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Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Discussions about the economic and financial ramifications of PEAK OIL

Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby gwmss15 » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 06:22:13

Does anyone know why OIL and pertrol prices are falling so fast in last few weeks.

a month ago the OIL price was around USD$75 per barrel now its around USD$63 per barrel.

Petrol in AUD$ 1.49 per liter a few weeks back now around AUD$ 1.20 per liter

does this means peak oil is over or delayed for a long time

or is this something more?
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby waegari » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 07:03:04

They seem to be moving upward again: Bloomberg

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'O')il prices rose in New York, reversing seven days of losses, amid signs that OPEC will try to keep prices above $60 a barrel.


The only way for peak oil to be over is things getting worse, btw. Downward slope, you know.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby Carlhole » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 08:02:36

I would say that that the oil price decline of late has been largely due to:

(1) A slowing of the US and (probably) world economic growth somewhat. This creates larger inventories, at least until the next spate of rapid growth.

(2) The Iranians have caved somewhat to demands to halt their nuclear enrichment process and some of the fear factor has been driven out of the price per barrel.

(3) The hurricane season does not look remotely as threatening as last year's cycle.

(4) US summer driving season is ending.

(5) Hoarding of oil and contracts had been a brief phenomenon earlier in the season. That appears to be at an end for now, creating selling pressure.

(6) Speculation and hedge-fund involvement has always been an oft-cited factor in recent prices. Profit-taking could easily be part of the recent price drop.

(7) News of the GOM discovery may have allayed fears regarding the lack of large new discoveries and that could have effected the market-price, somewhat although anyone who reads in detail about the GOM prospects should not feel very comfortable about that 15 billion barrel figure being thrown around not the ease with which even a fraction of that amount can be extracted.

(8.) And lastly, perhaps with more far reaching effects, Vladimir Putin has made it clear to leaderships all over the world that Russia is interested in establishing long term forward contracts with all countries for its oil and natural gas resources. He wants to establish a high degreee of stability in energy markets worldwide and wants Russia to benefit from that stability as one of the world's great energy exporters.

Russia's low-key hand in this game probably has had a big influence on Iran's decision to take a more accomodating stance with the US over its nuclear program. If Russia had played that Iran card more wickedly, who knows what havoc might have been wreaked in the region just below its southern border.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby DantesPeak » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 09:37:34

All the above reasons are valid. Keep in mind that depsite what we are told daily in business news reports, it is not impossible for the US economy (and others follwing along) to suddenly start falling much faster than almost anyone expects.

The reason why this could happen is because of the way the US eocnomy - plus others - rely heavily on the creation of new debt and the stability of the US dollar.

No doubt that slower economic growth will reduce the price of energy at first. However the Fed, etc., will later increase the money supply and push the price of oil back up - even in the middle of a recession. This has been US government policy since 1932 and I don't expect it to change.

If the US is not going into a recession, I would epxect the price of oil to bounce back very soon.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby nth » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 11:33:38

The key reason prices are falling is that there are more supplies than demand when oil prices go up to $70+ during this time of the year when US gasoline consumption drops. Oil demand has always been seasonal. Last year, we had major oil production disruptions that made oil prices go way up. We are still waiting for that disruption.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby aahala » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 11:41:00

An even more puzzling decline is US gas pump prices.

A few weeks ago, when crude was about $74, the price here
was about $3.00, now it's $2.29. Some of the decline is
understandable and some of it ain't.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby gwmss15 » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 11:50:55

Is it possiable at some point the future the price of oil may come under price level controll rules. say around USD$80 to USD$100 a barrel and the NYMEX exchange closed down as the price would be fixed to keep it under control and the govts taking more control over reserves and the profits ie taxing it much higher to pay for post peak oil transision programs to reduced the effects on the total economy ie minimise the worst of a recession.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby DantesPeak » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 12:19:20

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gwmss15', 'I')s it possiable at some point the future the price of oil may come under price level controll rules. say around USD$80 to USD$100 a barrel and the NYMEX exchange closed down as the price would be fixed to keep it under control and the govts taking more control over reserves and the profits ie taxing it much higher to pay for post peak oil transision programs to reduced the effects on the total economy ie minimise the worst of a recession.


I only understand the US government, and yes it would seize control of the oil market in a crisis. But $80 or even $100 may not be an important price - if there is no major world crisis at the same time. However if tommorrow war started with Iran, the NYMEX likely would be shut - or at least restricted with the US. The government may not have the legal authority to stop trading outside of the US by US citizens or companies.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby coyote » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 13:52:42

Price volatility, guys. Up and down. We expected this.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby WildRose » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 14:05:39

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('coyote', 'P')rice volatility, guys. Up and down. We expected this.


I was thinking the same thing. Price volatility, as the peak oil authors have explained, is one of the indicators of peak oil, correct?
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby Concerned » Wed 13 Sep 2006, 14:42:02

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('WildRose', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('coyote', 'P')rice volatility, guys. Up and down. We expected this.


I was thinking the same thing. Price volatility, as the peak oil authors have explained, is one of the indicators of peak oil, correct?


I have not heard this particular point emphasised, most Peak Oil authors I know of tend to focus on the geology and finite nature of the resource.

Certainly volatility is an issue as there is no spare capacity as you approach the upper boundary of global demand.

2007-2008 there are new oil fields coming on line. The potential for US housing bubble to pop or retreat triggering a mini recession. These events if true will exert downward pressure on oil prices.

With continued global growth and the new oil fields unable to replace current and future depletion look for 2010 and 2012 to be watershed years in the Peak Oil debate.

Im surprised by how many people think peak oil was the recent price of $75 per BBL . That price was just a symptom of whats to come IMO.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby Temperedoil » Sat 16 Sep 2006, 11:23:41

We can expect the recent drop in the price of oil to be a short-lived phenomenon, and it is worth noting that the price of oil as it stands is still high by historical standards.

The recent fall is suggestive of a market which is reacting to any and all news relating to the supply/demand equation. Considering that the US government is still pressing for sanctions against Iran, that Saudi Arabia and Kuwait have both announced their largest oil fields to be in decline, that even analysts and industry insiders dismissive of Peak Oil are suggesting that the recent Gulf of Mexico is not enough to make any appreciable difference on its own on a long term basis, and that Russia's potential to continue to export large quantities of oil beyond 2010 may be doubtful, the recent fall in the price of oil may be considered more of a breather than an indication of things to come. Particularly if that drop leads to a return to the increases in demand that we have seen in recent years.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby DigitalCubano » Sat 16 Sep 2006, 11:34:06

Why ask questions? Gas is cheaper. Egro, its inevitable that you use more of it now. Jevon's Paradox demands it. Chop, chop! Get moving!
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby rwwff » Sat 16 Sep 2006, 12:41:43

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('DigitalCubano', 'W')hy ask questions? Gas is cheaper. Egro, its inevitable that you use more of it now. Jevon's Paradox demands it. Chop, chop! Get moving!


But Keystone doesn't have any snow yet!! I don't want to go up there if theres no snow.

We don't use much petroleum down here to generate electricity, so making the A/C colder won't help. Hmmmmmm.

I've been thinking of getting a chipper/shredder, but they don't use much gas. I hate jetskis.. My cars are in too good of shape to get rid of and buy a Hummer.

Suggestions?
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby BrownDog » Sat 16 Sep 2006, 12:52:25

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('aahala', 'A')n even more puzzling decline is US gas pump prices.

A few weeks ago, when crude was about $74, the price here
was about $3.00, now it's $2.29. Some of the decline is
understandable and some of it ain't.

I've noticed this as well. This seems to me to support (at least somewhat) that there could be demand destruction at the retail gasoline level.
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Re: Why are OIL and petrol prices falling fast

Unread postby budeone » Tue 19 Sep 2006, 09:52:44

What about that there are elections coming up...
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