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Getting quite frightened...

Discussions related to the physiological and psychological effects of peak oil on our members and future generations.

Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 08:55:32

..about the effects of peak oil. I just found out about it, and I've been on such a paranoid trip, I can't even begin to describe. I am sure this is normal, but I don't know what to think recently... what am I going to do? I don't know how to plan my future for this, or if I can do much for the best interest of my friends and loved ones. It's beginning to make me feel sick to my stomach.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby Doly » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 08:58:03

Breathe deeply, calm down, and start realising there is actually a lot of things you can do. The Planning for the Future forum is for people like you.

If you care to explain a little more about your personal circumstances, lots of people here can give you personalised advice.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 09:01:36

Hah, thank you for such a quick reply. I've been restless the past few days thinking about it. I never would have guessed that something like this could happen during my time, but I suppose reality has a way of dealing with a person.

Well, I have been making plans to move to Houston, where I intended on persuing a degree for Audio Engineering. I am not sure if this is for the best now, really. And what's more, I planned on moving in with my girlfriend, who I absolutely love and intend on marrying. Before her, I wouldn't have really been so emotionally affected by this I think, but now all I want is for us to have a secure future together, one we can live in and one our children and future generations can find peace in.

I've just been so down lately about this, and I think I need something to give me hope.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby Ancien_Opus » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 09:11:54

Move to Fort McMurray instead. Get a job with Syncrude. Learn to fish & hunt moose.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby MacG » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 09:14:11

I recognize the reaction. First you get the jolt, then do some frantic reading. Then depression is close. After about 3-12 months it get easier. Then it get really horrible again, but on kind of a deeper nerve.

The possible fallout have the potential to be a terrible mess of suffering and devastation.

What freaks me out the most is all this denial everywhere combined with the historical record of human action in response to shortages. You see, the way we are hardwired by evolution since millions of years, the instinctive reaction upon threatening starvation is to try to kill some competition.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 09:17:18

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Ancien_Opus', 'M')ove to Fort McMurray instead. Get a job with Syncrude. Learn to fish & hunt moose.


I will consider anything as an option, now. But as it stands, plans to move anywhere else don't seem feasible. the only reason I can make it over there is because my girlfriend already has an apartment there. I don't know how we could possibly go anywhere else.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby NeoPeasant » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 09:25:40

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rexxz', '.').about the effects of peak oil. I just found out about it, and I've been on such a paranoid trip, I can't even begin to describe. I am sure this is normal, but I don't know what to think recently... what am I going to do? I don't know how to plan my future for this, or if I can do much for the best interest of my friends and loved ones. It's beginning to make me feel sick to my stomach.


What helped me was the eventual realization that much of what we are likely to lose isn't all that great, and what we may be left with isn't all that bad.
Suggested reading:

"Affluenza" - Does all our stuff really make us happy?
"Suburban Nation" - Does our auto dependent zoned isolation really make us happy?
"Aspalt Nation" - What are the real costs of our system of universal automobility?

There are societies around the world that lead healthier, happier lives than we do with a fraction of the resource consumption. Learn about how they do it.
The battle to preserve our lifestyle has already been lost. The battle to preserve our lives is just beginning.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 09:28:15

I think my largest concern, though, isn't really of losing all of these nice little commodities that my life has to offer right now. My biggest, and worst fear is being unable to even survive in a post-peak oil environment. All I want is to retain some degree of stability, nothing more. And of course to do as much as I possibly can to improve the situation as a whole. But right now, I am not having much hope for this.

I fear that because of my financial situation right now(jobless, 18 years old, no credit, no experience, no education) will only make things so much more worse than they can be.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby Ancien_Opus » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 10:05:19

Why not Fort McMurray? Just read this!

With more than $120 billion worth of capital works projects on the books for the next decade in the public and private sector in Alberta, employers will need to fill 400,000 new jobs by 2010. But even with special programs to employ seniors, aboriginal youth and foreign workers, the provincial government predicts a staggering human-capital deficit of 100,000 people over 10 years. As a result, most industries face worker shortages, inflationary wages or chronic poaching. A January survey by the Canadian Federation of Independent Business found that more than 80% of small-business owners in Alberta have had difficulty finding workers--and that more than half were coping by hiring under-qualified individuals. A third had simply accepted reduced staff as a fact of life. "We not only have a skill shortage," says Sam Shaw, president of Northern Alberta Institute of Technology in Edmonton. "We have a people shortage in Alberta."

From Canadianbusiness.com
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 10:08:45

I can't quite tell if you're being serious or not; please elaborate more?
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby Ancien_Opus » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 10:22:39

There is nothing you can do about the oil supply and demand situation.
Just make the best of skills you have and acquire those skills that will be needed in the future. Alberta offers you the opportunity to work your way through oil depletion and acquire several very useful skills for what comes afterward. If you're frugal you can save enough cash to make it very worthwhile. One young man was quoted recently on 60 minutes as earning $120,000/year. Good money when you consider that the Canadian dollar is darn close to parity with the US dollar.

It really does not matter to you on a personal level that Alberta tar sand will not really change this situation. What does matter is that this energy source can and will be exploited, so you may as well benefit if you are young enough to take advantage of that fact. This development will proceed so you might as well hitch your self to a wagon that will still be functioning in ten years.

You'll not need central A/C in Alberta but the 6 months of winter like weather is pretty rough to deal with.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 10:36:58

Seems reasonable... but since I am so unexperienced in moving out of any sorts, I don't know how I would even begin to go there. For one, I need money to do that, which I have none. And I don't know where I'd go over there! Right now I know I want to move to Houston at least for a short while... What I do after that is completely beyond me though. I just know I want to be the best prepared as I possibly can be.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby NTBKtrader » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 10:46:03

Engineering is a great trade, audio engineering doesn't seem that lucrative nor useful post peak, just my humble opinion. Texas property is cheap especially out west, maybe buy a few acres near a small sustainable town. Acreage is $500 an acre and lower in some areas. The planning forum is a very huge well of knowledge so troll there for info.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 10:51:14

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('NTBKtrader', 'E')ngineering is a great trade, audio engineering doesn't seem that lucrative nor useful post peak, just my humble opinion.


Of course, I realize that now, but these plans of mine were made long before I was aware of PO. Truth is, I don't have much money for college, only what I was left from my father's life insurance when he passed. I'm debating with myself on what to do now, and it's not so easy.

About buying land, I'm sure I could do that sometime, But I am going to need some serious money(or credit) to finance it, it seems. I really don't have that right now, and most likely won't even in 5 years.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby virgincrude » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 10:55:10

Rexxzi, over here I am a day behind you guys. Wonder if that'll make any difference as to when the shit hits? Anyway, just keep reading, eventually your alarm level will subside a bit, but I really can't imagine how I would feel if I were as young as you and just found out about Peak Oil, I just feel for you.

I just can't help wondering, as I read so many posts from people like you (no money, afraid for the future) when Americans will start migrating. At the moment you're building walls against the Mexicans, who will surely arrive in greater numbers now that Cantarelle is depleting so fast. Here in Europe we have boat loads of Sub Saharan Africans arriving at our shores every day. We used to buy them and ship them ourselves, now they come willingly and pay for the trip in even worse conditions than the slavers. And they work in the same slave conditions. Imagine.

Could it soon be boat loads of WASPs?
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 11:02:52

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('virgincrude', 'R')exxzi, over here I am a day behind you guys. Wonder if that'll make any difference as to when the shit hits? Anyway, just keep reading, eventually your alarm level will subside a bit, but I really can't imagine how I would feel if I were as young as you and just found out about Peak Oil, I just feel for you.


To be honest I don't quite know how to handle the situation just yet. I figure I'll educate myself more on the matter, and try to deduce the problem slowly. I don't want to waste any time though, and since time is something we seem to have very little of right now, I can't help but think that maybe I may make an unknowingly foolish decision that I will regret greatly later.


$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('virgincrude', 'I') just can't help wondering, as I read so many posts from people like you (no money, afraid for the future) when Americans will start migrating. At the moment you're building walls against the Mexicans, who will surely arrive in greater numbers now that Cantarelle is depleting so fast. Here in Europe we have boat loads of Sub Saharan Africans arriving at our shores every day. We used to buy them and ship them ourselves, now they come willingly and pay for the trip in even worse conditions than the slavers. And they work in the same slave conditions. Imagine.

Could it soon be boat loads of WASPs?



I am not sure yet if I want to make plans of moving out of the country. If indeed I feel that sticking it out down here will be possible for me, I may do it. I am looking for the best interest of myself and my partner, though. So if that means leaving, I must...
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby EnergyUnlimited » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 11:03:17

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('rexxz', 'I') think my largest concern, though, isn't really of losing all of these nice little commodities that my life has to offer right now. My biggest, and worst fear is being unable to even survive in a post-peak oil environment. All I want is to retain some degree of stability, nothing more. And of course to do as much as I possibly can to improve the situation as a whole. But right now, I am not having much hope for this.

I fear that because of my financial situation right now(jobless, 18 years old, no credit, no experience, no education) will only make things so much more worse than they can be.


That is a very good starting point.

Because you do NOT own much, than you will NOT lose much either.
One thing less to worry about.

It is imprtant, that you do NOT have any credit capability.
This will only help you, because it will prevent you from incurring debt on yourself (and on your further family).
If you convince your girlfriend not to incurr debt as well, than you have already won big chunk of the game.
However you will realize, that it may be extremely difficult to convince your girlfriend NOT TO go into debt.
Girlfriends are tending to be wasteful and shortsighted, but it is still worth trying...you may succeed...or find another girlfriend.

When PO related mess strike, those in debt will be hit hardest.
Not only their earning capability may be REDUCED quite a lot, but also interest rates will go UP.
Properties prices may also take a tank (due to plenty of properties from repossessions on the market).
A lot of bankruptcies are expected and many peoples will lose EVERYTHING.
Shortly: If you must take a loan, mortgage etc, the amount borrowed should be as low as possible, it MUST be FIXED RATE deal and it MUSTN'T be for consumption but for a reasonable investment only (say SMALL property in promising area, SMALL fuel efficient car etc.).
Depending of state where you will live such loan should be secured or not as bankruptcy law vary from state to state (ask local lawyers, they will help you to decide).
BUT REMEMBER: THE BEST LOAN IS THE ONE YOU DO NOT TAKE.

Job: Military, police and FEMA should do reasonably well and any jobs there would be quite secure.
Energy sector (including nuclear and renevables in particular) will also be seen as critical and much funds from goverment will go there without doubt.
In addition to main job it may be advantage to master any useful craft. This may keep you going for long time (or indefinetely) after a peak.

Best place to live: Small town with STRONG local economy and well organised community. You should live within biking distance from the place, where you work.
Last edited by EnergyUnlimited on Tue 27 Jun 2006, 11:10:34, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby rexxz » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 11:07:41

Thank you for your replies, all of you. EnergyUnlimited, I am considering yours mostly. About the credit thing, I didn't really intendt to mean that I wanted it, but was stating that because I had none, it would be harder for me to perhaps purchase the things that I may need to prepare for this(housing, land, etc.).

Oh, and I have nothing to worry about my girlfriend or myself getting into debt. I am educating her on PO while I educate myself on it, and she is being open minded to ideas and information. I think the worst part though will be finding a place to live that has what you mentioned. I don't know how to measure if a community has a strong local economy and self-relience...
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby Windmills » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 11:49:25

If your girlfriend embraces the idea of Peak Oil, then you've just found a great asset. Having a partner that shares your understanding and vision of the future crises will greatly aid you. If she is with you in this, then you have reason to be more hopeful about your future. The two of you can do more and do better together than either of you could do alone. Right now, Americans lead what they think are very independent lives, apart from their families and friends. I believe we'll all find out just how valuable our families, friends, and communities will become; we'll depend on them for our very survival.
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Re: Getting quite frightened...

Unread postby Sleepybag » Tue 27 Jun 2006, 11:54:37

This may seem contradictionary, but the best jobs in the next decades will be in oil-related businesses. A shortage will result in increased need for workers in exploration, platforms, refineries and alternative fuels. Also, Houston might actually be a good place to get a degree in oil related engineering. So, I would advise you to go to Houston, move in with your girlfriend, and learn about geology, drilling and refining.

Off course, I don't know anything about your schooling level or skills, so if you don't understand anything about high school physics you might consider my advice useless. However, try to understand the problem and then figure out how to be part of the solution.
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