[hmbjeff]

Like many, I have been looking for ways to shelter some of my meager funds against Dollar instability. One way is to buy gold. Coins are one option, but a bullion account might be cheaper and more flexible. I found an interesting internet-based company called Gold Money.

According to their website:$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'G')oldMoney is like online banking, but your account is denominated in goldgrams and mils, not dollars and cents. Plus you can use GoldMoney as currency easily and inexpensively by 'clicking' goldgrams from your account to someone else. Or just as easily, you can convert those goldgrams at the prevailing spot price into US dollars, Canadian dollars, euros or British pounds, which are the four currencies we presently accept.
Each GoldMoney goldgram® is held for you in allocated storage in an insured vault in London, England. When you buy goldgrams, you own pure gold in a secure vault.

[marek]

You might consider http://www.kitco.com as an alternative since they operate in the U.S. and Canada.

[tdrive]

If you really want to shelter your money, buy gold coins,
and put them in a safe deposit box.
Don't get suckered into anything like that web gold whachamacalit.

Cheers,

[rerere]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('hmbjeff', 'O')ne way is to buy gold. Coins are one option

[gonin02]

I think goldmoney is more like a service you can use to keep your savings in 'electronic gold' instead of USD or other paper assets. You're able to make payments and send small amounts to other ppl/groups. You can convert your e-gold to physical form from goldmoney, assuming you have enough for a good delivery bar (400 ounces).

There is no substitute for owning the physical metal... A few of these "electronic gold" sites have shut down, and although James Turk (goldmoney founder) is a well-regarded figure in the gold community, I would still opt to get physical gold before anything else... I believe he's even advocated owning physical

As it happens, a new gold ETF is supposed to start trading on the NYSE this week. Each share will be 1/10th an ounce of gold...

[hmbjeff]

Thanks for the good insights. I do plan to buy some coins.

I also found what looks like a better option for buying "institutional gold". The Canadian Central Fund, which trades as a stock on AMEX (symbol CEF) but keeps 98% of its assets in unecumbered gold bullion held in vaults in Toronto. They have been operating since 1961. This seems to remove much of the risk of fly-by-night offshore operators.

Anybody know what are the downsides of this kind outfit? Would it be advantageous to wait for the launch of the new ETF on the NYSE (which I think is called Equity Gold Trust, and whose ticker apparently will be GLD)?

[jimmyc]

I have made regular deposits to goldmoney.com for the past year. James Turk, the founder, has a lot of respectability in my opinion and really understands gold's function as a currency. In addition, I have had really good customer service. On at least three occasions, I have had questions about whether a payment was received or what documentation I needed to provide, etc., and they always respond right away.
It's very easy to buy gold there, using an electronic check. I plan to continue accumulating gold there as long as it is under $500.
Financialsense.com has an archived interview with James Turk. He also has good commentaries posted on goldmoney.

[jimmyc]

Just as a follow-up. The gold is actually stored in a warehouse. It's not "paper gold." It's allocated to you. As far as the web servers going down, sure that could happen. But wouldn't that type of calamity also affect banks to a large degree? I agree it's a concern, but I would be much more worried about not being in gold at all.

[Horace]

Wow, just yesterday I called my local bank and reserved a safe deposit box, with the idea of storing gold coins there. And then I read your post. Great minds....

I don't have any knowledge of goldmoney.com, but from jimmyc's replies they seem reputable.

However, there's something more secure to me in knowing that I can go to a local bank directly and, with a key in hand, access my own coins.

[KiddieKorral]

I agree. If/when TSHTF, I'd rather have gold in my hands than have it in a computerized account.

[smiley]

Some words of advice on silver certificates:

http://www.investmentrarities.com/11-15-04.html

[Madpaddy]

I wouldn't even trust the Deposit Box in the bank if TSHTF. In Argentina after the crash the banks would not let peiple get money out of their own accounts. Buy a strongbox and store it at home.

[jimmyc]

I agree with those urging you to store the coins at home rather than at a bank. If you had your gold in a bank in the '30s, you lost it. If you had it at home, you didn't (no house to house searches). I know it's a pain to find a hiding place, but that's really the best thing. I have purchased coins through a company called California Neumismatic Investments. Their web site is www.golddealer.com. They ship them UPS, free shipping on orders over $1,000, I believe.

[gonin02]

True, but when India and China encourage its citizens to own gold I'm not totally convinced that North America will ban it... even then you can't stop ownership.. when gold was banned from ownership in the USA, many Americans purchased the metal abroad. I think the law was changed in 61 to ban gold ownership internationally... a symbolic gesture

Also, I've heard that although gold ownership was officailly banned, many people just kept their coins and bars and what not... they refused to submit them to the authorities.. And why the heck not? I sure as hell woudln't want to give away my assets like that, esp after FDR revalued gold from 28 to 35 dollars.... so not only did they take the gold, they valued it upwards after they confiscated it away!

Banning something will not work... people always find a way aroudn the system. Did prohibition end consumption of alcohol? Nope..

If you don't want to put all your eggs in one basket, may I suggest storing silver/gold in several places... home, bank, another place that no one will know about..etc..

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Madpaddy', 'I') wouldn't even trust the Deposit Box in the bank if TSHTF. In Argentina after the crash the banks would not let peiple get money out of their own accounts. Buy a strongbox and store it at home.

[sventvkg]

Where does the Government get the authority to take people's Gold in the constitution? Do not give up your assets to the Facists..They can not make you! National Security my ass...The took the gold so the 12 families that privately own the Federal Reserve who created our Fiat Currency out of thin air, could take control of the REAL $$ (constitution states this), and ship it all off to their vaults in Europe. I would really look into all this if I were all of you.

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('gonin02', 'T')rue, but when India and China encourage its citizens to own gold I'm not totally convinced that North America will ban it... even then you can't stop ownership.. when gold was banned from ownership in the USA, many Americans purchased the metal abroad. I think the law was changed in 61 to ban gold ownership internationally... a symbolic gesture

Also, I've heard that although gold ownership was officailly banned, many people just kept their coins and bars and what not... they refused to submit them to the authorities.. And why the heck not? I sure as hell woudln't want to give away my assets like that, esp after FDR revalued gold from 28 to 35 dollars.... so not only did they take the gold, they valued it upwards after they confiscated it away!

Banning something will not work... people always find a way aroudn the system. Did prohibition end consumption of alcohol? Nope..

If you don't want to put all your eggs in one basket, may I suggest storing silver/gold in several places... home, bank, another place that no one will know about..etc..

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Madpaddy', 'I') wouldn't even trust the Deposit Box in the bank if TSHTF. In Argentina after the crash the banks would not let peiple get money out of their own accounts. Buy a strongbox and store it at home.

[Madpaddy]

They can try and seize my gold from my home if they like. I might have a little surprise for them though.

As GWB says. "Bring em on"

[Chicagoan]

Gold is already quite high. Platnum will go up if people try to turn to fuel cells. Silver is used in electronics, including solar technology. And renewable energy stocks will probably go up, but I would not bet my life on it.

[jimmyc]

Sventkvg is quite correct. I urge everyone to investigate the history of our monetary system. As sventkvg points out, our system was basically usurped, a bloodless coup of sorts, when we created the Federal Reserve. The shareholders of the Fed are a select group of some of the oldest and largest banks in the world, many foreign. These banks, in turn, are essentially controlled/owned by a relatively small group of elites. Read Creature from Jekyll Island for the full story.

[Bewildebeest]

I'm looking for advice on which of these remote vault services to choose. I currently own a modest amount of bullion which I plan to keep at home and/or a safety deposit box, but I'm not well set up for storing more physical bullion myself (e.g., I live in a rental apartment). I know that these vault services have certain risks, but I believe the risk of theft from my own home is significant too, and perhaps greater. Therefore I'm looking to invest in either Goldmoney or BullionVault.com as a way to diversify my holdings (I've also already invested in some ETFs).

Does anyone here have any recommendations or personal experience with these services? I've done some comparing and it looks like Goldmoney would probably have lower fees over time. Although their purchase price is slightly higher, they don't have a storage fee (BullionVault's is 0.12%/year), which could make Goldmoney significantly less expensive especially if holding for 5-10 yrs or more. They also do not have any sell commission, whereas BullionVault does.

BullionVault, however, has the option of using a vault in Zurich. This might be a minor point but I'm thinking Zurich could be safer (e.g., from political risks like confiscation) than London, where Goldmoney's vault is located.

Any other important differences that I may not be aware of?

Most internet reviews I've read have been generally favorable to both, with some usual caveats such as a fear that some have of a secret fractional reserve system (even though both services categorically rule this out).

Has anyone here already looked into these and have some advice?

[Dukat_Reloaded]

I would go with GoldMoney, I like James Turk, he is a good guy and I believe FinancialSense online also recommend GoldMoney. I don't know if the Vault is in london, but it is somewhere in the brittish Isies. James Turk was on the gold roundtable this weekend at finanicalsense.com, I myself perfer to hold physical bullion and also mining stocks, 50/50% ratio.