think a lot of you are putting yourselves in an emotional bind because you are filled with conflict.
While you know that you are right about PO, you feel that if you can't convince those near you that you are right, then you are going to die alone.

Take a close look at that last sentence .... notice I didnt say that you were afraid THEY were going to die. Now, consider this ... in your whole, entire life, how many times have you EVER been able to convert or convince someone to completely change their point of view about something they consider important ?

If you are lucky (and old) you might have been successful maybe once or twice. So why do you persist in thinking that you have the ability (or the right) to try to alter the thing that most people hold dearest (their worldview) ? As much as it pains me to say it, you DON'T have that right. The right you do have is to make the decisions which shape your OWN life and those who choose to share that life with you.

Read the quote at the top of the page. Then read it again.

I think there are two other issues which caught my eye here ... a common theme if you will. The first is the anguish that a lot of you feel about being alone in the world with this knowledge. You feel that if only people were (insert appropriate adjective here : smarter, more open-minded, more rational, etc.) that your emotions would subside to a tolerable level. Guess what ? They won't. And the reason for that is that you are ALL unique, you are all special and you are all incredibly blessed (and cursed) with the combination of foresight and intelligence that lets you see the future that others are incapable of imagining. The flip side of that is that THEY (the skeptics, the know-it-all brother-in-laws) are not special, not unique and definitely not gifted. You have all been handed a cross to bear. I firmly believe that there is a reason why YOU have been singled out. You need to find what that reason is for yourself. Once you find it, then it won't matter if the whole world thinks you're nuts. You'll still be ok. If you don't find it, you'll always be lost.

And finally, women. I'm going to be sexist here, but what I am about to say is obvious to us older guys. Women are not men. Again. Women are not men. They don't think the same as men, they don't feel the same as men, and they don't do the same as men. With a few exceptions (quite a few here, actually) women are detail-oriented, not big picture thinkers. PO is about as 'big picture' as it is possible to get. Just as above, you DON'T have the right to force them to think the same way you do. And furthermore, if they did, you would be heartily disappointed, I assure you

What you do have the right to do is to find someone (man or woman) as a partner who ACCEPTS what you are about to do. Acceptance is not the same thing as (total) agreement. A woman who is mildly skeptical about your plans is one of the best assets you can ever hope to have, She will keep you focused and grounded and rational. On the other hand one who thinks you are full of crapola about PO will be the worst enemy you could ever hope for. May I humbly suggest, that if you are looking for someone tough enough to handle the uncertain future, someone old-fashioned enough to put up with you, that you look outside the USA for your mate.

If you want others to be open-minded, maybe you should start with opening your own mind first.

[Ayoob]

Hubbert,

You are on the money. My girl is on the same page as me, collecting books about log cabin living, reading up on square foot gardening, all that stuff. She's completely down to do this with me.

She even realizes I'm going to be broke for the next four or five years while I get my nursing credentials together.

She doesn't care. She just wants to make a little home for the two of us out in the clean, cold air. I can't believe my luck. Seriously, I can't believe how incredibly lucky I am.

If she wasn't down, she'd be history. There's no way I'd drag a girl through this life unless it was what she wanted. Case in point, my sister. There's no way in hell she'd head for the sticks. She'll find a rich guy somewhere who will try to buy their way out of the crisis.

You know what's funny? People in their 60's and 70's know all about this. They see it coming and know what's going to happen. It's the younger couples with kids that are the most resistant to the idea. At least that's my opinion.

[Schneider]

Hmm,i think you're wrong,not all the old one's think this way ..

Many (well,a lot) of them have watch the birth of,planes, the radio,the Tv,the "Green revolution",the oil empire and his marvels..Most of thoses i know think technology is amazing and can resolve almost anything !!!

Okay,this one is a easy shot but can't refrain myself,let's talk about the "Baby-Boomers" (by the way,i'm 25 years).. Here are the facts : they have wasted much of the environment,wasted much of the oil/gaz and many of them are are "selfish"..

Why Schneider feel the Baby-Boomers are "selfish" !? Because almost each fuc***g time ask one of them about the mess we are in,they respond the typical same answer :

_I_WILL_NOT_BE_THERE_TO_SEE_IT_WHILE_I'M_ALIVE_!_

Okay i admit it again,it's like shooting fish in a barrel..Even the one's at 35-45 years think the same..Under 35 years,we think about the baby,how it's difficult to pay the bills ,are thinking about our student dept or just dreaming of a good job and the future !

Most of the time,young people's are optimist after all,it may explain why _we_ ,young people, DON'T WANT TO EAR THE TRUE !? Under 20,sadly,they just don't really care (yet?)..

For your girl : be sure of one thing,you don't know how much i may envy you my friend ! You're amazingly lucky ..Man,i wish i could have a girlfriend like this (don't have any,duh..) !

Kind of hard for me to take a girl with me anyway..Witch women today would want a man who always think TEOTWAWKI is coming and say to you something like this :

"Sorry honey,forget all you may have learn about your future,your life,your work,your dreams of the marvelous _two cars/house in suburb/kids/lot of cash/shopping like no tomorrow_ package ! All this is screwed ! We will face a economic meltdown sooner than later who may very well make the 1929 Great Depression look like a picnic in the backyard..And only after this,we will face the REAL TROUBLES !

You (my sweet candy) and i may very well die of starvation while a massive DieOff....and forget about the pill and the soap,sorry Honeey! Please,don't shoot or leave me ! I'm only the messenger..."

Well,duuh isn't !??
And i could continue like this for 3-4 hours

Schneider
French-Canadian

[entropyfails]

I feel glad to see all of this heartfelt emotion on this subject. It seems that many of you stopped accepting your “programmingâ€

[Guest]

About the 60's : Yeah,too bad the ones who wanted to fight the system have finish to be part of it (and at such level,yike !).

About the matrix : again,you're right..they just can't see beyond the limits the system have "programed" in them ! Too hard and need to make a dangerous step out of the rank. Human are so conservative and pack minded !

Time left : Many years !? Could you say why ? I feel we will have a economic meltdown very soon,this may make impossible to prepare enough when the crisis will hit ..

In a way,i do not fear a lot "peak oil" but can't stop to watch the abyss of death and suffering humanity is about to face,poor bastards we are !

What i fear the most is that i might not have the time to prepare myself and i fear how the inhabitants of the "matrix" will react to the destruction of their inflated "environment" ..

History show how react most human beings in such dramatic event (once gain,poor bastards we are) ...


Schneider
French-Canadian

[k_semler]

[quote="entropyfails"]
If you choose the first path, then you HAVE to educate your family, even if it means emotional debates and even estrangement. You HAVE to because you have a genetic imperative to do this. You simply must protect your family. You have a perhaps a few years before the worst of the effects begin to show themselves and families have a lot of resources. Help them build their boats so they can make it to shore.
[quote]
What does it matter to my specific genetic sequence if my family is informed, and has a better chance of survival? I do not ever intend to breed with members of my family, as I view inbreeding as sick, wrong, and disgusting. Also products of incest are generally retarded. Considering that I never intend to produce offspring by any person, what consequence would my genetic code have whether I informed them or not? Having children is a negative investment. No matter how much I invest in the sustenance of that child, it is money better spent elsewhere. What other investment would cost over $100,000 during an 18 year period, and return no profit? Children are a negative ROI. If I put that $100,000 in an IRA, I would have a nice retirement fund. Wasting my funds on a child, (or children), I see no return on my funds spent. Might as well have just burnt my money, and I would have had the same economic return.

My specific genetic sequence is an evolutionary dead end due to the choice that I have made never to have offspring. I prefer to let them die happy, than prepare for an unknown future with unknown consequences such as I have been doing. Such preparation may not even ensure my survival through the down slide. For all I know, it could be TEOTWAWKI, or just a small bump on the long road to becoming a space-faring civilization. (Although I will bet you a dollar to a dough nut that it will be closer to TEOTWAWKI).

[quote="entropyfails"]As for potential partners, you need to have complete honesty with them and they have to want to share in the suffering with you or you will not have the ability to change your life enough. So if “Peak Oilâ€

[k_semler]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('entropyfails', ' ')
If you choose the first path, then you HAVE to educate your family, even if it means emotional debates and even estrangement. You HAVE to because you have a genetic imperative to do this. You simply must protect your family. You have a perhaps a few years before the worst of the effects begin to show themselves and families have a lot of resources. Help them build their boats so they can make it to shore.

[Guest]

"Look around you and what do you see? Doctors, lawyers, teachers. Most of them are not yet ready to be unplugged. Many of them are so hopelessly dependant on the system that they will fight to defend it."

-Morpheus, from The Matrix

[giengreen]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')hen I am old, I honestly feel that I will be looking for wooden pencils to burn for warmth, not living in some lap of luxury down in Florida

[entropyfails]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('k_semler', '
')What does it matter to my specific genetic sequence if my family is informed, and has a better chance of survival? I do not ever intend to

[Whitecrab]

One thing I always find interesting is talking with the hydrogen proponents. I'm in university, so I mean talking with grad stuents and professors who make it their career to be fuel cell experts. They seem to just hope that they can hammer things out in the next 10-20 years, that they are "fighting the good fight," and that nuclear or wind or something will make the H2. They act (correctly?) like the price of oil will force people to use H2, and that it's other people's job to get the electricity/methane/alcohol/whatever to make the hydrogen. Even the people with broader energy interests don't seem too aware, or too worried, that even in a nuclear fantasy land the numbers JUST_DON'T_WORK for an energy solution.

So how does the normal person react? "Oh, that's interesting." And that tends to be it. Unlike other people, though, I've never managed to get a wtf are you thinking? reaction. Guess I always tone things down enough. If someone asks me what I want to do with my life, well, I identify there's this peaking problem and I want to work in X, Y, or Z to "be part of the solution." Guess people write it off as environmentalism or something. Every so often though I do find a kindred spirit; it happens if you don't give up.


My family's been an interesting case. I think I've finally gotten through to my father a bit; he's not going to actually change his lifestyle, but he has mentioned he's going to be stealing energy facts from me for talks he gives occasionally. (He's an engineer in the energy biz). I managed to get my grandfather, who used to work at Shell, to read Matt Savinar's entire book. So sometimes we debate, but he still tells me to go get a job in the oil business and "ignore that biochemicals fad." I've learned to stop ing.


It's interesting to me that people can hear this, get it's a problem, debate it, and then go on with their lives like everything is normal. ...Hey...perhaps that's what it is. Maybe peak oil just gets treated like global warming. Huge problem that "something should be done about," but it's not something an individual can really do to affect or prepare for, right? People just don't make the connect for it to hit their own lives, somehow?