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Dale Allen Pfeiffer dumps Mike Ruppert!

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General interest discussions, not necessarily related to depletion.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby Sunspot » Fri 14 Oct 2005, 22:46:57

Matt, thanks for your staunch defense of Mike. Nobody has mentioned all the dirty tricks and betrayals he has suffered. It surely sucks to be so damaged by those you put your trust in. This is a big stakes game he's playing - how many of us would be surprised if we heard at any time that Mike Ruppert, well-known "conspiracy theorist", was found dead in his car at the bottom of a ravine outside LA somewhere?
And isn't it more than a little possible that Dale left, in part, to save his own ass? As the heat increases on Ruppert it affects anyone in the organization. And Dale has his own following now (thanks to Mike?) and likely feels he can be more effective on his own. Philosophically, it seems Dale is still hoping we can salvage something here, while Ruppert doubts it more. Myself, I mostly just watch the show...
If I hit the lottery, I'd send Ruppert a million bucks. But I don't play the lottery much... :roll:
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby EnemyCombatant » Fri 14 Oct 2005, 23:43:34

FWIW,
I am a paying subscriber to FTW and I donated an extra $20. And I bought the $6 blueprint for surving peak oil.

Why.

Because we need to support each other. Instead of the cannibalism that is going on here. There are very few people that are trying to become enlightened. We will not all agree, but we still need to support each other. I hate that there is a Jones/Ruppert beef. It's ridiculous. No, Jones doesn't believe in peak oil but he's still one of 'us'. Us being a member of the brotherhood/resistence. I hope Pfeiffer and Ruppert can work things out.
Now why didn't I take the blue pill.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby threadbear » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 00:25:00

What Enemy Combatant said. Also, there is nothing wrong with people like Ruppert trying to make a living from a worthy cause. He should apologize to Pfeiffer for taking credit for his material, though. Then they should try to get their professional relationship back on track, if they can.

Many of the original movers and shakers in any movement are profoundly prickly and eccentric personalities, which is too bad, as it acts as a kind of braking mechanism for all of their good efforts. Some of these eccentrics are completely barking mad, but curiously adept in their area of study. Maybe Ruppert is in this category--he may even be a wavie. (Someone who has been targeted with elf radiation--that could make you cranky.)

As far as Pfieffer not agreeing with Ruppert's premise that we should work to save ourselves, as the Titantic is sinking, that is Mike's opinion. I think anyone with the curiosity and independance of mind to read the site can form their own.

Ruppert has performed a valuable service. If he's gone off the deep end, should he be rejected? If this is true, he needs help more than he did before, not less. Compassion for Dale and Mike, both.

The line between genius and madness is very thin.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby MattSavinar » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 01:04:16

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mgibbons19', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mgibbons19', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', '.')...
I guess it's okay for George Clooney to get paid millions to get in front of a camera but it's not okay for Mike Ruppert (or whoever) to get paid thousands to do likewise?

Best,

Matt


Yeah but. You didn't just compare Mike Ruppert to George Clooney did you? Thousands of newly started actors, directors, producers, and so on are schlepping tables to make a living, no matter how good their work is. If you are a new or marginal creative of any sort, you have to create cheap and or free until you get the name recognition.


I don't think you're getting it. I said George is getting paid millions. Mike will make a few thousands. George is an actor. Mike is a journalist who's put his life on the line to report what he has.

Mike is not a "newly started" journalist. As his site states, it has more original reporting on Peak Oil than any other site on the internet.

FTW was running Peak Oil articles in Fall 2001. That's a year and a half before The Party's Over came out. Two and half before End of Suburbia or LATOC or Peak OIl.com came online. Four years before the NY Times covered it (and they didn't even do that great of a job).

This forum would not exist if it weren't for Mike. Aaron learned Peak Oil from my site and I learned about it from Mike.

You can kiss Mike's ass.

Best,

Matt


Yeah I get it. you missed my point. I'm not trying to be hostile. .


Not trying to be hostile? Dude, this is the internet. If you didn't come here to be hostile, get the f--k off the board already.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby Armageddon » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 01:19:02

i learned about PO from rupport on the rense show. i read crossing the rubicon next, and i am a firm believer in the 911 conspiracy plot by the u.s. I am 100 % certain the u.s is in iraq because of oil. The americans needed a reason to support the war, and 911 was the pretext for it. Its totally obvious. I will always thank rupport for educating me on PO. Matt Savinar was next , then richard heinberg was after matt. Then along came simmons , then the suberbia dvd. i feel im very well educated now, and will always appreciate rupport. Im not sure why rense switched sides on the matter, but i think alex jones brain washed him and is the reason.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby MattSavinar » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 01:31:07

Everybody consider the following:

I found out about PO from Mike.

No FTW = No LATOC

Aaron found out about Peak Oil from my site.

No FTW = No LATOC = No PeakOil.com

I remember at least one of the main folks (if not 2 or 3) at The Oil Drum finding out from LATOC. I think it was Ianqi and Prof G., but can't remember for sure.

No FTW = No LATOC = No TheOilDrum.com

James at Powerswitch.org.uk found out about PO from LATOC.

No FTW = No LATOC = No Powerswitch.org.uk

Even if End of Suburbia had been made, do you really think it would have been so widespread if FTW, LATOC, PO.com, TOD, Powerswitch, etc. hadn't been kicking so muh butt? My guess is it would have done well, but not had the outstanding success it has had.

No FTW = No LATOC = No PeakOil.com = Much less success for EOS

I could go on and on, but I think you get the point. So if you check FTW, LATOC, PO.com, Powerswitch, TOD, or was introduced to this stuff by first seeing EOS, you owe Mike some gratitude.

Even the debunkers wouldn't have anything to "debunk" if it wasn't for Mike.

Best,

Matt
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby Armageddon » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 01:47:20

i agree. michael is a PO pioneer. Love him or hate him, he should be respected regardless. michael, my check is in the mail, just keep up the good work.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby SupplyConcerns » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 02:38:56

I donated. Because Mike truly seems to be a remarkably hard-working man, and he's going down the right avenues. He deserves to not be broke on top of that.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby killJOY » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 08:05:56

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')o FTW = No LATOC

Aaron found out about Peak Oil from my site.

No FTW = No LATOC = No PeakOil.com

I remember at least one of the main folks (if not 2 or 3) at The Oil Drum finding out from LATOC. I think it was Ianqi and Prof G., but can't remember for sure.

No FTW = No LATOC = No TheOilDrum.com

James at Powerswitch.org.uk found out about PO from LATOC.

No FTW = No LATOC = No Powerswitch.org.uk


Well, not actually.

There was dieoff.com, which is the first site I found.

And it's fair to say if neither FTW nor LATOC existed, there would have been others springing up.

Not to take away from these efforts, only to say they would have arisen anyway.
Peak oil = comet Kohoutek.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby mgibbons19 » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 10:05:28

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mgibbons19', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('mgibbons19', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', '.')...
I guess it's okay for George Clooney to get paid millions to get in front of a camera but it's not okay for Mike Ruppert (or whoever) to get paid thousands to do likewise?

Best,

Matt


Yeah but. You didn't just compare Mike Ruppert to George Clooney did you? Thousands of newly started actors, directors, producers, and so on are schlepping tables to make a living, no matter how good their work is. If you are a new or marginal creative of any sort, you have to create cheap and or free until you get the name recognition.


I don't think you're getting it. I said George is getting paid millions. Mike will make a few thousands. George is an actor. Mike is a journalist who's put his life on the line to report what he has.

Mike is not a "newly started" journalist. As his site states, it has more original reporting on Peak Oil than any other site on the internet.

FTW was running Peak Oil articles in Fall 2001. That's a year and a half before The Party's Over came out. Two and half before End of Suburbia or LATOC or Peak OIl.com came online. Four years before the NY Times covered it (and they didn't even do that great of a job).

This forum would not exist if it weren't for Mike. Aaron learned Peak Oil from my site and I learned about it from Mike.

You can kiss Mike's ass.

Best,

Matt


Yeah I get it. you missed my point. I'm not trying to be hostile. .


Not trying to be hostile? Dude, this is the internet. If you didn't come here to be hostile, get the f--k off the board already.

Allright then.

Kiss my ass you sorry motherfucker.

:-D

How's that?

Ruppert's just one guy, and from here, he looks like he's a little off. Should I send him money because he thinks the world is out to get him?

No.

If I like what he has to say, or think he is as cute as clooney, then I'll send him money.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby EnemyCombatant » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 10:16:04

You think Clooney is cute.

Girl you just don't know a hunk when you see one do you.

Image
Now why didn't I take the blue pill.
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby Aaron » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 10:45:11

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'E')verybody consider the following:

I found out about PO from Mike.

No FTW = No LATOC

Aaron found out about Peak Oil from my site.

No FTW = No LATOC = No PeakOil.com


That's right...

Although technically I learned that midpoint may be immanent from Matt... the idea of midpoint I studied in 1979 for my first time...

Ruppert is in a economic bind as it were.

It's the challenge of most edge-cutters... from preachers to politicians. Commercializing ideas is always difficult. I don't care for the mixed-message presentation approach myself, like attempting to cover NWO, 911 & oil depletion in a single breath for example... regardless of the validity of any of these.

There may well be some ultra secret group pulling the strings behind the curtain.

911 may well have been part of a conspiracy.

I have no idea...

But as Matt & others have repeatedly pointed out, mother nature seems poised to make these other "ideas" small by comparison.

That said, at this point, any person or group that educates about depletion issues gets my vote... even if I disagree on the approach.

I do however have enormous respect for Dale, and when he says Mike's a pretender... well... I'm inclined to believe him.

That's all just window dressing in my opinion though.

What Matt & Dale & Mike & Simmons & myself do agree on is the potential for global conflict.

Game/Match & Set
The problem is, of course, that not only is economics bankrupt, but it has always been nothing more than politics in disguise... economics is a form of brain damage.

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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby bobcousins » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 10:48:58

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', 'E')verybody consider the following:

I found out about PO from Mike.

No FTW = No LATOC


I wonder, where did Mr Ruppert find out about PO from?

It is a tough world, it's not enough to be smart or hard working to be successful, you just have to be good looking like Mr Clooney. Perhaps if we can get Mr Clooney interested in PO?
It's all downhill from here
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby bobcousins » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 12:58:03

Having done some research (i.e reading what they actually said rather than 3rd hand reports), it is easy to see why Pfeiffer and Ruppert have split. Dr Pfeiffer is sane, Mr Ruppert is a kook. Pfeiffer finally realised no good comes of associating with the deranged.

Even from Rupperts side of the story, he shows some very strange behaviour. I thought he was supposed to be a former star LAPD officer? He shows poor judgement with his relations with people, the law, finance... Withholding a pay check and stalkng an ex-employee is not normal at the best of times, and if he knows people are "out to get him", why open himself to legal action he can ill afford?

This pattern of behaviour is very familiar, as I had the misfortune to be employed by a similarly paranoid psychotic. He eventually fell out with everyone he came into contact with. He would make strange unprofessional comments and requests. In business, once people realise they are dealing with a kook, they don't cut them any slack, and are more likely to nod their head and take the money. Of course, when things go sour this reinforces the kooks paranoia that everyone is trying to destroy him. Conversely, he was good at charming the unwary and persuading them to invest in him.

Ruppert may have been the first to become obsessed with PO, but he is still a kook. Perhaps it takes a kook to become obsessed with an unpopular topic.
It's all downhill from here
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby MattSavinar » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 12:58:18

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('killJOY', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'N')o FTW = No LATOC

Aaron found out about Peak Oil from my site.

No FTW = No LATOC = No PeakOil.com

I remember at least one of the main folks (if not 2 or 3) at The Oil Drum finding out from LATOC. I think it was Ianqi and Prof G., but can't remember for sure.

No FTW = No LATOC = No TheOilDrum.com

James at Powerswitch.org.uk found out about PO from LATOC.

No FTW = No LATOC = No Powerswitch.org.uk


Well, not actually.

There was dieoff.com, which is the first site I found.

And it's fair to say if neither FTW nor LATOC existed, there would have been others springing up.

Not to take away from these efforts, only to say they would have arisen anyway.


You really think there is another Mike Ruppert out there? If there was, I think he/she would be out there and we could point to them.

Jay Hanson is the OG of the online peak oil movement. "The man." "Big Daddy."

However, dieoff.com is written in way that the average person cannot comprehend. IE, they have to read stuff that might make their brain hurt a little bit. I did with LATOC what an attorney does with expert testimony: make it easy to understand for the average layman (dumbass) to understand.

In truth, there is little if anything on my site, that is "new" compared to what Jay wrote. But the average person needs their hand held through this stuff.

I probably never would have gotten to dieoff if it hadn't been for Mike. So in my of the world:

No FTW = No discovery of Dieoff.com for yours truly = No LATOC = No Peak Oil.com, etc. . .

(BTW, Jay H. deserves tons of credit. He's still the only person, so far as I know, to discuss the "thermo-gene collission." Everybody talks about the energy and thermodynamics of our situation. But few talk about the genetic aspects.

Best,

Matt
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby MattSavinar » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 12:59:41

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('bobcousins', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('MattSavinar', 'E')verybody consider the following:

I found out about PO from Mike.

No FTW = No LATOC


I wonder, where did Mr Ruppert find out about PO from?

It is a tough world, it's not enough to be smart or hard working to be successful, you just have to be good looking like Mr Clooney. Perhaps if we can get Mr Clooney interested in PO?


I don't know for sure, but I think it might have been Jay Hanson.

Richard Heinberg got introduced to it by Jay's stuff.

Best,

Matt
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby MattSavinar » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 13:10:13

$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('Aaron', '')$this->bbcode_second_pass_quote('', 'E')verybody consider the following:

I found out about PO from Mike.

No FTW = No LATOC

Aaron found out about Peak Oil from my site.

No FTW = No LATOC = No PeakOil.com


That's right...

Although technically I learned that midpoint may be immanent from Matt... the idea of midpoint I studied in 1979 for my first time...

Ruppert is in a economic bind as it were.

It's the challenge of most edge-cutters... from preachers to politicians. Commercializing ideas is always difficult. I don't care for the mixed-message presentation approach myself, like attempting to cover NWO, 911 & oil depletion in a single breath for example... regardless of the validity of any of these.

There may well be some ultra secret group pulling the strings behind the curtain.

911 may well have been part of a conspiracy.

I have no idea...

But as Matt & others have repeatedly pointed out, mother nature seems poised to make these other "ideas" small by comparison.

That said, at this point, any person or group that educates about depletion issues gets my vote... even if I disagree on the approach.

I do however have enormous respect for Dale, and when he says Mike's a pretender... well... I'm inclined to believe him.

That's all just window dressing in my opinion though.

What Matt & Dale & Mike & Simmons & myself do agree on is the potential for global conflict.

Game/Match & Set


Everybody knows Mike and I are friends/colleagues. I'm also friends with his fiance, who lives here in Santa Rosa and goes to New College where Richard Heinberg teaches it.

I understand not everbody has the same "warm fuzzies" for Mike that I do. (Nobody read anything gay into that, kay?)

But fuck, not everybody had the warm fuzzies for Dr. Hubbert either. He had a reputation of being kind of an asshole. Walter Youngquist said to me, in essence, "he was a hardass, but he was our hardass." (Something along those lines.)

So say what you will about Mike, but in the end, I feel he's earned some slack from folks, even those of you who have less than favorable opinions about him.

Aaron: yeah, I should have been more clear. I know you and Monte had known about this stuff for a long time, but you know what I mean: you didn't get Peak Oil Bitchslapped until you came across my site.

Not trying to take more credit here than I deserve, just trying to make a point about the "downstream" effects of FTW: LATOC, PO.com, Powerswitch.org.uk, TheOilDrum.com, and probably several others would not have come about in their current incarnations, if at all, had it not been for FTW.

Best,

Matt
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby MattSavinar » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 13:14:38

quick somebody snap up the domain "http://www.peakoilbitchslapped.com

That was pretty good, if I may say so myself.

BEst,

Matt
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Re: Dale dumps Mike!

Postby threadbear » Sat 15 Oct 2005, 13:27:59

M.Gibbons----Maybe Ruppert thinks the world is out to get him, and in some instances he's likely correct and in other cases he isn't. He probably has to take a good hard look at his interactions with others and try to discern why so many people are getting so hostile. The sense I get, is that most people really want to like him, but don't enjoy displays of out of control ego. He's got a lot of soul searching to do, imho. Still, he and Dale and other staff at FTW have produced a site that represents the very best the internet has to offer.

And while we're at it, forchrissake--as Enemy Combatant suggested--Could Ruppert and Alex Jones PLEASE PLEASE bury the hatchet?
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