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Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil field

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Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil field

Unread postby lorenzo » Fri 01 Sep 2006, 19:41:51

This snippet is cute:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')ang says that the Yangtze River valley [picture], which is the world's largest rape production base with nearly one third of the world's entire rape yield, has the potential to produce 40 million tons of bio-diesel per year (770,000 barrels per day), equaling the oil output of one and a half Daqing oilfields (China's largest, and the fourth largest in the world).


That's quite a lot of biodiesel, if you ask me. More than China's biggest oil field...

Comes from an article about China just having bred a rapeseed crop with record oil yields, for biodiesel.

http://biopact.com/2006/08/china-breeds ... -high.html

What's the state of Daqing? Is it in decline?

On the other hand, 770,000 bpd is not that much, only 15% of China's total oil consumption (some will say).
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby TheTurtle » Fri 01 Sep 2006, 22:02:49

Of course then you must consider the fact that the Yangtze's water level is falling.$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')The level is the second lowest since hydrologic records for this section of the river began in 1865." [url=http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2006-08/25/content_674736.htm]
China Daily article[/url]
and that, in fact, the Yangtze is suffering a rare drought in the midst of flood season.

China.org.cn

Biodiesel alternatives sound lovely to the uninformed, but every such attempt has far-reaching environmental impact.

Rape is an appropriate plant to be growing, I suppose.
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby lorenzo » Fri 01 Sep 2006, 22:13:08

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TheTurtle', 'O')f course then you must consider the fact that the Yangtze's water level is falling.$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '"')The level is the second lowest since hydrologic records for this section of the river began in 1865." [url=http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/china/2006-08/25/content_674736.htm]
China Daily article[/url]
and that, in fact, the Yangtze is suffering a rare drought in the midst of flood season.

China.org.cn

Biodiesel alternatives sound lovely to the uninformed, but every such attempt has far-reaching environmental impact.

Rape is an appropriate plant to be growing, I suppose.


True, but you grow rapeseed precisely to fight some of the problems you mention.

The Yangtze's drought is probably due to global warming (just like the exceptional Amazon drought and the exceptional Zaire drought, and the exceptional Europe drought and the exceptional US drought of recent times.)

Biofuels are one of the few means we have to fight climate change.

And in the specific case of the Yangtze, they're excellent to fight the huge problem of erosion, that cloggs up the river. Planting biofuels there is really beneficial in many ways.

I'm not saying biofuels will solve all problems at once, but they're one of the few means we have to grab in order to solve some of the world's major problems (like poverty, climate change, lack of fair trade, oil substitution, lack of investment in agriculture in the global South, environmental problems like erosion, soil depletion, etc.... on all these fronts, biofuels can contribute their bit.)
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby frankthetank » Fri 01 Sep 2006, 22:49:36

I see the work in the Amazon is going well...

August 24, 2006 (Should be an interesting comparison pic in say 20 years...?)
Image

Amazon Fires

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I')n the top part of the image, fires are burning intensely along the margins of large, tan-colored clearings that people have made in the Amazon Rainforest. The fires along the edges of the clearing may be fires set intentionally to clear new areas of rainforest for farming or ranching, or they may be accidental fires that escaped from people’s control on established agricultural lands.

In the center of the scene, the deep green of the Amazon transitions to a deep brown color. This region is known as the Gran Chaco, a dry, hot region of open woodland and grassland. Unlike the Amazon, this region is prone to naturally occurring fires, but the widespread nature of the fires and their location along clearings and roads suggests that many could be human-caused.


However, there is still plent left to burn. Its good to see. I'm glad that people are willing to make the effort to cut down every last square mile of forest to grow soybeans/corn/sugar so people can drive to the store to buy junk :)
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby lorenzo » Sat 02 Sep 2006, 16:07:51

Could you also please post a satellite map showing the huge rainforests in the Yangtze valley?

If not, I suggest you stop this intellectually dishonest propaganda.
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 02 Sep 2006, 16:30:29

I thought they were going to cut down the Yantze forests to plant rapeseed....

You can't have both, lorenzo, not in the same place. You can't have rapeseed fields and rainforest in the same land area. So which is it to be? Rainforests, or biofuel plantations?
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby lorenzo » Sat 02 Sep 2006, 17:59:35

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ludi', 'I') thought they were going to cut down the Yantze forests to plant rapeseed....

You can't have both, lorenzo, not in the same place. You can't have rapeseed fields and rainforest in the same land area. So which is it to be? Rainforests, or biofuel plantations?


See, this kind of posts really explains why people think Peak Oil fanatics are really crazy, or simply not very intelligent.

There are no forests in the Yangtze valley. That's the whole point.

Whenever I talk about biofuels that can be planted in the desert or in some place where there are no forests, - you peak oil lot come up with tropical rainforests that have nothing to do with biofuels.

That's why I kindly asked the poster to stop his intellectual dishonesty.

But then you come in, showing you don't have the vaguest clue what you're talking about.


Moreover, had you read the article, you would have learned that
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', '
')If grown in high altitude regions, such as West China's Qinghai Province, it was two to three percentage points higher in oil content, the ministry said.


You would then have looked up "Qinghai Province", and you would have learned that there are no forests there either. The average elevation of Qinghai province is 3000 metres above sea level.

This is Qinghai:
http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&z=11&ll ... 4&t=k&om=0

Not a single tree there.

Do you really think Chinese scientists are total idiots?



Djee, sometimes I really begin to doubt the intellectual capacities of Mr Peak Oil Average.
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby NEOPO » Sat 02 Sep 2006, 18:07:52

I wonder why there is no forest..........

Whoa!!!!

Sorry I just realized that I had hands and was frightened momentarily. ;-)
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby Ludi » Sat 02 Sep 2006, 18:14:37

Lorenzo, I certainly hope no one is evaluating po.com based on my posts.

Happy to see you spent a nice chunk of your time replying to me. :)

You don't seem to understand the point of my post, however, but I won't explain it to you. Others may understand it. Or not.


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'I') wonder why there is no forest..........


in a region which should be forested.......

'China at the dawn of history was much warmer and wetter than it is today, with elephants, rhinoceroses and crocodiles living north of the Yangtze River. Five or six thousand years of cutting forests and draining marshes have changed the climate to the point where the landscape has been devastated. China has the highest ratio of actual to potential desertified land in the world, according to the World Bank. ...Since 1949, two-thirds of the Yangtze Valley lakes have disappeared as more and more land has been reclaimed. The total surface area of lakes in the middle and lower Yangtze Valley has shrunk from 18,000 square kilometers to 7,000 in just 50 years.

So much topsoil is swept downstream - 700 million tonnes during the 1998 summer floods - that both reservoirs and lakes are silting up so quickly their capacity to contain the floodwaters is declining rapidly. The storage volume of these lakes has fallen by 8 billion cubic meters. Dongting Lake, the second-largest in China, has decreased by about 50 square kilometers to almost half what it was before 1949. And it has silted up too, becoming more and more shallow. The lake bed has been rising by 3.7 centimeters a year and about 100 million cubic meters of silt has been deposited.

The sheer pointlessness of the vast investment in dam building was brought home by the 1998 floods, which killed 4,000 people and cost the economy $36 billion. The dams have done nothing to stop the floods, which have been increasing in frequency and severity. Even the Three Gorges Dam, big though it is, will make no practical difference. '

http://www.atimes.com/atimes/China/EH26Ad01.html
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby frankthetank » Sat 02 Sep 2006, 20:50:06

I just post the truth... Get over it.
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby Concerned » Sat 02 Sep 2006, 21:13:10

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lorenzo', 'T')his snippet is cute:

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'W')ang says that the Yangtze River valley [picture], which is the world's largest rape production base with nearly one third of the world's entire rape yield, has the potential to produce 40 million tons of bio-diesel per year (770,000 barrels per day), equaling the oil output of one and a half Daqing oilfields (China's largest, and the fourth largest in the world).


That's quite a lot of biodiesel, if you ask me. More than China's biggest oil field...


ROFLMAO I just love this. Ok. Keywords in the snippet. has the potential These are three very important words.

Of course the big difference is that China's largest oil field is actually producing 500K BPD oil, live on line energy now.

So when the bio diesel reaches 10%, 20%, 50% of todays current production be sure to let us know.

There is also the potential for world peace, an end to starvation, stabilizing our population, industrialising with reduced environmental impacts, massively lowering throw away garbage creating consumption etc..

Solar, wind, TDP, breeder reactors et el... also have the potential

We need to see significant realization of this untapped potential which was one of the major impediments the Hirsch report identified in being able to successfully mitigate Peak Oil for all humanity.
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby BrownDog » Sat 02 Sep 2006, 21:58:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('lorenzo', 'I')'m not saying biofuels will solve all problems at once, but they're one of the few means we have to grab in order to solve some of the world's major problems (like poverty, climate change, lack of fair trade, oil substitution, lack of investment in agriculture in the global South, environmental problems like erosion, soil depletion, etc.... on all these fronts, biofuels can contribute their bit.)

This is the closest I've seen you come to addressing soil depletion. But you've reversed the effect of such schemes. Biofuels will worsen, not improve, soil depletion.
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Re: Yangtze valley rapeseed to yield 1.5 times Daqing oil fi

Unread postby NEOPO » Sun 03 Sep 2006, 00:32:37

Maybe the tree's uprooted and ran away!!!

Wonder if this will phase him? nahhhhhh ;-)
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