[Kylon]

http://www.iht.com/articles/2006/05/26/business/tax.php

Essentially what this article says, is that the U.S is trying really hard to tax U.S citizens overseas, and punish those who don't comply.

I believe that this will ultimately backfire, and that trying to take money from people scattered throughout the world will be virtually impossible in the future, as the energy required to do so will be intensive.

What do you think?

[EnergyUnlimited]

One, who really does not wont to pay these taxes may always return US passport and problem is solved.

[lutherquick]

Ethics is relative. Truth is relative. Honesty is all relative.
Ask Bush... it depends, it depends on what you can get away with.

Here is an article how IBM is eluding that it should not have a corporate office, that it should make even it's corporate head quarters in the US, a satellite office, remove the concept of head quarters (as if you will pay less taxes, then). In other words, as a true capitalist, as a PNAC republican, businesses (IBM) have the right to evade taxes, this is what IBM is eluding to.

http://news.ft.com/cms/s/aa447f34-f973- ... s01=1.html

So then, a US citizen will follow suit. US citizens will ride the globalization wave and "decentralize", paying taxes only to those that she is obligated to. Obligation is to those governments that offer incentives.

Mikhail Khodorkovsky fvcked the Russian people up the ass by $28 billion, evading taxes, the US government called that "democracy". Tyco does it, and Dennis Kozlowski gets decades in jail.

The new message from the US gov is that you must evade taxes, except for the US tax machine. But the new order behind all this is a message that corruption is "good". Because when Bush lies about wmd or 9/11, that his lies are good. That corruption and message is ordering expatriates to hide their money, launder money as much as possible, and dilute any tax obligations using "transfer pricing".

When peak oil bites harder into the economy it will hammer the dollar. Expatriates will run, and hide their assets. They are being true capitalists, and chances are they will hide their money nearest the bright spots of the global economy, nearest energy.

IBM is running away from it's obligations. Everyone else is going to do the same.

[Kingcoal]

The US income tax system is a strange hodgepodge of sometimes completely unrelated taxes thrown into a pot and stirred. Taxes on incomes of Americans traveling abroad are more of a tariff or duty than anything else. Like tariffs and duties, they are enforced under special maritime law, sometimes called Admiralty law, which is very similar to the code of military justice. In a nutshell, under Admiralty law, you are a soldier and the taxman is your commanding officer, need I say more? Don’t disobey orders…

[MrBill]

Short of giving up your US passport which taxes worldwide income it is very difficult for a US citizen to avoid paying taxes, and due to the Patriot Act, and other anti-money laundering and know your customer account opening procedures, it has made it more difficult to open blind accounts in reputable banks in jurisdictions not sanctioned in one way or another for money laundering.

This does not apply to citizens who are not American if their country of origin does not tax worldwide income. Any good international tax lawyer should be able to give you advice.

For example, it may be possible to incorporate an offshore company, that owns a mutual fund, any and all investments are made through the mutual fund and are taxed at very low, preferential rates. The offshore company withdraws just enough income from the mutual fund, to pay their one and only full-time employee, its owner. The owner would then only be obliged to pay tax on that stipend and not on all profits accrued in the mutual fund. Essentially, you chose if and when you decide to repatriate profits and hopefully many of the costs of running the company are also themselves tax deductible.

Selectively paying taxes, so long as you do not break the law and risk going to jail, is not only legal, but it is ethical. As an individual you have no choice but to pay taxes as demanded of you, but as an individual you have almost no control over how high those taxes are and for what purpose they are used by your elected representatives. And we have often heard the refrain, 'if you don't like it, then leave', although when a country taxes worldwide income it makes that impossible aside from renouncing your citizenship, but you still have to live somewhere.

Do you think I was happy about paying taxes in 'some former communist countries' knowing that corrupt politicians would misappropriate that money and use it to buy Mercedes & BMWs or squirrel it away in a foreign bank account?

Also, if responsible countries implemented fair taxation policies with no loopholes, and no unfair subsidies for businesses, and ran balanced budgets, etc., then there would be no reason to avoid paying taxes. There are countries that understand a lower flat tax is easier to administer, and ends up in more tax revenue, so as 'a free person', why should I not take advantage of that? While I am at it, I will take a second passport just in case!

[parsifal]

TO HELL WITH THE UNITED STATES. TO HELL WITH IT!

[lateStarter]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but I seem to recall last year as I was filing my taxes, I read that only foreign income over 80k is taxable. Am I imagining that? As i only had about $800 in income, it wasn't an issue. I did however have to pay the 10% penalty on the premature withdrawal from my retirement funds. I kept the amount below what my standard decuctions provided, so I wouldn't need to pay any taxes on income. I have already done the same thing this year. I don't plan on leaving anything in my various 'retirement' funds...

[cube]

Remember what happened to the last guy who didn't pay his taxes....what was his name?

Al Capone

Yeah I heard he did hard time. Before anybody here tries to get smart I'd like to point out that the USA has made agreements with practically every other nation regarding income taxes. Unless you renounce your citizenship and move to some country that the USA does not have diplomatic relations like Iran or North Korea you can bet that the USA has made some form of agreement with the host country about how taxes for expatriates should be handled.

BTW renouncing your citizenship to avoid taxes is illegal.

You didn't think you'd get away that easy did you?

[sparkylab]

"BTW renouncing your citizenship to avoid taxes is illegal. "

Could you expand on that please?

Are you simply saying that you are liable to be taxed on income earned up to the point that citizenship is renounced.

Or are you saying that, if Mr. IRS thinks you are trying to avoid paying future taxes, it is an offence....

Please clarify if possible.

[sparkylab]

As a Brit living in the states, contemplating a move to the southern hemisphere, the more I uncover about this the more it makes me want to move. I assume that 'citizen' also means ' legal resident' in this case too.

Its my reading that the US is basically the only country that taxes worldwide income even when you are non-resident. So I'll be living 6,000 miles away, working my little tail off, paying my fair share to the country I'm living in (for the roads and bridges etc that I drive on) - AND over a (depreciating) threshold (- given the dollars slide) Uncle Sam still wants a cut - for what - I mean, is there an 'official' reason why this occurs? I would love to hear their argument.

[Ibon]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('cube', ' ')Before anybody here tries to get smart I'd like to point out that the USA has made agreements with practically every other nation regarding income taxes. Unless you renounce your citizenship and move to some country that the USA does not have diplomatic relations like Iran or North Korea you can bet that the USA has made some form of agreement with the host country about how taxes for expatriates should be handled.

[Kingcoal]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('sparkylab', '"')BTW renouncing your citizenship to avoid taxes is illegal. "

Could you expand on that please?

Are you simply saying that you are liable to be taxed on income earned up to the point that citizenship is renounced.

Or are you saying that, if Mr. IRS thinks you are trying to avoid paying future taxes, it is an offence....

Please clarify if possible.

[sparkylab]

That makes sense about the citizen/oath aspect.

"Of course if you never became a naturalized citizen, you are a resident alien, the US has no jurisdiction over you after you leave the country."

Sweet! (though I think I will check up on that one)

[kam30en]

None of this matters. As soon as TSHTF these expatriates will come home. If not, they will die. Peak oil will turn european nations white again and drive out the minorities in most, if not all nations. God help the one white man stuck in Tapei or the chinese family living in Wyoming.

[Kingcoal]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('sparkylab', 'T')hat makes sense about the citizen/oath aspect.

"Of course if you never became a naturalized citizen, you are a resident alien, the US has no jurisdiction over you after you leave the country."

Sweet! (though I think I will check up on that one)