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$300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

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$300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby Prince » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 17:12:44

This can't be right, can it? I guess it's all speculation based on the recent heatwave, but the price seemed to triple today.

http://www.bloomberg.com/energy/
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby gnm » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 17:17:58

OMG that has to be incorrect right?, RIGHT? Electricity has hovered in the 50-90 range and now its showing almost 300!?

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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby mekrob » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 17:18:56

Holy F*(^! That can't be right...There's no reason for it to be so sudden. I can understand over the past week, but in one day? 100% jump was the smallest.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby sch_peakoiler » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 17:32:18

In europe the peak was at EUR 390 / MWh. And that IS USD 500

a link from www.oelgipfel.de , our gerrrman friends, so all of you Achtung!

http://www.eex.de/index.php?session=888 ... 112&params[5

The reason in Europe seems to be a recent powerdown on some nuclear power plants due to high temps. NPPs are not allowed to heat the water in rivers beyond a certain mark (25 degrees centigrade) so some of them had to be partially powered down to prevent this heating pollution. This powerdown is of course enhanced by growing consumption, caused by the same reason - the heat :) Double strike.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby Fergus » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 17:50:25

How soon before that starts showing up on our bills?
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby sch_peakoiler » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 17:53:49

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Fergus', 'H')ow soon before that starts showing up on our bills?



chances are it does not show at all, if the spike is really short. The exchange is a way to get extra electricity for those who could not plan in advance or got some "accident". It is not necessary that your utility company had to buy at that price. But if this spike holds, then ....
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby NTBKtrader » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 18:00:17

this happened in the UK a week ago, does anyone know if it held?

Electricity prices trebled on Tuesday, prompting idle power stations to start operating after the unusually hot weather led to shortages of power in the UK.

Soaring temperatures led to a rise in demand for electricity to power air conditioners and refrigerators, but at the same time several power stations were out of action for repair work.

https://registration.ft.com/registratio ... e2340.html

http://www.lse.co.uk/FinanceNews.asp?sh ... es__report
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby abelardlindsay » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 22:46:07

That's the meaning of a steep demand curve. Maybe peak oil will show up that way too, with an overnight doubling of gas prices.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby rogerhb » Mon 24 Jul 2006, 23:55:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('abelardlindsay', 'T')hat's the meaning of a steep demand curve. Maybe peak oil will show up that way too, with an overnight doubling of gas prices.


Electricity is demanded at the flick of a switch (literally), I don't think the oil prices will go quite as sharply. However natural gas might.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby SILENTTODD » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 00:47:26

And here I thought Ken Lay (ENRON) was dead and burning in hell!
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby perdition79 » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 03:55:45

Sure, it's a bit of a spike, but it doesn't seem too extreme. That's the west coast spot price, and power demand is expected to be 52,000 megawatts, a peak that wasn't supposed to be reached until 2011.

http://www.nytimes.com/2006/07/23/books/review/24cnd-heat.html?ei=5065&en=420f6383586b777d&ex=1154404800&partner=MYWAY&pagewanted=print
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby dbarberic » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 08:45:05

Can someone who knows the ratio of MWH to KWH, convert the price to KWH? I know that in NE Ohio we pay about $0.12 per KWH. Because the price is quoted in MWH, I have no basis to say if this is very expensive electricity or not.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby pedalling_faster » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 09:12:53

that's 30 cents a kilowatt-hour.

last time i was in Canada it was 6 cents a kilowatt-hour.

in San Diego the rates seem to range from 10 to 20 cents a kilowatt hour, if you use less the rate is lower.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 09:16:00

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dbarberic', 'C')an someone who knows the ratio of MWH to KWH, convert the price to KWH? I know that in NE Ohio we pay about $0.12 per KWH. Because the price is quoted in MWH, I have no basis to say if this is very expensive electricity or not.


1 MW=1000KW
1MWH=1000KWH

I suggestst, you learn your BASIC physics and maths FAST.
It may be a useful skill in post PO world.
You know, insurance will not sell well this time and lawyers & and property traders are MOST UNLIKELY to be needed.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby J-Rod » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 10:26:04

[url=http://]Web Page Name[/url] is your friend. Use it, love it.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby aahala » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 10:35:42

There were a wide range of figures reported concerning the
highest price paid for electricity during the 2001 California
crisis. As I recall, the top was confirmed to have been nearly
$3,900 MW.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby jdmartin » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 11:05:53

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('EnergyUnlimited', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dbarberic', 'C')an someone who knows the ratio of MWH to KWH, convert the price to KWH? I know that in NE Ohio we pay about $0.12 per KWH. Because the price is quoted in MWH, I have no basis to say if this is very expensive electricity or not.


1 MW=1000KW
1MWH=1000KWH

I suggestst, you learn your BASIC physics and maths FAST.
It may be a useful skill in post PO world.
You know, insurance will not sell well this time and lawyers & and property traders are MOST UNLIKELY to be needed.


How incredibly rude. The poster asked a question that could be answered quickly, without the added commentary. Isn't it possible for us to speak about peak oil issues without exposing ourselves as blatant assholes?
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby grabby » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 15:55:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('dbarberic', 'C')an someone who knows the ratio of MWH to KWH, convert the price to KWH? I know that in NE Ohio we pay about $0.12 per KWH. Because the price is quoted in MWH, I have no basis to say if this is very expensive electricity or not.


a megawatt hour is the same energy in one barrel of oil. 42 gallons

it is 1000 kilowatt hours

so 12 cent kilowatt hours is 120 dollars per megawatt.
1 megawatt is the same as a barrel of oil, but they use inefficient heating from oil at arouod 33 % so that is why the price is more.


300 dollar per megawatt is about the same as 100 dollar a barrel of oil.
Last edited by grabby on Tue 25 Jul 2006, 15:58:39, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby shortonoil » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 15:56:29

1 MW=1000KW
1MWH=1000KWH

A watt is a measure of energy; like a joule or a calorie.
A watt- hour is a measure of work; like horse power

You can convert from Watt-hours to Watts by dividing by the number of hours. Example: 3600 watt-hours is the result of using 3600 watts for 1 hour, or the result of using 1 watt for 3600 hours .
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Re: $300+ for a MW hr of electricity!!!...?

Unread postby gnm » Tue 25 Jul 2006, 16:10:11

Does anyone know why those prices have remained static today (at least on bloomberg) - no motion at all...

edit - oops spoke too soon - major drops now... But still up there compared to last week....

-G
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