[Doly]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('TonyPrep', '
')You can't delay Peak Oil, it will happen when it happens.

[TonyPrep]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Doly', 'Y')ou obviously can, by stopping to increase production before the peak, and having a long plateau. A very different question is if it's going to happen.

[Rose]

I find this discussion very interesting. I am in the process of reading Crossing the Rucicon and then read the article at Life After the Oil Crash which several of you mention here.

Anyway...while we seem to be in question of when we are going to run out of oil it is apparent that we are going to in the next 10-50 years by postings here.

Well, I save 11% currently on my use of gas with a catalyst that was developed 9+ years ago for curtainling of emissions. Do all of youknow about that? It is not a lot about $3-4 per tank fill-up or $150 a year. That doesn't include the fact that I will be able to change my oil only every 6000 miles instead of 3,000 and lack of wear and tear on my vehicle. That's true conservation. But I am only halfway through my testing and it most likely will go up when I put my next 200 miles on my car. You don't beleive me? Johnny Rutherford thre time Indy 500 winner uses this product. Big deal. Well, it doesn't matter if you just like to talk and don't want simple real implentable tangible and yes temproary solutions NOW. At least I am not contributing to Global Warming and I am not using my gas=oil like those that choose to ignore information that I am sharing-because as many of my freinds say-It's fake or it would be on the market!!! Well I know how to evaluate my gas mileage and I am getting better gas mileage.

I will continue to read these postings....but thought I would throw something a little bit different in the conversation for a refreshing break.

Oh yeah----the website? www.rmarschall.myextremeresearch.com.

Blessings,

[Seadragon]

I can't decide if this person is sincere or is just using the boards to hawk an obvious scam...

[bobcousins]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Seadragon', 'I') can't decide if this person is sincere or is just using the boards to hawk an obvious scam...

[TonyPrep]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Rose', 'A')t least I am not contributing to Global Warming and I am not using my gas=oil like those that choose to ignore information

[Flow]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Taskforce_Unity', 'I') suggest Flow takes a look at my report released today:



http://www.peakoil.nl/images/ponlreport.pdf

[TonyPrep]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Flow', 'T')he Peak Oil Netherlands Foundation as formed in May 2005, so it is a whooping 6-7 months old.

[Flow]

The 50% that I was referencing was from an article I read (and posted I believe) of actual production increases from Canada. Not just a number I pulled out of my ass, but a real number from real life. The article claimed they could probalby go to 60% extraction but said they could get 50%.

Secondly, do you have concrete proof that unconventional oil production will not be produced at the levels of conventional or are you just throwing that out there "in an attempt to look reasonable"? I mean if 3/4 of the oil refineries in the USA can process heavy oil (unconventional) right now, I gotta believe the other 1/4 can be converted (actually I know they can) when they need to be. It is not like there is a lack of heavy oil in the world. The fact of the matter is that Heavy Oil is sold at a discount today (a cost less that of lighter crude) in an attempt to get rid of it too.

What people keep forgetting about the eventual Peak Oil and then decline is that this decline will be GRADUAL. We will not go from max oil output one day to zero the next day. As I have suggested, the projected decline rate once peak oil happens is about 2.5% (current decline is 1.8% on average but I will go with the higher quote) and the average growth will is projected to be about 3% per year. Assuming Peak Oil happens today and we go into decline tomorrow, over the course of the next 20 years, we will only need to produce about 249 billion barrels of oil from unconventional oil and other sources of oil (out of a total of about 730 billion barrels).

A BioDiesel plant can be constructed in about 9-12 months from the first shovel of dirt being moved. The super large coal to oil plants nearing completion in China took a total of 2 year to construct which will replace 60% of their fuel import needs. A thermal conversion process plant can be constructed about 12 months. The list goes on and on. If we needed to divert some of the oil that would have been used to create a new stadium for some sports team or the oil that would have been used for nationwide road constrution projects to get these plants constructed, we would do it.

[TonyPrep]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Flow', 'T')he 50% that I was referencing was from an article I read (and posted I believe) of actual production increases from Canada. Not just a number I pulled out of my ass, but a real number from real life. The article claimed they could probalby go to 60% extraction but said they could get 50%.

[Taskforce_Unity]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Flow', '
')1) The Peak Oil Netherlands Foundation as formed in May 2005, so it is a whooping 6-7 months old. So offical as a title as PONF may sound, it is in reality nothing but another Peak Oil Doomer pushing his/her adjenda.

[oilmangonegreen]

I see a possible flaw in this line of reasoning.

Extraction of oil from increasingly difficult sources such as tar sands and shales, and old wells, will be ever-more energy intensive. As someone has said, using the energy-equivalent of a barrel of oil to extract a barrel of oil is pointless; using the energy equivalent of two barrels of oil to extract a barrel of oil is madness.

At some point the the two sides of the energy equation (used/gained) will balance and that is the point at which further extraction attempts must stop. I've no idea when this might happen, in general terms, but I fear it might be sooner rather than later.

[Tanada]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('oilmangonegreen', 'I') see a possible flaw in this line of reasoning.

Extraction of oil from increasingly difficult sources such as tar sands and shales, and old wells, will be ever-more energy intensive. As someone has said, using the energy-equivalent of a barrel of oil to extract a barrel of oil is pointless; using the energy equivalent of two barrels of oil to extract a barrel of oil is madness.

At some point the the two sides of the energy equation (used/gained) will balance and that is the point at which further extraction attempts must stop. I've no idea when this might happen, in general terms, but I fear it might be sooner rather than later.

[Flow]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('oilmangonegreen', 'I') see a possible flaw in this line of reasoning.

Extraction of oil from increasingly difficult sources such as tar sands and shales, and old wells, will be ever-more energy intensive. As someone has said, using the energy-equivalent of a barrel of oil to extract a barrel of oil is pointless; using the energy equivalent of two barrels of oil to extract a barrel of oil is madness.

At some point the the two sides of the energy equation (used/gained) will balance and that is the point at which further extraction attempts must stop. I've no idea when this might happen, in general terms, but I fear it might be sooner rather than later.

[ashurbanipal]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'T')hat is why you hear so often that to product oil from Tar Sands or Coal requires for conventional oil to sell for around $30 a barrel for some time because it is more expensive to produce. But more expensive is not the same thing as saying more oil used.

[Flow]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('ashurbanipal', 'S')o there's something magical about $30.00 oil that means we'll use less of it to produce the tar sands than if we had used $20.00 oil?

[ashurbanipal]

And what effect do you think paying thrice as much for energy will have on the economy?

[Flow]

Well $30 a barrel is about half of what we have been paying over the past few months and typical of what we have been paying for at least the last 2 years or more. The economy has been improving the entire time during this time so I would have to say - not much really.

[MonteQuest]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Flow', 'W')ell $30 a barrel is about half of what we have been paying over the past few months and typical of what we have been paying for at least the last 2 years or more. The economy has been improving the entire time during this time so I would have to say - not much really.

[Ludi]

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MonteQuest', 'S')o, let me get this straight. As long as you can continue to go into debt to keep the economy going and pay the costs of inflation, everything is hunky-dory?

For how long can this be sustainable?