Pretty funny to see what the average joe thinks about energy efficiency, ethanol and NG.
"Ethanol is certainly part of the answer, conservation, oil sands, and natrual gas might be a part of the rest.
We need more natural gas fleet vehicles as natural gas is American and cheap and abundant."
http://forums.autoweek.com/thread.jspa? ... 8&tstart=0
"canada has enough fossil fuels to fuel the WHOLE WORLD for another 100 years "
http://forums.autoweek.com/thread.jspa? ... 1&tstart=0
PeakOil is You
Energy Discussion On a Car site
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Energy Discussion On a Car site
by Pablo2079 » Thu 25 May 2006, 15:08:50
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by mekrob » Thu 25 May 2006, 15:16:44
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by dub_scratch » Thu 25 May 2006, 15:55:54
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Pablo2079', '
')
"canada has enough fossil fuels to fuel the WHOLE WORLD for another 100 years "
')
"canada has enough fossil fuels to fuel the WHOLE WORLD for another 100 years "
That has to be true because Peter Huber said so and it was on TV.
See for your self: http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=1946708
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by mekrob » Thu 25 May 2006, 18:17:31
And John Stossel! So it must be true!
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by clover » Thu 25 May 2006, 19:07:35
Don't forget that we're sitting on a ton of oil in Alaska that we can't get to because of the enviro-wackos.
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by kam30en » Fri 26 May 2006, 08:10:31
The average joe doesn't realize that energy is everything. And as long as they have the latest toys, they don't care. Dumb, de Dumb, Dumb Dumb.
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by Zardoz » Fri 26 May 2006, 09:45:18
You have to expect car enthusiasts to hold on to the last. They'll be wishing and hoping for nothing to change right to the bitter end, poor schmucks. As a car nut myself, I have to say that I don't blame them for trying to maintain their delusions. I understand.
They won't be able to hold out for very much longer, though. Harsh reality will intrude, and it's going to be very tough on them.
They won't be able to hold out for very much longer, though. Harsh reality will intrude, and it's going to be very tough on them.
"Thank you for attending the oil age. We're going to scrape what we can out of these tar pits in Alberta and then shut down the machines and turn out the lights. Goodnight." - seldom_seen
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by NeoPeasant » Fri 26 May 2006, 10:02:29
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Zardoz', 'Y')ou have to expect car enthusiasts to hold on to the last. They'll be wishing and hoping for nothing to change right to the bitter end, poor schmucks. As a car nut myself, I have to say that I don't blame them for trying to maintain their delusions. I understand.
They won't be able to hold out for very much longer, though. Harsh reality will intrude, and it's going to be very tough on them.
They won't be able to hold out for very much longer, though. Harsh reality will intrude, and it's going to be very tough on them.
I have often had the cruel urge to scribble "google peak oil" on the pages of the hot rod fetish magazines laying around in the break room at work. So far I've resisted.
The battle to preserve our lifestyle has already been lost. The battle to preserve our lives is just beginning.
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by Battle_Scarred_Galactico » Fri 26 May 2006, 10:26:43
I can see it now, "Its' ok, we can sell the kids!"
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by whereagles » Fri 26 May 2006, 10:53:56
I've been trying for sometime now to inform people at a local car forum of what the oil situation is around the world, but the general attitude is..
1. Blame high prices on the oil lobby, and call them thieves.
2. Blame the oil lobby for preventing oil from being replaced with alternatives because the lobby's afraid of losing monopoly and thus profits.
3. Trying to organize demonstrations calling for lower taxes on gasoline (and failing miserably).
4. Claim there's still a lot of oil (doesn't matter that that oil is non-conventional & low eroei), so it's all an oil lobby scam to leech you.
5. Don't even think of using public transportation or bycicles on grounds that "I need my car to do my work."
6. Some people understand what I'm saying and realize there is a problem and want change, but they're overwhelmed in the middle of so much stupidity.
1. Blame high prices on the oil lobby, and call them thieves.
2. Blame the oil lobby for preventing oil from being replaced with alternatives because the lobby's afraid of losing monopoly and thus profits.
3. Trying to organize demonstrations calling for lower taxes on gasoline (and failing miserably).
4. Claim there's still a lot of oil (doesn't matter that that oil is non-conventional & low eroei), so it's all an oil lobby scam to leech you.
5. Don't even think of using public transportation or bycicles on grounds that "I need my car to do my work."
6. Some people understand what I'm saying and realize there is a problem and want change, but they're overwhelmed in the middle of so much stupidity.
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by frankthetank » Fri 26 May 2006, 11:15:36
Thats why i just sit back and smile. When you take some time to listen to what others outside this site think (the vast majority) it only strengthens my belief that we our doomed.
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by Pablo2079 » Fri 26 May 2006, 11:29:31
Frank - I should do the same. I responded letting them know that NG is not plentiful in North America and they responded stating that we're not drilling enough and Katrina was to blame. I was going to respond with the number of wells drilled and depletion rates of new finds, but I thought better of it.
I like cars too.... always have.... I can't even convince my wife there is a shortage of oil (which is why she's driving a new Hemi Charger). Ah well, time to sit back and watch it all happen. Guess I've crossed over entirely to the doomer camp.
I like cars too.... always have.... I can't even convince my wife there is a shortage of oil (which is why she's driving a new Hemi Charger). Ah well, time to sit back and watch it all happen. Guess I've crossed over entirely to the doomer camp.
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by dub_scratch » Fri 26 May 2006, 11:53:21
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Zardoz', 'Y')ou have to expect car enthusiasts to hold on to the last. They'll be wishing and hoping for nothing to change right to the bitter end, poor schmucks. As a car nut myself, I have to say that I don't blame them for trying to maintain their delusions. I understand.
They won't be able to hold out for very much longer, though. Harsh reality will intrude, and it's going to be very tough on them.
They won't be able to hold out for very much longer, though. Harsh reality will intrude, and it's going to be very tough on them.
This will sound a little smug on my part, but I'll say it because it is true: car enthusiast tend to be the most energy stupid people out there. Here is a great article by Kunstler that demonstrates that:
link.
I think auto use distorts the human understanding of energy greatly. And the more you use a car the less you understand about the scale of energy.
Before industrial society, agrarian or pre-agrarian humans straddled the edge in terms of energy. Every bit of surplus would be used to either grow the population or to expand the food gathering capacity further. People did not know what the thermodynamic laws were per-se, but they understood it intuitively. They had too otherwise they were dead. If you were to time transport a F-15 pick-up with a full tank of gasoline into a 15th century agrarian village, they would have used that pickup to plow the fields-- not to have some asshole to zip around town in.
Fast forward to the great industrial age in the US, and we have millions of people who squander loads of energy every day hauling around their mobile living-rooms over vast distances. It is as if the energy supply behind it was free and endless.
The shock and awe-- and the part I am looking forward to-- is when the motoring masses learn the truth about this folly in thinking. That not only are we going to have to give up driving big vehicles, but we are going to have to give up driving and either hitch a ride, take a bike or walk. It's going to be a monstrous fall with a thunderous thud.
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by Zardoz » Fri 26 May 2006, 19:17:07
I wish I could remember who said this, or something to this effect:
"The problem were running into is that hundreds of millions of people have decided that they don't want to ride bicycles anymore."
It refers, of course to all those Chinese and Indians who really, really want to get off their bicycles and get behind the wheel like us Westerners. They want to drive, damnit. They want to have it like we do.
They're going to be bitterly disappointed. It isn't going to happen for them. Just as they get to the point where it's economically feasible for them to get cars of their own, the fuel for them is going to start running short, and their dreams will be squashed.
They aren't going to be happy about it, are they? They'll logically deduce that we Americans are primarily the ones who used up all the oil for our cars before they could get any for theirs. They'll be justifiably resentful about it. I know I would be if I were in their place.
"The problem were running into is that hundreds of millions of people have decided that they don't want to ride bicycles anymore."
It refers, of course to all those Chinese and Indians who really, really want to get off their bicycles and get behind the wheel like us Westerners. They want to drive, damnit. They want to have it like we do.
They're going to be bitterly disappointed. It isn't going to happen for them. Just as they get to the point where it's economically feasible for them to get cars of their own, the fuel for them is going to start running short, and their dreams will be squashed.
They aren't going to be happy about it, are they? They'll logically deduce that we Americans are primarily the ones who used up all the oil for our cars before they could get any for theirs. They'll be justifiably resentful about it. I know I would be if I were in their place.
"Thank you for attending the oil age. We're going to scrape what we can out of these tar pits in Alberta and then shut down the machines and turn out the lights. Goodnight." - seldom_seen
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Re: Energy Discussion On a Car site
by DesertBear2 » Sat 27 May 2006, 03:09:32
$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Zardoz', '
')It refers, of course to all those Chinese and Indians who really, really want to get off their bicycles and get behind the wheel like us Westerners. They want to drive, damnit. They want to have it like we do.
')It refers, of course to all those Chinese and Indians who really, really want to get off their bicycles and get behind the wheel like us Westerners. They want to drive, damnit. They want to have it like we do.
That is truly ironic.
And meanwhile, there are all these Americans who really, really want to get out of their cars and get around on a bicycle like the Chinese. We want to ride bicycles, damnit.
We have been living in Virginia for 10 years now. During this period we have been bitterly lamenting the lack of bike paths in the area.
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